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When members say "so long" for now.
how
Veteran Veteran
I think our repeated closing down of posts where a member says farewell, for the expressed reason of trying to save us from possible exposure to that members ego, is disingenuous.
If we were required to be so ego free for any other post, would there be any posts?.
The more likely reason is that this forum is a structure that sees another member leaving as a criticism of that structure, so it is promptly vanquished.
Interesting enough, there are many Buddhist organizations who respond to established members leaving with similar acts of public shunning.
Personally, I think that a real Buddhist response would be gracing an established member's exit posting with no less respect that we offered for their original joining post.
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Comments
I thought about this as well. Sometimes, I think it is the case of wanting the attention. But I think it's presumptuous of us to assume that.
Times I have taken leaves from FB for example, I post the day before I go. Not out of ego, but because there are friends and family who genuinely care and whom I mostly keep in touch with via FB and I didn't want them to be concerned. Sometimes, people go missing and I worry about them. I don't want people to worry. That's my only motivation. It's more tempting for me to just shut it down and take off, personally. But saying goodbye to friends on departing is just good manners, and that's how I tend to read it.
I take leave from the site now and then for different reasons, but the fact of not saying farewell, makes the comeback smoother and more unconspicuous.
Well, I think folks should be allowed to say so "long", so long as they are nice about it and not emotionally overwrought in post.
It's not wrong to want the attention of people you appreciate a lot. It's a pity you feel you are drifting a part of them.
In some cases it is like pouting that they did not have a good experience and blaming it on someone. It is my sense that is the reason for locking such threads although as said a lot of the good byes might be so others won't worry or to say good bye to friends.
You're right @how......
I think for the most part @lobster used his ego as an analytic device for getting his point across nothing more nothing less....
But I can understand how egos can get hurt by criticism...I read a post just recently where a member said "Hurt people hurt people" It tends to sum up the unwholesome aspect of the ego at work...
Some people may actually need to go through some sort of leave-taking ritual in order to strengthen their resolve to take some time off. I think that this "Ego" word is used waaay too often. If I spent inordinate amounts of time on some social network, I might indeed need to resort to some brass tacks to help me get away from it all.
Yes, it seems some discretion could be used to determine the usefulness of the post rather than a blanket "we just delete them all." There's a big difference between someone who leaves in a huff and posts as a means of revenge or whatever, and someone who is a long-time and oft contributing member who is leaving.
There have been people who have left suddenly with no goodbye, and I wish them well but I still miss them and wonder how they are. And that's just here. Over the course of my 20+ years online, there are A LOT of people who cross my mind where I wonder what happened to them. Sadly, sometimes I eventually find that they died. I prefer not to have to wonder.
Oh is that what happened to my "see you in a while post"?
I was just trying to be polite. Custom is it not?
/Victor
I mentally keep track of almost everyone here.. I think it's part of me being social/an extrovert. I've heard it's what can make extroverts too sensitive....anyway... As soon as someone is gone for more than a week...I notice..then wonder...then worry.
Especially after I've spent some time here with that person...speaking of...hahahaha..After a few weeks of laughin' and kickin' the can with @person here ( jokin' and stuff) .... I noticed he wasn't here...I put out an APB...he said "I'm here, everything's ok...nothing going on" ...I could almost hear his tone telling me to not worry and chill out...hahaha...anyway...I still see him on the 'Who's online' list and I usually use that as reference or a starting point....some people still log on, but just aren't into conversating for whatever reasons at that time...I admit, If I knew I was going to be gone for awhile, I would want to say a nice 'see you when I see you'...would it be ego? I think for me...it would be more about respecting the connection we have and I would feel bad...like I just left without saying anything...I dunno...I think by now we can tell who is just throwing a tantrum and who is giving us a hug.
Every time you don't like a choice I've made, it's not "a real Buddhist response" or it's that I'm defending my paper-thin ego. You don't ask questions or privately engage me for rationale. You just publicly state your assumptions and see how many folks sign on. The cynicism is exhausting.
Could it just maybe be that I've been running communities for half my life and decided that farewell tours, on the whole, are bad for the health of the communities? And is it just possible that it could be a professional, considered policy so that you all, on the whole, have a nicer place to talk?
Jiminey.
Everyone makes their own, private decisions about participating here. When you leave, your absence is noticed by the people your presence mattered to. They are as free as ever to engage with you privately, and I truly hope they do. That said, here's the short version of my dissertation on why I oppose (and remove) "farewell tours":
1) They are generally selfish. An arrival fills the community with hope and energy. A departure fills it with sadness and nostalgia. Moreover, most implicitly blame the community for no longer being what the person needs or wants. It's just a shit sandwich for everyone else.
2) They encourage more of the same. Once you see the precedent of all the love and adoration, it's tempting to gauge your "worth" to the community by staging a big farewell - and then, surprise! It was only for a couple months. For every honest departure thread, there are more who do it for the dramatic exit.
3) They open the floor to what-ails-thee complaints. Never has a type of thread been more susceptible to hijacking, derailment, and axe-to-grind inanity than this category of them.
4) Members become entitled to it. This is the kicker. Once you allow this behavior then, well, you'd have to be some sort of monster to deny it to the next person, right? Even if they decide they have some choice words on the way out or "disappointment" to express or just a few small pieces of dirty laundry to air.
5) Where is the up-side for anyone? I truly cannot figure out how either party benefits from the public transaction of a farewell tour.
Finally, I have little problem with posts like "hey X is happening so I will be gone for a while". Notice the two keys to that statement. First, it's temporary. Second, it's an external force driving the change. If you simply need to move on without us - well then you don't need us to see you off, now do you? No one throws going-away parties for someone who's just decided to stop hanging out with them.
If every departure were as innocent & pure as lobster's seemed, I'd have no issue with them. Sadly, that simply isn't reality.
Lobster pure and innocent? Please . . .
I have never trusted anything that cructacean says or does and I know her better than Mr Cushion.
Happy Month everyone . . .
You're in a lot of 'hot water' now @lobster...
It's often dangerous to respond to a moderator, but, ah well, sheets to the wind.
@Linc, you run a great forum here. I see little criticism, in general, of the way things are set up. In fact, you get lots of pats on the back, although admittedly, people do seem to whine a lot about hugely important issues like emoticons. (Hopefully, my sarcasm about such petty issues is noted).
But, to be fair, we "don't ask questions or privately engage [you] for rationale", because you rarely participate in any of the discussions. Which is okay, that's totally your choice, but, as I learned as a principal, when you're not out there with the 'public', they are discouraged from interaction...not intentionally, that's just the way it is. Out of sight, out of mind. And by the way, on those fairly rare instances where you have participated in discussions, I've usually enjoyed reading what you wrote, and always wished that you participated more often. But again, you have your reasons, and I accept that.
I think as forum "owner", you may see the forum differently than your "clients" do. That's another thing I learned in my profession. When I began as a school administrator, I was a very top-down type of person. Over time I leveled the playing field a lot, knowing that ultimately, I still made the hard decisions.
I'm going to end this post by repeating one of my beginning statements -- you run a great forum here.
@Linc
I did not write my thread to you specifically. I already had private messages to Federica a month ago where she reiterated word for word the same ego issues about some one else's exit postings.
My interest in this issue has much to do with my own baggage where I have seen shunning used as a matter of policy against practitioners as a way for Buddhist organizations to maintain a status quo at all costs.
I do believe that treating exit postings just like any other posting might well be more trying on you, just as it would on those Buddhist organizations.
Considering what you must be doing to keep this forum running smoothly here, perhaps anything that might make it more of an emotional burden is an unfair request. If so, then your policies towards exit postings are understandably just the costs of keeping a forum running smoothly.
But as an example..& I have no idea if they were ever deleted or not but
I usually go on retreat once or twice a year which includes unplugging from social media during that time. Usually just before it starts, I have thanked all the participants here for all the help their postings have offered me, and close it with the hope that I can reconnect again in a month. If that is an ego trip (and it might be) then so is any social nicety said when leaving any typical social gathering.
and
perhaps this is Zen thinking, but I think peoples postings here, whether ego born or not,
whether entering or exiting, whether uplifting or depressing...is just the compost of humanity that we meet with Buddhist tools.
If that is not doable..so be it but I did think it worthy of a thread.
Thank you for weighing in @Linc , I have tried to report what rankles behind the scenes and gotten little in reply and sometimes little to no action with no explanation.
So, I have started making it clear where I disagree. This serves multiple purposes. First you know it rankles, second you get to see where the more vocal of your users stand. I have been on BBS's and forums for 40 plus years, and have run some also. So, you might say I am seasoned also.
Emoticons not working...
How good are first world problems. XD
Metta all!
And thank you @Linc for hosting all this. It has helped me greatly.
@Linc's answer will show the error in that thinking. And your 'baggage' is not 'our problem'. Perceive whatever you want. Don't expect others to kow-tow to that.
We don't.
And sadly, as this isn't a democracy, I follow "party line."
Thanks all.
Any further comments, feel free to PM.
Lately, it's that I'm simply busier. I spent an hour composing that reply at the end of a 14-hour workday. That said, I make the time when it's important.
That perception is interesting, tho. I just ran the stats: Of folks who are still active, I still rank #20 in most comments.
It's just they're stretched over 11 years, and I talked more back-when.
Maybe I've just seen a few too many goodbyes.