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Who is this deity and why is he blue?

Mr_SerenityMr_Serenity Veteran
edited February 2011 in General Banter
http://img201.imageshack.us/i/bluebuddha.jpg/

(Couldn't figure out how to post an image on this new forum lay out. So a link will have to do.)

I've seen portraits that look like this man over opening lotus that look like he is a Buddha. But who is he, and why is he blue?
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Comments

  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    It's the blue Hindu god, Vishnu.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    He's Blue because blue is a very symbolic colour denoting infinite clarity and wisdom. it's used in many religions.

    http://antinewworldorder.blogspot.com/2009/11/blue-linked-to-beginning-blue-bloods.html
  • rainbowwarriorrainbowwarrior
    Federica - are you sure it's not Shiva?
  • CinorjerCinorjer Veteran
    The trident and drum and crescent moon on his forehead mark him as Shiva. Except for an occasional addition of arms, you gotta look for accessories to figure out which Hindu god is being pictured.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Shiva, Vishnu... he's not one of ours, he's one of "theirs".... :grr:

    (Oh look! A blue emoticon!! :lol: )
  • rainbowwarriorrainbowwarrior
    Shiva, Vishnu... he's not one of ours, he's one of "theirs".... :grr:

    (Oh look! A blue emoticon!! :lol: )
    Hi Federica - I am not sure what you mean by that?

  • ShiftPlusOneShiftPlusOne Veteran
    I've also read somewhere that the colour differences in Hindu deities reflect their origins. Many deities were brought into India by Europeans, so their skin is fairer and some have 'golden' hair. It's not really reflected in modern paintings though.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Juts being light-hearted instead of the anally-retentive moderator some people seem to think I am, rw..... ;)
  • rainbowwarriorrainbowwarrior
    Juts being light-hearted instead of the anally-retentive moderator some people seem to think I am, rw..... ;)
    oh - well i for one have enjoyed all of your posts to date!

    you come across as a very consistant person actually - and not annally-retentive as you put it!



  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    I remember a child seeing this picture in a book, and commenting that no wonder he was blue, he must have been so cold without clothes....

    hard to argue with kiddy-logic sometimes!
  • dorjedorje
    Shiva isblue because he swallowed poison which made his body blue.
  • TalismanTalisman Veteran
    I thought Shiva was Vishnu...? Or they're different manifestations of Brahma? Gosh, I don't know my Hinduism.
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited February 2011
    It's Shiva. The crescent moon and trident are what give it away. He's called "Blue Throat" (Nilakantha) because he drank poison that otherwise would have destroyed the world. Before the poison could enter his body, however, his wife caught hold of his neck trapping the poison there. Why his entire body is blue in this picture, I don't know. It might just be artistic license, or some other significant reason (e.g., his body could be smeared with cemetery ash).
  • mugzymugzy Veteran
    The title immediately made me think of the line, "Who is your daddy and what does he do?" :lol:
  • Mr_SerenityMr_Serenity Veteran
    Cool explanations about why Shiva is blue guys. I also saw another picture at a meditation group I go to that I don't have a link for, it was a blue man like this that did look a bit different, but he was meditating while being surrounded by lotus. When I asked around over there who that portrait was, one told me it was Buddha. But I could tell he wasn't really certain.

    The lotus made me think it could be Buddhist related, but maybe I'll have to take a picture of that picture and share it here.
  • dorjedorje
    @Jason

    Amazingly there is also a depiction of Avalokiteshvara called Nilakantha Lokeshvara. Could the Buddhist veneration of Avalokiteshvara be somewhat inspired and/or derived from the practices of the cult of Shiva?
  • formermonkJohnformermonkJohn
    wouldnt you have blue skin if you had blue blood?
  • BonsaiDougBonsaiDoug Simply, on the path. Veteran
    The Medicine Buddha is also pictured blue: http://www.thubtenchodron.org/Retreat/images/MedicineBuddhaAbbey.jpg

    The blue Medicine Buddha is often considered the Buddha of the Eastern Pure Land. His color is lapis lazuli blue, the dark color of the stone called lapis.
  • dorjedorje
    Lapis is actually used as a medicine in Tibetan and Ayurvedic medicine.

    So people with black skin have black blood?
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    Krishna also has blue skin and is a form of Vishnu
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    @Jason

    Amazingly there is also a depiction of Avalokiteshvara called Nilakantha Lokeshvara. Could the Buddhist veneration of Avalokiteshvara be somewhat inspired and/or derived from the practices of the cult of Shiva?
    I don't know, but it's entirely possible.

  • rainbowwarriorrainbowwarrior
    wouldnt you have blue skin if you had blue blood?
    no
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    wouldnt you have blue skin if you had blue blood?
    Your blood's red.... do you have red skin?

  • formermonkJohnformermonkJohn
    sorta reddish or pink, actually i had a friend with a heart defect that made his blood much more blue and his skin did have a bluish cast, but not like krishna, he eventually had surgery to correct it and then his skin was normal colour, i just kinda had this fantasy that krishna was an alien and thats how they looked were he came from.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Krishna may or may not be an alien, but in my opinion, is a complete fantasy.
    Much like any other god, really.
  • mugzymugzy Veteran
    WHO IS YOUR DADDY AND WHAT DOES HE DO??? :rockon:
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    edited February 2011
    http://img201.imageshack.us/i/bluebuddha.jpg/

    (Couldn't figure out how to post an image on this new forum lay out. So a link will have to do.)

    I've seen portraits that look like this man over opening lotus that look like he is a Buddha. But who is he, and why is he blue?
    Yea, that's shiva.. but yes, blue is an important color denoting infinite space. Shiva is considered by Vajrayana to have been liberated by Chakrasamvara sometime back before the Kali Yuga and he will manifest in the future as a Buddha by a name I've forgotten. Others think that Shiva and Chakrasamvara are the same deity in different form. But, shiva manifests as a worldly deity because of most peoples inability to conceive beyond theism.
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    wouldnt you have blue skin if you had blue blood?
    Your blood is blue before it touches the oxygen after you get a cut or something. So, this is why veins appear blue when under the skin, because your blood is in fact blue while in the vein.
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    It's Shiva. The crescent moon and trident are what give it away. He's called "Blue Throat" (Nilakantha) because he drank poison that otherwise would have destroyed the world. Before the poison could enter his body, however, his wife caught hold of his neck trapping the poison there. Why his entire body is blue in this picture, I don't know. It might just be artistic license, or some other significant reason (e.g., his body could be smeared with cemetery ash).
    Yes, that's right. I grew up Hindu Shaivite before coming to Buddhism, and this is exactly one of the stories from the Puranas.

    His body is blue due to being infinite by nature.
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    Blood that has come from your lungs is red. Which is why when you blush your face turns red. It is filling with blood that is oxygenated.
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    I thought Shiva was Vishnu...? Or they're different manifestations of Brahma? Gosh, I don't know my Hinduism.
    Different puranas say different things, depending upon if it's a Vishnu, Shiva or Brahma purana. They all argue in the heavens over who is the true god, generally Shiva wins, but sometimes Vishnu wins. It's really a mess... theism.. bah humbug! LOL!
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    Blood that has come from your lungs is red. Which is why when you blush your face turns red. It is filling with blood that is oxygenated.
    Right... very nice, thanks.
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited February 2011
    wouldnt you have blue skin if you had blue blood?
    Your blood is blue before it touches the oxygen after you get a cut or something. So, this is why veins appear blue when under the skin, because your blood is in fact blue while in the vein.
    Actually, I'm pretty sure that's a myth. As long as it contains hemoglobin (like ours), it's always red; it's just that oxygenated blood appears brighter than deoxygenated blood.
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    It depends on which veins, check your arms, if you have showing veins like I do, you'll see that it's blue under the skin.
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited February 2011
    It depends on which veins, check your arms, if you have showing veins like I do, you'll see that it's blue under the skin.
    No, it doesn't. Human blood is always red.
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    It depends on which veins, check your arms, if you have showing veins like I do, you'll see that it's blue under the skin.
    No, it doesn't. Human blood is always red.

    You could be right, my veins are blue though, and that's supposedly due to no oxygen. I'm very wirey and you can see my veins in my arms and feet very nicely, they're all blue.

    I don't know about this stuff though... ??
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    edited February 2011
    I just read what a doctor said, and you and him might be right, it sounds plausible. Anyway... none of these are the reasons why we have blue deities... LOL!.

    So the appearance of blue veins has to do with light wavelength absorption and reflection... not the actual color of the blood.

    "The discussion stated:-
    To summarize, the reason for the bluish color of a vein is not greater remission of blue light compared
    with red light; rather, it is the greater decrease in the red remission above the vessel compared to its
    surroundings than the corresponding effect in the blue. Blue light does not penetrate as
    deeply into tissue as red light. Therefore, if the vessel is sufficiently deep, the reflectance in the blue
    will be affected to a lesser extent. Deoxygenated venous blood has a greater absorption coefficient
    than oxygenated arterial blood in the red spectral region, and this difference of two, rather small,
    values is amplified because of the long path length of red light in scattering tissue. As a result, veins are
    more likely to look blue than arteries at the same diameter and depth."
  • Floating_AbuFloating_Abu Veteran
    http://img201.imageshack.us/i/bluebuddha.jpg/

    (Couldn't figure out how to post an image on this new forum lay out. So a link will have to do.)

    I've seen portraits that look like this man over opening lotus that look like he is a Buddha. But who is he, and why is he blue?
    Mr Serenity, would just like to say: I like your title headline :D
  • ThaoThao Veteran
    Did any one guess who it was? It is Krishna. Krishna killed a five headed snake. that time he had taken all the poison of the snake. thereafter his skin became blue due to the poison effect.
  • Mr_SerenityMr_Serenity Veteran
    I have learned a lot about Hinduism on this thread. I knew you guys would know :lol:
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    (This is why we refer to highly respected people, or people very "high" in society, as being 'blue-blooded'. It's got nothing to do with really blue blood. Blue was an expensive and rare colour for clothing. as a dye, it was difficult to maintain in colour. Now with synthetic chemicals and more advanced methods, it's simple, but way back when, it was really hard, and very rare. This is why the Virgin Mary is often depicted wearing pale blue.
    She's the Queen of Heaven (blue being associated with celestial paradise, 'up' there....)and deign of being robed in special and precious, rare hues.

    Ok, I'm done now.
  • VajraheartVajraheart Veteran
    Did any one guess who it was? It is Krishna. Krishna killed a five headed snake. that time he had taken all the poison of the snake. thereafter his skin became blue due to the poison effect.
    The picture is of Shiva. I've been looking at this picture my entire life, it's an old one. I was born and raised Shaivite.
  • d3gud3gu
    Regarding 'blue blood' and nobles - rich/noble folk were more likely to stay inside rather than work outside. Their skin would therefore be paler, so you would be able to see their veins (deoxygenated, as opposed to oxygenated arteries) more prominently! ^_^
  • shamandogshamandog
    It's fun to see how Hinduism "reclaimed" Buddha by portraying him as an incarnation of Vishnu - if you visit Bodha Gaya you'll notice it's also a major Hindu pilgrimage site and images of Vishnu/Buddha are everywhere.

    About Shiva, well... you gotta love a god that dances! :-)
  • Ada_BAda_B
    It's fun to see how Hinduism "reclaimed" Buddha by portraying him as an incarnation of Vishnu - if you visit Bodha Gaya you'll notice it's also a major Hindu pilgrimage site and images of Vishnu/Buddha are everywhere.

    About Shiva, well... you gotta love a god that dances! :-)
    Buddhist have got our Red Tara, of course - she dances and she's a girl! :)

  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    Upon study I find the characterization of Shiva in the encyclopedia (remember those?) and western very hmmmm for dummies and not ear to ground. Anyhow Shiva is presented as 'the destroyer' and not too much else said about him. He always sounded like the Hindu devil though not evil just like father time or atrapos of the 3 fates in greek cutting the yarn of our lives (not sure if I got the right fate there are 3 sisters).

    Anyhow when I read an inkling of chakra yoga shiva is very associated with the cosmic consciousness, the great silence and the divine consciousness. What we aspire to, the spiritual center.
  • ShiftPlusOneShiftPlusOne Veteran
    Upon study I find the characterization of Shiva in the encyclopedia (remember those?) and western very hmmmm for dummies and not ear to ground. Anyhow Shiva is presented as 'the destroyer' and not too much else said about him. He always sounded like the Hindu devil though not evil just like father time or atrapos of the 3 fates in greek cutting the yarn of our lives (not sure if I got the right fate there are 3 sisters).

    Anyhow when I read an inkling of chakra yoga shiva is very associated with the cosmic consciousness, the great silence and the divine consciousness. What we aspire to, the spiritual center.
    It's interesting that he's not considered evil in any way, but a necessary part in the destruction-creation cycle. When I found out my girlfriend worships "the destroyer", I was more than a little confused.
  • shamandogshamandog
    edited February 2011

    Buddhist have got our Red Tara, of course - she dances and she's a girl! :)
    is she the same as Vajrayogini ?

  • DazzleDazzle
    edited February 2011
    IN Tibetan Buddhism (but not in other Buddhist traditions)there are 21 Taras of different colors and descriptions - hence the 21 Taras practice.

    They are meditational deities.

    Kurukulla is red - (another version of Tara) looks rather like Vajrayogini but has a bow and arrow I think.

    Vajrayogini (dancing on one leg and red) can be used in Guru Yoga and is a different deity to Tara.
  • NcryptxNcryptx
    Wow, the responses in this thread are really embarrassing. Firstly this is an artist's impression of the Hindu God Shiva. It is not Vishnu/Krsna. Vishnu is an entirely different paradigm. Actually strike that: they are completely different religions. Secondly, in Indian religious iconography the gods are often shown in the colour blue if not black. This isn't because they were 'European' (what nonsense!) but because it's a convention for religious art dating back to medieval India. It was supposed to show you who's a god and who's not, in a painting or fresco or statue. That was the original purpose, but obviously this is a late painting from the modern age and is more of an artistic impression, although it has some features that match up with Puranic descriptions of Shiva.

    The other thing we need to grasp is that Shiva is a Buddhist god as well as a Hindu one. The protective gods of Ceylon.. look them up. The Buddhists 'converted' Hindu gods wherever they went (especially Tibet, where Guru Padmasambhava according to tradition subdued the mountain gods, etc.)

    Finally the sculptural art/religious figurines of Buddha and Shiva were concurrent and they developed concurrently. In Gandhara it would have been almost impossible to tell them apart. The traditions are linked as Shaivism is more renunciation-oriented than other strands of mainstream Indian religion. Not to mention that Shiva's weapon the trisula became the Buddhist triratna. The traditions were linked in a way that is not altogether clear, but it's fair to say the Shaivite cult isn't Vedic and probably originally belonged with the sramanas, like Buddhism.
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