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My dad is a right-wing A--hole

personperson Don't believe everything you think'Merica! Veteran
edited February 10 in General Banter

Not mine specifically but I just came across this bit of advice on dealing with the other side, was moved and wanted to share.

...The world isn’t being destroyed by democrats or republicans, red or blue, liberal or conservative, religious or atheist — the world is being destroyed by one side believing the other side is destroying the world. The world is being hurt and damaged by one group of people believing they’re truly better people than the others who think differently. The world officially ends when we let our beliefs conquer love. We must not let this happen...
https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/06/ask-andrew-w-k-my-dad-is-a-right-wing-asshole/

CarameltaillobsterkarastiVastmind

Comments

  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    Much wisdom in his response......

    lobsterSocairVastmind
  • KeromeKerome Love, love is mystery The Continent Veteran

    Yeah but you usually only find democrats subscribing to this creed...

  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator

    I see a whole lot of hating from the democrat/liberal side of the fence though, and a whole lot of intolerance when they claim how important tolerance is. The number of times I see liberals say things like "You are just a backwards Redneck!" or "You're stupid to believe in a fairy tail like the Bible" and "You're uneducated and you should just let those of us who are educated and cultured make the decisions..." How is that being tolerant? Many, many liberals I know are only tolerant towards their own side of the fence, sometimes myself included. We each have to work to find and recognize common ground and work with it. That's why it's so pointless to argue politics and beliefs etc with people online who are mostly strangers. Tolerance comes from connection and investment in each others lives, even if we disagree. It's where compromise comes from. But when we vote for people who are bad at compromise because we are the ones insisting they stand up for our values and screw every one else's, then we get what we have -gridlock.

    My in laws are conservatives. My FIL more so than my MIL even though she is Catholic and he is not. FIL loves Trump and Fox News. He's not a stupid man, quite the opposite. He is extraordinarily generous and caring - when he has that connection with someone. We disagree mightily on many political and social fronts. But because we care enough about each other, or at minimum about my husband and our kids, we always find common ground and when you do that, you can start to work on things. But it has to be, in my experience, done on a personal level. The internet is one area this fails miserably. People always responding to each other with their versions of the truth of their facts. No matter how many facts you have and how accurate they are, if you have no connection and no common ground, you'll get no where.

    The part I find unfortunate is that so many people don't work to find common ground, they simply pretend their political disagreements don't happen. I know married couples who are about as opposite as you can get, but to maintain peace they simply pretend the other person's views don't exist, so there is always these lines neither of them cross to avoid upsetting the other, when that relationship is ripe for learning how to negotiate and arrive at common ground. We have to learn how to do it on all levels, it is what softens our hearts.

    I'm sure most of us who are more liberal know a few conservatives we have a soft place for, people we "excuse" as not as bad as the others. But that is because we know them. We have that connection. We can see all the ways they do love people in their lives and communities, that they are generous in their own ways, that their lives are simply misunderstood by many etc etc. Even if we don't agree, we soften towards them. And it's what we need to do with most of our neighbors. Soften.

    personSocairVastmind
  • personperson Don't believe everything you think 'Merica! Veteran

    Really amazing stuff @karasti

  • It was a good response @Bunks

    So much of our thinking, instinct and training is based on dealing quickly with a situation by a quick, knee jerk response.

    One of the ways we begin to understand that we are being jerked around by assumption, karma, lack of compassion and fish fear ( that might just be me :3 ) is by exploring them skilfully. That means calmly, dispassionately and objectively.

    In my opinion, doing this with ourselves and our relationship to parents, siblings, friends and those who we find most difficult is so illuminating. What for example if in some ways we are assholes? (most definitely me).

    Compassion and tongue biting is one of the great skills. Changing the focus or reframing is such a great way to deal with situations that require the third side ...

    personkarastiFoibleFull
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    I gave up having political arguments a long time ago.

    In Australia there is basically no difference (that I can see) between the two major political parties.

    I tend to lean toward one side and vote in that way but when people start talking politics to me I try and quickly change the subject.

    Socair
  • dhammachickdhammachick crazy Aussie BUJU Sydney, Australia Veteran

    @Bunks said:
    I gave up having political arguments a long time ago.

    In Australia there is basically no difference (that I can see) between the two major political parties.

    I tend to lean toward one side and vote in that way but when people start talking politics to me I try and quickly change the subject.

    Ditto - I'd go further and say ALL our political parties are f**ktards and the "Big 3" are all the opposite of what's right for we the people.

  • KeromeKerome Love, love is mystery The Continent Veteran

    Yeah that’s very much the conclusion people are coming to here as well, that in reality a lot of political parties are about winning seats and votes, and not so much about doing what is right for the people in general.

  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    @Kerome said:
    Yeah that’s very much the conclusion people are coming to here as well, that in reality a lot of political parties are about winning seats and votes, and not so much about doing what is right for the people in general.

    Agree....I heard a senator in the U.S.A. interviewed recently and the question was along the lines of "What is your primary role as a Senator?" Answer: "To be voted in by my electorate".

    I am sure there are politicians who go into it for the right reasons but, let's be honest, it becomes a career for them the same as anybody else.

    And don't get me started on party politics......

    Socair
  • NirvanaNirvana aka BUBBA   `     `     ` `     ` Outa Range Fridays thru Sundays South Carolina, USA Veteran
    edited February 13

    Jesus said:
    Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

    The Greek word was Krino, "to judge or relegate (into an [undesirable] category)." In other words, do not put labels on others and expect that you stand above being labelled by others yourself. Or better, just don't let labels stick to people and fight to remove them when you see them?

    The closing sentence from these opening lines of the seventh chapter of Matthew, which concludes the sermon on the mount, seems to me to be speaking more of humility than of love. Maybe humility is a real prerequisite for love?

    lobster
  • @Bunks said:
    I tend to lean toward one side and vote in that way but when people start talking politics to me I try and quickly change the subject.

    Me too! I used to be a union shop steward, and a bit political. But I find I'm increasingly less interested in politics, and I can't see the point in getting wound up about stuff I have very little control over, or very little intention of doing anything about.

    Socair
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    @DairyLama said:

    @Bunks said:
    I tend to lean toward one side and vote in that way but when people start talking politics to me I try and quickly change the subject.

    Me too! I used to be a union shop steward, and a bit political. But I find I'm increasingly less interested in politics, and I can't see the point in getting wound up about stuff I have very little control over, or very little intention of doing anything about.

    Agreed.....considering my vote has the weight of 1 / 17,000,000 in my country, that's probably about all the energy I should put into it ;)

  • DavidDavid some guy Veteran
    edited February 13

    @person said:
    Not mine specifically but I just came across this bit of advice on dealing with the other side, was moved and wanted to share.

    ...The world isn’t being destroyed by democrats or republicans, red or blue, liberal or conservative, religious or atheist — the world is being destroyed by one side believing the other side is destroying the world. The world is being hurt and damaged by one group of people believing they’re truly better people than the others who think differently. The world officially ends when we let our beliefs conquer love. We must not let this happen...
    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/06/ask-andrew-w-k-my-dad-is-a-right-wing-asshole/

    My knee jerk reaction is to agree but then I think of those that wish to censor science for their own gain and the campaign of misinformation put out there and it almost sickens me. If it wasn't for Buddhism it probably would sicken me and I'd have to wonder if that's the whole point of it.

    I really think any politician, news agency or anyone in a position of public trust caught knowingly lying should have the book thrown at them.

    The ice caps are breaking records indeed.

  • personperson Don't believe everything you think 'Merica! Veteran

    @David said:

    @person said:
    Not mine specifically but I just came across this bit of advice on dealing with the other side, was moved and wanted to share.

    ...The world isn’t being destroyed by democrats or republicans, red or blue, liberal or conservative, religious or atheist — the world is being destroyed by one side believing the other side is destroying the world. The world is being hurt and damaged by one group of people believing they’re truly better people than the others who think differently. The world officially ends when we let our beliefs conquer love. We must not let this happen...
    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/06/ask-andrew-w-k-my-dad-is-a-right-wing-asshole/

    My knee jerk reaction is to agree but then I think of those that wish to censor science for their own gain and the campaign of misinformation put out there and it almost sickens me. If it wasn't for Buddhism it probably would sicken me and I'd have to wonder if that's the whole point of it.

    I really think any politician, news agency or anyone in a position of public trust caught knowingly lying should have the book thrown at them.

    The ice caps are breaking records indeed.

    It might be that those kind of political people are the ones that think they are truly better than the others who think differently. Therefore they can justify lying and misleading others, IOW they mislead not because they are Republicans but because they are the ones who's beliefs conquer their love.

  • We have to learn how to do it on all levels, it is what softens our hearts.

    Indeed.

    Strangely enough the opposite of love is not hate.
    Hate is merely love tightly wound and contorted. There is no opposition to Love.

    Love/Compassion is the unfolding lotus, the relaxing of our karmic constrictions; the removal of our held impediments and rough edges. The very practicing of the role of the compassionate, that is the transformation from asshole to arhat ...

    Whoever is on that side get's my vote ...

    ... and now back to the level learning ...

    Socair
  • personperson Don't believe everything you think 'Merica! Veteran

    @lobster said:
    the transformation from asshole to arhat ...

    I may have to steal that little gem. :)

    BunkslobsterSocair
  • federicafederica seeker of the clear blue sky Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator

    @lobster said: ... Strangely enough the opposite of love is not hate.
    Hate is merely love tightly wound and contorted. There is no opposition to Love.

    Oh but there is.
    The opposite to 'Love' is indeed as you say, not 'Hate'.
    The opposite to Love - is indifference.

    That is the horrifying dangerous entity we have to shield ourselves from becoming.

    Indifferent.

    By becoming inured, via constant exposure and endless attention, to certain incidents and events, people and announcements, we plant the seed of indifference.

    After a while, such things no longer arouse anger, indignation, revulsion and shock.
    We look upon them as yet again, another expected turn of events, which leave us cynical, and hardened, seemingly unaffected and resigned. Meh.

    Here, we begin to be inured.
    Here, indifference may sprout.

    Cultivate love, that it might choke the weed of indifference before it has a chance to even see light.

  • DavidDavid some guy Veteran

    @person said:

    @David said:

    @person said:
    Not mine specifically but I just came across this bit of advice on dealing with the other side, was moved and wanted to share.

    ...The world isn’t being destroyed by democrats or republicans, red or blue, liberal or conservative, religious or atheist — the world is being destroyed by one side believing the other side is destroying the world. The world is being hurt and damaged by one group of people believing they’re truly better people than the others who think differently. The world officially ends when we let our beliefs conquer love. We must not let this happen...
    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/06/ask-andrew-w-k-my-dad-is-a-right-wing-asshole/

    My knee jerk reaction is to agree but then I think of those that wish to censor science for their own gain and the campaign of misinformation put out there and it almost sickens me. If it wasn't for Buddhism it probably would sicken me and I'd have to wonder if that's the whole point of it.

    I really think any politician, news agency or anyone in a position of public trust caught knowingly lying should have the book thrown at them.

    The ice caps are breaking records indeed.

    It might be that those kind of political people are the ones that think they are truly better than the others who think differently. Therefore they can justify lying and misleading others, IOW they mislead not because they are Republicans but because they are the ones who's beliefs conquer their love.

    Yes and it isn't just the Republicans either. Democrats may not lie about science so much but some lie about Republicans and other sorts of Democrats. I'm using loose terms because I'm in Canada and it's pretty much the same thing except the level of dark comedy.

    It's all this us and "them" stuff. Like everyone would rather just "win" against the "others" instead of working together.

    I feel that way about us here sometimes too. There is no reason to be against each other because we see differently.

    lobster
  • personperson Don't believe everything you think 'Merica! Veteran
    edited February 14

    @David said:

    @person said:

    @David said:

    @person said:
    Not mine specifically but I just came across this bit of advice on dealing with the other side, was moved and wanted to share.

    ...The world isn’t being destroyed by democrats or republicans, red or blue, liberal or conservative, religious or atheist — the world is being destroyed by one side believing the other side is destroying the world. The world is being hurt and damaged by one group of people believing they’re truly better people than the others who think differently. The world officially ends when we let our beliefs conquer love. We must not let this happen...
    https://www.villagevoice.com/2014/08/06/ask-andrew-w-k-my-dad-is-a-right-wing-asshole/

    My knee jerk reaction is to agree but then I think of those that wish to censor science for their own gain and the campaign of misinformation put out there and it almost sickens me. If it wasn't for Buddhism it probably would sicken me and I'd have to wonder if that's the whole point of it.

    I really think any politician, news agency or anyone in a position of public trust caught knowingly lying should have the book thrown at them.

    The ice caps are breaking records indeed.

    It might be that those kind of political people are the ones that think they are truly better than the others who think differently. Therefore they can justify lying and misleading others, IOW they mislead not because they are Republicans but because they are the ones who's beliefs conquer their love.

    Yes and it isn't just the Republicans either. Democrats may not lie about science so much but some lie about Republicans and other sorts of Democrats. I'm using loose terms because I'm in Canada and it's pretty much the same thing except the level of dark comedy.

    The left has it's anti science views too. The anti vaxxers are mostly liberal, the science on GMO's say they are safe to eat, new nuclear tech is pretty safe, organic food probably isn't any better for the environment since it is less productive per acre.

    It's all this us and "them" stuff. Like everyone would rather just "win" against the "others" instead of working together.

    I feel that way about us here sometimes too. There is no reason to be against each other because we see differently.

    An analogy came to me that a country is like a soccer team, you have offensive and defensive players and they each serve an important role. But politics is like turning the teammates against each other. Like the defensive players saying "those stupid offense-tards, they all dance around with the ball and are so arrogant when they score. The "right" way is to just do your job and shut up about it". The offensive players say, "look at those defensive nut jobs, they don't even try to score. As soon as they get the ball they just kick it away! And don't even get me started on the goalie, what makes them think they're so special that they can use their hands, we can do our jobs just fine without them, they're have such goalie privilege."

    lobster
  • FoibleFullFoibleFull Canada Veteran

    Attachment to our values and believes is just attachment to trying to feel "certain" in a world that is fundamentally UN-certain.
    The Buddhist works on being aware of the moment, mindful of what goes on inside themselves ... including our fear and the corresponding need to feel safe by thinking we "know how it is".

    It is important to focus on developing compassion, rather than nurturing negative feelings about others who don't see things the way we do.
    In the end, we are all the same ... discontented (or even downright unhappy) and only seeking some way TO become happy. Doesn't matter if we are far Left, or far Right ... we all have the same wishes for ourselves and the only difference is the way we try to gain happiness.
    It is far more useful to work on feeling compassion for ourselves over our ignorance ... and then broadening that compassion to include all others who are just like ourselves. We are all in the same boat, even if we sit at opposite ends of that boat.

    Travellerpersonlobster
  • Very well put @FoibleFull

    Some of us may follow rather authoritarian, Princely Buddha, Kingly Christ, Zen teacher totalitarianism, Court of Shamballa or other right wing spirituality. The elite enlightened may not be part of our sangha commune, equal opportunity for ignorance or politically corrected left wingers.

    @FoibleFull said:
    It is far more useful to work on feeling compassion for ourselves over our ignorance ... and then broadening that compassion to include all others who are just like ourselves. We are all in the same boat, even if we sit at opposite ends of that boat.

    <3

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