Meditation Fatigue

Zenshin

Even after two years I still struggle to sit for longer than 25 minutes. The thing is Xmas day and Boxing day I sat 5 or 6 times for that period either Thai Samatha uding the mantra Buddho or Burmese Vipassana based on Mahasi Syayadaw's method plus some Metta practice. Today I've struggled to sit for longer than 10 minutes except for a 25 minute Metta practice sit. Any advice would be welcome.

Tosh

Is anything troubling you? I know when I have something to worry about, meditation is difficult.

Zenshin

Not really Tosh, I did forget to take my sertaline until late this afternoon. The thing is I was struggling today, sometimes I chant nembutsu and I was vacilating between sitting Samatha/Vipassana and pure land chanting.

Tosh

I don't know; hopefully someone more knowledgeable will be to help. I just asked the obvious question that sprang to mind.

Zenshin

Normally I'd just take the worry as the object of meditation. If anything I was getting bored and couldn't sit with the boredom. Thanks for the input anyway Tosh mate.

anataman

@lonelytraveller stop pushing yourself to do something'. Next time you sit just ask yourself this simple question: what the fuck am I doing here? If you start having serious thoughts don't go there. If the thoughts want to take you somewhere - don't go there. If you laugh at your thoughts be happy. If you are niggled with your thoughts be niggled, but don't force yourself to do something expecting a reward - there is no reward; that's the reward. When you sit for 5 minutes -'you have sat for 5 minutes', it doesn't matter if it is for 10, 20 or 120 minutes.

Let me know what happens mate ;-)

Zenshin

@anataman,

I here you - I don't time my metta practice I just practice, I'll just sit now for as long as I can sit for. Thanks for the advice.

genkaku

If you consider your practice flawed, you know it's time for more practice.
If you consider your practice unflawed, you know it's time for more practice.

And it's not as if you could do anything more.

If you want a halo or require some horns, go to Walmart and check out the Halloween section.

fivebells

Try to figure out why your attention was so stable then and unstable now. Do your best to develop the stabilizing factors and abandon the destablizing ones.

lobster

One of the myths of existence is more is required. Inevitably we struggle. How do we struggle less.

@genkaku is right but how to implement more, when less is arising? In other words what would hold our attention?

how

Sometimes the easiest way through a meditative struggle is by deliberately relaxing into it. In the face of our conditioned resistance in meditation to any ego threat, complete surrender is a great default position.

lobster

I feel @how is right, meditation can eventually be joyous and relaxing but we struggle with the imaginary 'difficulty' of just sitting and chilling . . . which we find so easy to attend to . . .

Sometimes looking for the relaxation or joy or pleasantness in the physical sensation of breathing or sitting . . . Focussing on an object of pleasure, a Yidam or pleasant incense. In other words, sit as if you have just finished a long pleasurable meditation practice.
That feeling of achievement. That feeling of well being and relaxation. It might all be imaginary to think one has started or indeed ended . . .

Too many of are trying to get to a time point. A sensation, an arrival. Well there you are.

OM YA HA HUM or words to that effect :wave:

Jeffrey

@lobster, what does OM YA HA HUM mean? Is it flippant or something real?

lobster

Jeffrey said:

@lobster, what does OM YA HA HUM mean? Is it flippant or something real?

Does not compute. One does not exclude the other.

OM is the universal sound of the dharmic religions. Similar to the Tetragrammaton, he who must not be named, or Allah quiet on the Western Front.

YA is the positive affirmation of the YinYAna imaginary Western school of Buddhism that I was so rightly dismissed from for starting mantras, starting imaginary schools of dharma and using double Dutch as in in 'Ya vol mein Buddha' . . .

HA is the exclamation of realisation as in HA HA HA

HUM is the universal music we all hum along to as in OM YA HA HUM

Jeffrey

A HA !!!

DairyLama

Lonely_Traveller said:

Even after two years I still struggle to sit for longer than 25 minutes. The thing is Xmas day and Boxing day I sat 5 or 6 times for that period either Thai Samatha uding the mantra Buddho or Burmese Vipassana based on Mahasi Syayadaw's method plus some Metta practice. Today I've struggled to sit for longer than 10 minutes except for a 25 minute Metta practice sit. Any advice would be welcome.

That's not unusual for lay-Buddhists. Have you tried sit-walk-sit? That's 2 periods of sitting meditation with some walking meditation in between. Alternatively vary your approach to meditation to keep it fresh.

Zenshin

Thanks for all the advice folks, I did manage to sit for 25 minutes last night.

@lobster, new buddhist's resident Yoda.

Cinorjer

The biggest problem with meditation for us is that we insist on turning it into something special we're doing. Then it takes effort and will and intrudes on our life, like going to the gym or getting on that exercise bike or balancing our bank account. And when it's something we're doing that's special, we want to get better at it. I'll hit my half hour mark this year, maybe, or manage to do it twice a day instead of twice a week. Forget about leg cramps. No pain, no gain.

All meditation is, when you think about it, is sitting quietly, doing nothing. Or, you could walk quietly, doing nothing. What are you doing? Oh, nothing. Just sitting. Or just walking.

Meditation isn't doing something. It's not-doing. It's not-doing worrying about yesterday or tomorrow or the constant load of problems we all have. It's not-doing the mom or dad or wife or employee dance for a few minutes. It's not-doing the craving for attention or perfection or entertainment that our minds fill our lives with.

Meditation is sitting quietly, doing nothing. What could be easier than that?

seeker242

I've experienced struggling to sit for longer. What I found that works well it just to keep sitting there.

Jeffrey

Yet you do have to have a certain amount of precision and technique. Still there is no such thing as a 'bad' meditation.

Cinorjer said:

The biggest problem with meditation for us is that we insist on turning it into something special we're doing. Then it takes effort and will and intrudes on our life, like going to the gym or getting on that exercise bike or balancing our bank account. And when it's something we're doing that's special, we want to get better at it. I'll hit my half hour mark this year, maybe, or manage to do it twice a day instead of twice a week. Forget about leg cramps. No pain, no gain.

All meditation is, when you think about it, is sitting quietly, doing nothing. Or, you could walk quietly, doing nothing. What are you doing? Oh, nothing. Just sitting. Or just walking.

Meditation isn't doing something. It's not-doing. It's not-doing worrying about yesterday or tomorrow or the constant load of problems we all have. It's not-doing the mom or dad or wife or employee dance for a few minutes. It's not-doing the craving for attention or perfection or entertainment that our minds fill our lives with.

Meditation is sitting quietly, doing nothing. What could be easier than that?

lobster

Lonely_Traveller said:

Thanks for all the advice folks, I did manage to sit for 25 minutes last night.

@lobster, new buddhist's resident Yoda.

Welcome you are, join free course you can.
http://learning.tergar.org/

Even Jedi and Sith can learn. I have joined up . . .
May the Force Be With Us.

Zenshin

Thanks for the link @lobster. Signed up.

BhikkhuJayasara

Lonely_Traveller said:

Even after two years I still struggle to sit for longer than 25 minutes. The thing is Xmas day and Boxing day I sat 5 or 6 times for that period either Thai Samatha uding the mantra Buddho or Burmese Vipassana based on Mahasi Syayadaw's method plus some Metta practice. Today I've struggled to sit for longer than 10 minutes except for a 25 minute Metta practice sit. Any advice would be welcome.

thats it? big whoop, after 10 years I still struggle to sit for more then 25 minutes ;P

there's my advice, realize your issues are normal and give metta to yourself and this poor mind and body of yours that you keep trying to make suffer by sitting for so long .

DairyLama

Cinorjer said:

Meditation is sitting quietly, doing nothing. What could be easier than that?

Not sitting quietly and doing lots of stuff is much easier.

yildun

hi
I had/have the same problem so gave up on the time
aspect of it,I just dont time myself anymore.. I sit and
enjoy Its more about quality than quanity (as the actress said to the bishop)

happy new year

slainte

footiam

Lonely_Traveller said:

Even after two years I still struggle to sit for longer than 25 minutes. The thing is Xmas day and Boxing day I sat 5 or 6 times for that period either Thai Samatha uding the mantra Buddho or Burmese Vipassana based on Mahasi Syayadaw's method plus some Metta practice. Today I've struggled to sit for longer than 10 minutes except for a 25 minute Metta practice sit. Any advice would be welcome.

Just don't worry too much about that. You can meditate on even when you are not sitting. Maybe you have heard of walkig meditation.

Zenshin

Yeah well folks I got some good tips on Samatha from the course that @lobster linked. I sit down and try to achieve concentration by not trying to achieve concentration, just letting the breath be and being aware of it and it seems to work.

Thanks for all the tips and advice folks.