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A Question About Meditation
Thao
Veteran
Do you think meditation makes you a better person? I ask this because I have a friend who is in a Hindu group and the organization is corrupt. I have been in several and found the same in these guru groups. But I did not find it in the Buddhist group that I was in. She and I were wondering why, because we believed that meditation would make you a better person and more moral, and yet it didn't seem that way. I have come away believing that people are people no matter if they are Christian, Hindu, or Buddhist, and that perhaps it is hard to overcome personality traits or perhaps you really just have to work very hard at it and that meditation is not what changes a person. Any ideas or answers here?
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Comments
Meditation is only a vehicle of transformation... and there are many activities that can be described as meditation.
Typically, is one meditates with the intention of loosening the clinging they have, then their actions will become more compassionate, because they operate from a less selfish view. No guarantees though, you'll find healthy and rotten fruit in every barrel.
My advice to you is not to generalize whole groups based on the actions of few. You've experienced a 'hindu' group that is 'corrupt', but then associate 'corrupt' with 'Hinduism'. You might benefit from "look and see fresh each time" kind of eyes... so you do not corrupt your own perspective with expectations about how people are people, and exactly what that means.
Overcoming personality ruts is difficult, and it is something many Buddhists practice at with good intent, proper action and dedication... and yet still human and bound to err.
With warmth,
Matt
Meditation does not make you a better person, or more moral. It doesn't give you mind powers, it does not make you special. You are the same person you were before you started meditating.
I like the analogy of the yin / yang symbol. It symbolizes duality, balance, and wholeness. We all have positive and negative aspects. Meditation can help to bring acceptance to our selves, even our "shadow" side. The point is to look deeply without denying or affirming the permanence of anything. For example, when we feel anger, it is better to say "There is anger" and look at the source of that, instead of denying that we are angry at all.
This is what I thought was so wise:
Typically, is one meditates with the intention of loosening the clinging they have, then their actions will become more compassionate, because they operate from a less selfish view. No guarantees though, you'll find healthy and rotten fruit in every barrel...Overcoming personality ruts is difficult, and it is something many Buddhists practice at with good intent, proper action and dedication... and yet still human and bound to err.
I need to get over my idealism--my expectations. But you see, you look up to a guru and the organization as someone or someones to eminate, and pow! It is time to just take care of my own personality and work on myself instead of expecting so much of others who are supposed to be God-like and aren't.
I read here somewhere: "If you put someone up on a pedestal, expect to be kicked in the face". I find this witty remark to hold especially true in spiritual practice. The difference might be that a buddhist teacher would kick at you intentionally until you pull your view away from worshiping/guruing.
There is a difference between giving honor to those who can help you and holding them above you. I think you're right on track with seeing through the ego trappings of the guru mentality, which is great. You might find a teacher at a sangha to be markedly different than what you saw with your friend.
With warmth,
Matt
I do like that Buddhist teachers don't want to be worshipped. That is different from the Hindu gurus.
I had a teacher at a sangha when I lived in CA, but now there are no Buddhists even near me, and I don't see well enough to drive very far since I have macular degenerator.
I like the pedestal comment.
Mugzy, I like how you brought up the yin and yang.
Definitely.
P
And like Eckhart Tolle said, 'the two go together' (ending suffering for yourself and for others)
But hey... that's my opinion.
You find in meditation that the mind is everchanging. You find that you are slightly fearful (I do) of this process and that you are trying to do something to get something.
Just the seeing process including seeing the fear and pain. Because you can sit with that in yourself. And even when you don't sit. When you give into neurosis and you have a drink or whatever you do. You see what everyone is up against. You do some of those negative things. Corrupt things. You see what we are all up against.
And of course glimpses where you see what is possible the joy and relief. That what we are grasping is not worth it.
These are some of the experiences and especially the habit of having confidence and opening again to a situation even when we think it is unbearable. To just let things be other than what we want!
We still have the same neurosis and corruption but at least we are seeing it rather than shying away from it 24/7 or dulling it out with a treat or becoming agressive to fix everything. Its a long path and you just keep connecting to that original wish I said. That wish keeps springing up again and again when you dust yourself off from all kinds of failures. :tonguec:
Just wanted to point that out.
But I found a website recently that told me of one difference. You see in Hindusim, at least in the guru groups that I was in, there was not much talk of morals. In Buddhism there is, and also much talk about developing loving kindness. In fact, in my Buddhist group the precepts were often brought up. The energy of the Masters was very different than that of the Hindu gurus. There was a calmness, peace, and equinimity with the Buddhists. Whereas it was inconsistent within the guru groups where the guru would be loving one moment and exploding in anger the next.
http://www.buzzle.com/articles/can-we-train-our-brains-through-compassion-meditation.html
The fMRI scans of the monks showed high activity in the insula, an area of the brain near the frontal lobe which reacts when emotions are triggered. The more intensely the participants felt the compassion meditation, the more activity was observed in the insula...
"Both of these areas have been linked to emotion sharing and empathy," said Davidson. "The combination of these two effects, which was much more noticeable in the expert meditators as opposed to the novices, was very powerful."
It means that we can train our minds to become more empathetic with regular compassion meditation.
Granted, not everyone has the time and the focus to devote thousands of hours to daily meditation, as monks do. But the findings are still encouraging because they indicate that personality traits previously thought to be inborn can be developed.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/rewire-your-brain-love/201001/meditation-and-the-false-lure-zoning-out?page=2
Alternately, meditation need not be equivalent to zazen or other formalized settings. Contemplative reading is equally meditative.