Things In Moderation

ThailandTom

My girlfriend was talking to me last night and she came out with something a little insightful. She said that things like coffee, chocolate, beer, you know things most of us consume on a regular basis are in fact bad for us. They are drugs (I do not like it when people hear/read the word drug and instantly think of heroin, that is ignorant), but caffeine is a drug, chocolate is addictive and so on. But we both though that in moderation these things actually are healthy in a lot of cases. A glass of wine a day is meant to be good for, taking about 250mgs of paracetomol daily is so say good for your heart as it things the blood, and I don't know for sure about beer but I think I read somewhere that a small amount daily has it's health benefits.

What are your ideas and knowledge about this type of topic?

federica

everything in Moderation.

Including Moderation.

find a middle ground, then find the middle ground of that.

My father always said, ....'a little left on your plate shows the host they have been more than generous, and teaches you moderation.'
Can't argue with that particular one.....

ThailandTom

You cannot argue with that no, a good saying. The middle did emphasize a lot on the middle way, I have come to realize this with many aspects of life over a period of time, slow but surely. However I was also wobdering about the vadility of the notion that say a small amount of beer daily or wine is actually a healthy thing to do.

federica

"A little of what you fancy does you good..."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1346765/Drinking-pint-beer-day-GOOD-say-researchers.html

andyrobyn

There is just as much evidence that no alcohol is as good for the heart as one glass per day, according to the an article I read at uni recently ... I will try and find a link if anyone wants it. I am not sure how 250mg Paracetamol daily is good for the heart - 100mg enteric coated aspirin is often prescribed as a blood thinning preventative drug - all recent medical advice I have come across in Asutralia recommends not to self prescribe aspirin though as the potential risks of doing so, unprescribed, outweigh the potential benefits greatly.

ThailandTom

There is just as much evidence that no alcohol is as good for the heart as one glass per day, according to the an article I read at uni recently ... I will try and find a link if anyone wants it. I am not sure how 250mg Paracetamol daily is good for the heart - 100mg enteric coated aspirin is often prescribed as a blood thinning preventative drug - all recent medical advice I have come across in Asutralia recommends not to self prescribe aspirin though as the potential risks of doing so, unprescribed, outweigh the potential benefits greatly.

I saw it on a news channel about a years ago with regards to the paracetomol, the doctor suggested that a small dose, in his words a 'baby doses', basically for children sized dose. He did not mention how many mgs, so I assumed that say half a dose which is about 250mgs would be what he was refering to. It is meant to help to decrease the percentage of getting heart disease.

I would like to read that article if you could find it @andyrobyn. Thanks for the post and also federica for your link :thumbsup:

twobitbob

The jury is still out on the benefits, if any, of alcohol. But surely regardless of any physical health benefits/problems, there was a very good reason for the fifth precept? And i assume it extends to any mind altering substances?

The daily mail is perhaps the worst source for scientific information imaginable; Sesame street would be preferable. I'm sure ThailandTom meant aspirin.

ThailandTom

Yes I meant paracetomol, well that is what we mainly call it in the UK. Here it is para in Thailand and I guess the US asprin..? I understand that the 5th precept is their for a reason and I am aware of the reason, I was just cruious to know the facts about these substances such as paracetomol, alcohol, and coffee dosed in small amounts regularly can actually have health benefits.

federica

Paracetamol and aspirin are two different things.
Aspirin is derived from willow bark, paracetamol is chemical.

Aspirin raises your pain threshold, paracetamol does too.
Aspirin reduces fever, paracetamol does too.
Aspirin reduces inflammation, paracetamol doesn't.
Aspirin affects the 'stickiness' of platelets, paracetamol doesn't.

@twobitbob, just for you - and away from the daily mail....:)

http://www.forbes.com/2008/03/14/beer-drink-health-forbeslife-cx_avd_0317health.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/727912.stm

ThailandTom

Thanks a lot federica, I did not know that about the platelets, did you know that or was it a google job lol :P So asprin and paracetomol are different, learn something new every day

federica

i actually knew that, because my father was prescribe a quarter does of aspirin daily for his heart condition - i take aspiring in the form of alka selzer daily, for three reasons:
My heart, (it may e congenital) my cramp (the bicarb helps allay the cramp) and I'm prone to cystitis... bicarb also helps that.... I would add, it's with my doc' s approval and recommendation.
don't try this at home without consultation....

twobitbob

Not heard of the paracetamol one before. I can't imagine how it would reduce cardiovascular risk, but you never know. It's certainly not mainstream advice though.

Thanks federica. There are a few problems with alcohol. A J shaped response is seen: that is at abstinence there is a slight cardiovascular risk, the risk lessens with moderate alcohol intake, then increases as intake increases - so that the curve is roughly J shaped. One problem is that the people who abstain include a good number of abstaining alcoholics, who have already done damage to their cardiovascular system and so are 'messing up' the data set. This problem hasn't been addressed yet, as far as i know (but i don't know very far).

Plus, all this talk is around cardiovascular health. When it comes to cancer we do not know if there is a bottom limit to what is deemed safe - but it looks like there isn't one. So even small amounts of alcohol would increase risk slightly. I don't think other kinds of health have been explored too much.

Tosh

I think asprin, not paracetamol, has some benefits for the cardiovascular system, but there will be debate about this. I think asprin thins the blood.

federica

yup, it does....
But it's important to let people know you're taking aspirin and why, in case of an accident/blood loss..... if your blood is thinned, it's harder to stop blood flow, and its coagulative property is decreased

Telly03

And studies are now showing that daily aspirin can also cut cancer death rate by 37%, preventing developing and stopping the spreading . I think this tips the pro/con scale for many people.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2117906/Aspirin-Daily-dose-cuts-cancer-death-risk-37.html

Dakini

@ThailandTom Chocolate has both caffeine and sugar in it, so it's a two-fer. Sugar is definitely a drug (did you see Leon's thread where he was trying to quit sugar, and his body was screaming out for it, after he'd quit cold turkey for a few days?) I think the food industry knows this, so they keep adding sugar to different foods, sneaking it in, in some cases, or increasing the amount in the case of packaged cookies, etc. Our sweets have gotten sweeter over the decades.

Beer: all alcohol is a form of sugar.

Chocolate that's 85% cacao or more can be used as a headache remedy, due to the high caffeine content. My doctor told me that. I tried it, and she's right.

ThailandTom

Maybe I was not listening properly to the doctor, it may have been asprin that he suggested to take daily tiny doses as it will help to prevent heart disease. I knew that thinning the blood is a negative thing in some caes, as federica pointed out, but there are downsides to pretty much every medicine or drug out there.

The cancer reduction statistic is interesting, I am sure there are many benefits from things we consume daily and take for granted, we just have not delved into them enough.

@Dakini yea I read the thread about sugar. I read most threads, but if I feel I have nothing to add to the discussion I merely read Adding sugars to foods comes from greed obviously, and when one company starts doing it, they all will. Unless there are sanctions or something of that nature, it will continue.

Also chocolate for headaches, that is a new one to me. That reminds me, I read on the BBC news website not long ago that there was a study conducted on a vareity of people. They found that people who ate small amounts of chocolate on a regular basis (not every single day, but regularly), were in better shape on average than those who did not eat chocolate or ate it very rarely.

Dakini

The aspirin to prevent heart disease strategy has fallen in disfavor the last few years. It can cause or exacerbate ulcers, and it turns out it doesn't really do much, except for patients who already have a heart condition.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/8338763.stm

I would think that taking a fish oil capsule daily would do a lot more for the cardio system than taking aspirin.

vinlyn

^^ My cardiologist disagrees with that completely.

Dakini

You already have a heart condition. So you're in a different class than the general public, and get different recommendations.

Lady_Alison

everything in Moderation.

Including Moderation.

find a middle ground, then find the middle ground of that.

My father always said, ....'a little left on your plate shows the host they have been more than generous, and teaches you moderation.'
Can't argue with that particular one.....

Is this a French thing? Lol, I was told to lick the plate clean and put it back in the cupboards. d:

Lady_Alison

Tom, you're too young to be on an aspirin regiment.

My husband does the 1aspirin a day with food...with food is important. You don't want to burn a hole in your stomach.

When I was misdiagnosed with migraines as a teen, I was told to abstain from chocolate and coffee...because it could trigger it.

A 6oz-8oz cup of coffee is the recommendation with an ounce of chocolate or 200calories of dark chocolate is recommended.

ThailandTom

Well I am aware that pills of any sort can damage the stomach lining right? Well I take pills daily anyway so I guess half an asprin won't do much more than I already am doing. But then again, as it hs been posted, you can get natural benefits in the cardio department from certain foods. By the way, this is going to create some replies I know hehe, but I heard the idea about taking apsrin daily from a doctor on fox news That was when I was in a guest house and that was the only US news channel, I found it rather ammusing at times.