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Martial Arts

NomaDBuddhaNomaDBuddha Scalpel wielder :) Bucharest Veteran
edited June 2010 in General Banter
Well, I recently started Aikido, and for four months of practice it seems harder and harder to execute the techniques correctly. I don't know what happens... And , one more thing that was just brought into my eye sight , is that I forgot even the basic techniques of a previous style that I practiced. Now, I'm trying to "recover", and I don't know where to start! I throw punches chaotically, like a beginner (although at karate, not aikido, I quit at the blue belt). Any karateka around ? Any good pieces of advice from you guys ?

Comments

  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited June 2010
    Do or do not. There is no try.
    You're trying too hard, I would guess.
    Relax.
  • NomaDBuddhaNomaDBuddha Scalpel wielder :) Bucharest Veteran
    edited June 2010
    I am relaxed, but my former punching force and speed seem to have gone like "Spuff!". I need to regain the speed I had some years ago(reffering to punches).
  • VictoriousVictorious Grim Veteran
    edited June 2010
    I am relaxed, but my former punching force and speed seem to have gone like "Spuff!". I need to regain the speed I had some years ago(reffering to punches).

    Your loosing focus has nothing to do with Karate or Aikido in themselves.

    Problem is you do not have a good grounding in any of them and your body/mind gets biomechanically confused from where to get the Ki.

    Go back to practising Karate until at least the black belt and then try for something else later. But ask your Sensei before you change style. That is the polite thing to do and he/she might give you pointers.


    Good luck.
    /Victor
  • edited June 2010
    If you're practicing Akido practice Akido leave Karate behind, they are opposites, Karate is hard like rock, Akido flows like water they do not compliment each other.
    Nomad I would also suggest that federica is correct you maybe trying too hard and thinking too much.
  • VictoriousVictorious Grim Veteran
    edited June 2010
    I have

    3 Dan in Aikido.
    1 Dan (kind of) in Yoshinken (Tai Ki Ken)
    2 kyu (brown) in Kyokushin. (Karate, pretty tough too).
    I have also looked at Iaido, Jodo, pressurepoints, kiaijutsu and some knifekatas.

    So far I have had no problem kombining any of them. Karate and Aikido are not opposites. They are both Budo. They do not complement each other they are in essence the same.

    But trust me on this one. Before trying to learn a new martial art practise one at least 10 years. There is no shortcut unless you are a Budo genius of some kind.

    However if you only wish to regain your punching force then go back to basics, start from lesson nr 1. Relax (is indeed a good suggestion) think speed not force.

    /Victor
  • edited June 2010
    I once read about 'The State of the Novice'. When you start practicing everything is new and seems easy. Only when you begin to understand techniques you also start thinking about them and try to perform them as well as you can. That is only natural but that often also causes a kind of 'block'.

    Only after years and years of training you return to the State of the novice and techniques begin to flow again and become stronger and stronger. This is also symbolised by the colour of the belt; you start off with white, you train through a whole range of colours and after many (often frustrating) years you will get your black belt. That's when it really starts and you start to understand what it is all about. Through the years your belt will wear down and a 'white' belt appears again; you return to the State of the novice.

    There's a well known story of a person who for the very first time shot an arrow from a bow. He hit bulls eye. Then he started training and his arrows went everywhere...

    I am a 2nd Dan in Shotokan Karate.

    Best wishes and keep on training!

    Pieter
  • NomaDBuddhaNomaDBuddha Scalpel wielder :) Bucharest Veteran
    edited June 2010
    Fletcher wrote: »
    If you're practicing Akido practice Akido leave Karate behind, they are opposites, Karate is hard like rock, Akido flows like water they do not compliment each other.
    Nomad I would also suggest that federica is correct you maybe trying too hard and thinking too much.

    So I should chill...get a break. The thing is, that at aikido, one of my collegue, although advanced in grade, he can punch and kick with all his force and speed even if he quit karate (he practiced karate a long time ago). And I really don't know how he maintained those, in the condition that he has time only for practicing aikido...
  • NomaDBuddhaNomaDBuddha Scalpel wielder :) Bucharest Veteran
    edited June 2010
    Victorious wrote: »
    I have

    3 Dan in Aikido.
    1 Dan (kind of) in Yoshinken (Tai Ki Ken)
    2 kyu (brown) in Kyokushin. (Karate, pretty tough too).
    I have also looked at Iaido, Jodo, pressurepoints, kiaijutsu and some knifekatas.

    So far I have had no problem kombining any of them. Karate and Aikido are not opposites. They are both Budo. They do not complement each other they are in essence the same.

    But trust me on this one. Before trying to learn a new martial art practise one at least 10 years. There is no shortcut unless you are a Budo genius of some kind.

    However if you only wish to regain your punching force then go back to basics, start from lesson nr 1. Relax (is indeed a good suggestion) think speed not force.

    /Victor

    Speed...that's the problem. After years of not practicing the former style( I made a gap between Shito-Ryu and Aikido, filled with b-ball) I don't even know how it feels to punch properly. Very hit, seems to get weaker and weaker. Still, the good thing is that the reflex I gained at Shito-Ryu didn't disappear.
  • NomaDBuddhaNomaDBuddha Scalpel wielder :) Bucharest Veteran
    edited June 2010
    Pieter wrote: »
    I once read about 'The State of the Novice'. When you start practicing everything is new and seems easy. Only when you begin to understand techniques you also start thinking about them and try to perform them as well as you can. That is only natural but that often also causes a kind of 'block'.

    Only after years and years of training you return to the State of the novice and techniques begin to flow again and become stronger and stronger. This is also symbolised by the colour of the belt; you start off with white, you train through a whole range of colours and after many (often frustrating) years you will get your black belt. That's when it really starts and you start to understand what it is all about. Through the years your belt will wear down and a 'white' belt appears again; you return to the State of the novice.

    There's a well known story of a person who for the very first time shot an arrow from a bow. He hit bulls eye. Then he started training and his arrows went everywhere...

    I am a 2nd Dan in Shotokan Karate.

    Best wishes and keep on training!

    Pieter

    So my problem is just a temporary one. Yeah, like others said...I should keep on my training "nice and easy".

    Well, thank you guys, or should I say, masters :D !
  • VictoriousVictorious Grim Veteran
    edited June 2010
    Speed...that's the problem. After years of not practising the former style( I made a gap between Shito-Ryu and Aikido, filled with b-ball) I don't even know how it feels to punch properly. Very hit, seems to get weaker and weaker. Still, the good thing is that the reflex I gained at Shito-Ryu didn't disappear.

    This is the classical symptom of trying too hard. Between every punch you do not take time to relax your muscles and mind. The tension builds up until you have no levay in your mind/body to hit a punch. You are alredy at maximum tension.

    The punch must come as a explosion grounded in the dirt under your feet and explode through your body out ending in your fist or shuto or whatever.

    Do this.

    Relax in front of you makiwara in kumite stance.

    In slow motion
    start executing punches one after the other.

    First only with your arm. Try to get the technique right.
    Then add the shoulder and then the upper torsoe and then the hip and finally the legs.

    Continue in slow motion and take time to relax in kumite stance between punches. It is not total relaxation I am talking about but Kumite relaxation. Do you understand what I mean?

    When you feel flow (rhythm) then add more speed and start tightening the body (from foot to fist) at the end of each punch to convey force to the makiwara. Still no hard punching only skin touch the makiwara.

    Remember to relax in kumite stance (mental and physical) between punches.

    During execution when you get into rhythm you will notice this is an excellent practise to fine tune your punching. Slowly changing your stance and breath and technique and mental attitude inbetween each punch to get maximum power.

    When comfortable add power.

    After a 1000 or so repetitions on each side and leg it should fall into place.

    I think your biggest problem is mental. So take time to relax between punches evan several minutes if helpful.

    The above is mindfulness applied to punching. Have fun!

    Questions?

    I am no master just a fanatic practitioner.:)
    /Victor
  • edited June 2010
    I want to learn it so much but I don't get time. still I do the basics everyday.
  • edited June 2010
    About the punches being disconnected.

    When you are training concentrate on this, as your training partner makes holds to turn you he is creating a handle, give that handle to him and allow him to take you, as the movement is feel the connection to the ground.

    In Tai Chi they have a concept called Shoon, this is letting go with resistance, where you see that in Chi Kung forms of Tai Chi that you may find on Youtube. Shoon is like this, imagine an accupunture needle, some of them they come in a very tight plastic container like a straw, and you draw the needle from the straw. When you partner is taking a handle on you become like the needle being withdrawn from the straw. Later on your own you should try to develop shocking power, which is something like the Chinese Jing. It is the same thing in the opposite, imagine that you could hit with the same connection that you allow to be taken from you. And that is almost Aikido in reverse.
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