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George Zimmerman Not Guilty!!
DaltheJigsaw
Mountain View Veteran
Comments
And that law still has not and will not be changed as long as the current Republican party grips the reigns of power.
Florida is a beautiful state but is really messed up in a lot of ways. I'm not really upset that Zimmerman didn't go to prison because I hate to see anyway sentenced and it does seem that he really regrets his actions. This will really highlight the need for gun control but it's a shame that someone had to die to reach this point.
1. The prosecution team is either borderline incompetent and/or they pretty much threw this case (by putting forth very little argument or effort against the defense's WEAK and circumstantial case) -- because of their own bias and prejudices.
2. This crime, AND the trial, took place in a very white town, a very conservative/republican town, (a pro carry & conceal town), and a town heavily invested in that status quo.
WHY didn't the prosecution insist on a change of venue? WHY did the prosecution go along with only 6 jurors and all of them women? WHY did they go along with no black people on the jury?
SEE number 1 for answers to these WHYs....
3. This is what can happen with mandatory sentencing and taking away ANY judge's ability to use discretion. I feel very strongly that if the manslaughter charge carried a sentence of say -- 1 to 10 years -- and the judge would have the option to sentence according to HIS or HER discretion, Zimmerman would have been found guilty and the judge would have given him 1-2 years. I think the whole 10-30 yrs mandatory for manslaughter made the jury too hesitant to admit Zimmerman committed manslaughter.
I don't know about you all, but I was both absolutely stunned and disgusted by the smiles and gleeful expressions shown not by the defense team (that's to be expected) but by the JUDGE as she read the verdict!! What was THAT about? She could barely contain herself....
And then afterwards, at the press conference, that woman (I didn't catch who she was -- District attorney? The short dark haired lady with the tons of garish make-up wearing a black dress and standing with the prosecution team...) She was reviewing points and answering questions from the press and she was also smiling, and grinning, and looking very very pleased with .... what? Her LOSING prosecution team??
I found the whole attitude of these people unprofessional and downright disturbing.
What I wanted to ask is: how should we (as human beings in general, not so much as Buddhists with a label) respond to the media sensationalism, verdict, and other hot topic issues in such a case? It's hard not to have an opinion on the matter, especially when so many people seem divided in their stance right now and views on the matter.
I feel bad for Trayvon and his family. I also feel bad for G.Z. and his family. It's a simple case of what fear and anger does to a person (and by "a person" I'm referring to both parties, because both reacted out of anger and fear in some manner, although it is obvious that G.Z. went beyond stupid with his reaction and is at fault, obviously.... There is just no excuse for stalking someone you have no business following, then killing them on top of that.). And now so many people in the country are operating out of fear and anger with their thinking and actions. It's like a disease just spreading like wildfire.
There are so many people who are murdered each day, whether that murder/killing is out of anger, fear, spite, self-defense, or passion. The fact that the media hand-picked this one due to some of its "factors" (*cough*) and turned it into a 3-ring circus is downright despicable. They are fanning the flames of those who are emotionally invested in this case and that is a crime in and of itself. It's bad enough this child was murdered, but now we have to take his death and turn it into something even uglier, which will only breed more fear, anger, and hate. "Trial by media" should be considered a criminal offense.
How is this topic any more gossip or idle chatter than when we talk about the monks in Myanmar who are misbehaving and so on? That is far more gossip if you ask me than this is (since we know this to be true and we don't really know what goes on in Myanmar). Half of what is posted here is idle chatter. We are free as individuals to not even click on the link to read that which we find pointless.
Stay tuned. It's probably not over yet.
On the other hand, this case sets an interesting precedent. Theoretically, the "self-defense" defense would work for anyone, not just white people shooting black people, but the other way around. Anyone can now claim self-defense and fear for their life, and get off. Could get interesting.
Mary Anne raised an interesting question. Why only 6 jurors? I didn't follow the thing at all, except a little bit online. How could anything less than 9 jurors be acceptable? :scratch:
Regarding the number of jurors, here's a good, but brief explanations of why: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57590779-504083/george-zimmerman-trial-why-are-only-six-jurors-weighing-murder-suspects-fate/
But interestingly, why usually 12 jurors? Because a Scottish king decided on jury size decided it was the right thing to do because there were 12 apostles. Hmmmmmmmmmmm.
Obama took the state, but I'm sure there was still voter suppression. After the 1st Obama election, Congress determined that he'd lost 7 million votes due to voter suppression. He only won because he had lots of campaign money to blanket key states and swing states with offices. He had 3 or 4 times the number of campaign offices in my state as Kerry had had. And we know Kerry got cheated out of entire communities' votes due to "faulty" (or rigged) voting machines, as proven in federal court.
As far as voter suppression, I'm not arguing that it doesn't occur in Florida, I'm just pointing out that Florida is a swing state.
I also do think we need to have a balanced viewpoint on voter suppression. Republicans want to suppress the votes of minorities. No question about it, and it's wrong. And Democrats (of which I am one) are salivating over having more Latino voters through a change in immigration laws, because most Latino voters vote Democrat. And in terms of voter suppression, both parties have used it over American history as they jerrymandered voting districts after each census. I think what we view as more serious in the current GOP strategy of voter suppression is that it's based on race.
For many years, the Constitution was interpreted as guaranteeing a trial by a 12-member jury. However, in Williams v. Florida, a Supreme Court ruling in 1970, it was decided that at least six persons is "large enough to promote group deliberation, free from outside intimidation, and to provide a fair possibility for obtaining a cross-section of the community."
It was also noted in the ruling that there is "no discernible difference between the results reached by the two different-sized juries." However, in Ballew v. Georgia, the Supreme Court ruled in 1978 that reducing the number of jurors below six created a "substantial threat" to the sixth amendment.
Zimmerman's trial follows Florida statute 913.10 which says "twelve persons shall constitute a jury to try all capital cases, and six persons shall constitute a jury to try all other criminal cases." What is a "capital case"? One in which capital punishment is a possibility, or one in which someone was killed?
Was six enough in this case to "provide a fair possibility for obtaining a cross-section of the community"? Maybe not, if there were no black jurors.
Why was less than 12 even raised as an option, and how was 6 (vs. 8 or 9, say) arrived at? Because it was the minimum the law allowed? Who pushed for adhering to the minimum, and why? Was there extreme difficulty finding unbiased jurors?
But if you stop and think about mere odds, a 6 member jury was -- mathematically -- more likely to convict Zimmerman than a 13 member jury.
He, and probably his immediate family, are at risk for their safety and even their lives. Don Lemon described him today as "the most hated man in America today", and there have been scores of threats against his life on social media.
He may be broke.
He almost certainly cannot work in law enforcement, which was his hope. Potential career gone.
It was suggested on CNN today that he and his family will almost certainly have to leave Florida...and perhaps even leave the country and go to Peru.
Seems to me that karma works, even if not through the court system!
Yes, a capital case would be a case where the death penalty/capital punishment is present. Why they chose the size of 6, I don't know. But because of the smaller size, a unanimous decision is required, whereas in other states that have 12 member juries for non-capital offenses, it doesn't always have to be unanimous. It can be decided in a 10-2 vote, for example. The constitution does not allow for jury size.
However, I will never understand why a defense attorney will accept a "jury of his peers" when not one of them was the same race. Ideally, race doesn't matter, however we all know it does, and the justice knows it does, too.
As a white person, this really was an eyeopener and I am so deeply saddened by it. Imo, the Stand Your Ground laws might as well give the a-ok to every bigot wanting to employ racial profiling. Oh, and while you're at it, go ahead and just pursue them and kill them based on the limited information you gathered out of prejudice.
Disgusting.
Stand your ground laws might work if handguns were illegal, like here in Canada.
Here, if you kill a burglar with a handgun, you are probably going to jail.
One interesting thing to happen as a result of this case is to shed light on another woman who attempted to use the Stand Your Ground law. Except, in her case, she fired warning shots at her abusive ex-husband... not even injuring him... and was sentenced to 20 years in prison. She even had previously filed a protective order against him. Of course, she was a black woman... so.... (Read about it here.)
@vinlyn I know what you mean. I too want justice, and more than that, I want to send a message that this type of behavior should not be tolerated. It's unfortunate that our justice system failed here. I had the thought that I wasn't sure which would be more dangerous for Zimmerman... to be convicted and in jail or to be found not guilty. Honestly, I think in jail he'd either be put in solitary for his own protection or find a home with some bigoted gang members who would have his back. Out here in freedom... anything could happen and he just made a whole lot of enemies...
Zimmerman lawyer to move ‘asap’ against NBC News
By Erik Wemple, Published: July 14, Washington Post
Last night’s not-guilty verdict in the George Zimmerman trial will enable the neighborhood-watch volunteer to resume his case against NBC News for the mis-editing of his widely distributed call to police. Back in December, Zimmerman sued NBC Universal Media for defamation over the botched editing, which depicted him as a hardened racial profiler.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/27/loud-music-leads-to-murder_n_2200708.html
it just makes my whole country look like a joke.
So the president can just do whatever he wants because hes the president?
And every body supports this opinion
Millions of guys jailed (and lives ruined) for minor drug offences is a greater injustice.
Even Africans - and by that I mean from the continent of Africa - can be very light or 'white' skinned as well as very dark. Long, LONG gone are the days when everyone was pretty much "color coded" according to ancestral origination.... like hundreds of years gone.
I think Zimmerman being Hispanic doesn't mean a thing as far as his (possibly) being racist or not.... ANYONE from any background can hold bigotry and racism in their heart - it's not always black vs white or the other way around.
I believe Zimmerman DID profile Trayvon Martin for no other reason than being young and being black in "his neighborhood". He may not have started off the night thinking "I think I'll go out and shoot any black people I see walking around..." But I do believe he was operating with a bigotry and bias behind that gun and his wanna-be COP bravado.
By the way, Zimmerman attended law enforcement classes etc and for whatever reason (I can't recall now) he either flunked out of the police academy or he was actually rejected for some reason.... He was NEVER going to be a cop, that is the reality of G. Zimmerman's sad life way before Trayvon walked passed him. So this situation / case did not 'ruin his life' as far as career goes.
I guess the real problem is, this law is so blatently bad that it obviously ends in injustice because it plays on people's bias.
Obama had absolutely nothing to do with this case (eventually) being tried.
Public outcry and the huge media coverage (ratings grabbing) that accompanies any sort of public outrage is what got this case before a judge and jury.
To blame Obama is.... beyond ridiculous.
The fact that Zimmerman shot and killed an innocent person, a minor, (no matter what freakin' color he was, although to deny that plays a role in this is fantasy thinking, but whatever- ) and then Zimmerman sashays into the police station, gives some questionable version of what happened, BEING TAKEN COMPLETELY AT HIS WORD, WITH NO FURTHER INVESTIGATION, NOR ANY FORENSIC EVIDENCE BEING GATHERED AT THE SCENE for checking his story, then allowed to walk out of there and head home two hours after shooting someone dead was the original public outrage.
Zimmerman wasn't even charged with ANY crime for WEEKS afterwards. If there had been no public outrage, he would have been back out on those streets playing cop again in no time, with absolutely NO consequences for his actions.
A kid was shot dead! How can that be ignored? Easy... by biased law enforcement in a small, racist, southern town, like Sanford FL, where most of the citizens don't really care about black kids getting shot.
O.J was also found not guilty in criminal court, but was found guilty in CIVIL court when sued by Nicole Brown's parents and the parents of the other victim. (forgive me, I can't recall his name), for "wrongful death".
As for federal charges, Zimmerman can also be tried by the FEDS for civil rights violations (as in violating Trayvon Martin's civil rights, resulting in his death) *IF* they find that they have enough to go on in that direction....
He is not going to be charged for the same technical crime of "Murder" or "Manslaughter" - that would be double jeopardy - But he can be charged for other things pertaining to this specific situation. Personally, I hope he is.