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Daily profound statement with Cory

CoryCory Tennessee Veteran
Wow (Insert name here), I didn't know the understanding and empathy of another human being was measured by the color of their skin. Like MLK said, Let us not judge others by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.

Comments

  • :wtf: wuuuut, I don't get this at all. I must be missing something here, really dumb or Cory is insane.
    Cory
  • CoryCory Tennessee Veteran
    edited April 2013
    It's a little bit of both :thumbsup:
    Let's put it this way, the individual Implied this: You don't understand because you are not black.
  • Was it said to you here, on this forum? Was it part of a discussion regarding anything Buddhist related? How are we supposed to relate to what you said and/or comment on it without any back-story ? ::: shrugs:::

    Invincible_summer
  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    I have 2 thoughts on this. First, in a way we are all the same. We are all white, black, Asian, Native American, Inuit, East Indian, Arab, etc etc. We really are all one and until we can act that way, we'll continue to have problems.

    On the other hand I do see the point. Of course you can have compassion and empathy and you can do your best to understand. But I do think there are some cases where, you may not clearly understand how a person feels about an issue because you have not suffered in their shoes over that issue. I've talked about this a lot with my various friends because it came up often when I was in college, in various sociology classes. I do think most people would benefit from trying to put themselves in another person's shoes, it's a good way to develop compassion. But I also don't think it's entirely uncorrect or always entirely unfair for someone who is black (or which ever "minority") to say "As a white person you don't truly understand what my people have gone through." But truly, you don't.

    A close friend of mine is an Anishinaabe and she has talked in-depth of the plight of her people in the area. The poverty, the way they are treated by their government, the abuse many of the children suffer. She's told me in great honesty and detail, and while I most certainly have compassion for her, and her people I cannot in any way claim to understand what they went through in their history or what they continue to go through in other ways, now. I listen, I tell her I love her and offer my support. But true understanding is not there because I have not walked those miles.

    The question is, why were you offended by it? You didn't say much about what happened or anything, but clearly you offered some sort of compassion and you feel it was rejected. Why? Sometimes the best thing we can do is simply be there and listen. Not offer comments, not offer advice. Simply listen and then when they are done, thank them for sharing, give them a hug, or whatever. Not every moment is one to offer opinions/thoughts/comments.
    riverflow
  • DakiniDakini Veteran
    edited April 2013
    Cory, this is the 2nd thread you've created regarding remarks someone made to you that offended you, even though, when not taken out of context, the remarks were actually reasonable or represented a potential learning experience. It may be helpful for you to practice putting yourself in others' shoes when you find yourself being offended by someone else's point of view. This is part of compassion practice. It's enriching when we're able to see the world as others see it. Ours isn't the only point of view. Sometimes there is no "right" or "wrong". There's individual experience.

    Another way to look at is: practicing non-attachment to "view". You're clinging awfully hard to your own perspective. Just saying....

    _/\_
    Invincible_summer
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    I want to sort of echo Dakini and say that I hope you're not going off on another rant because someone has said something you don't agree with. And, as Dakini said, you should see these situations as learning experiences.

    The first thing I think you need to understand is that there are cultural differences between being Black and being White (or Asian or Latino, etc.). And in that sense, (and I am assuming you're White), you don't understand fully what it means to be Black or to have the same perspective on things that many Black people would have. Where I think you're making a mistake is that you may be thinking that noting that someone is different, is making the judgement that one is superior to the other. And that's just not true.

    At one point, all administrators in my school system had to go through 3 days of multicultural training. There were presentations and discussions, and one assignment. The assignment was to put yourself into a situation where the culture was very different than your own. For example, some of my colleagues ask that I take them to a service at the local Thai Theravadist temple, which I did. Because I had spent (at that point) well over 14 months in Thailand, I was assigned a slightly different task. To go to three or four Black men that I knew -- individually -- and task the question, "Are you a Black man, or a man who is Black?" And I was to do it in order of the person who lived in a mostly White environment first, and finish up with the gentleman who lived in a mostly Black environment. So, I began with one of our math teachers who lived in a mostly White suburb and associated almost all the time with White people, and his response was, "I don't know what you're talking about." The second gentleman was basically the same, although is response was more along the lines of, "What the ---- you talkin' bout?" The third gentleman lived in a mixed suburban community that was predominantly Black. His response was (paraphrased), "Ah. A White man who knows there is a difference." But beyond that, he didn't want to discuss racial topics. The last man later became my assistant principal when I was promoted to principal, but at the time he was a social studies teacher. He was from the deep South in a community where Blacks struggled. He was living in the District Of Columbia in a neighborhood that was all Black, with perhaps a smattering of Latinos). When I asked him the question, he paused, and then laughed out loud. He wanted to know why I was asking, and then went on to explain (paraphrased): "When I wake up in the morning the first thing I see is my woman, who is Black. I usually stop at a restaurant for breakfast a few blocks from the house, and everyone in the restaurant is Black. Then I work here in this school all day, which is a mixed group of people, but mostly White, and I know I am not fully accepted by the White parents or other White teachers. When I go home it's back to my Black community. On the weekend my wife and I go out to party, usually at Black dance club. When I go back to South Carolina to visit my parents I stay in the Black part of town. So the eyes through which I see most everything is through the eyes of a Black man. So I am a Black man, not a man who happens to be Black."

    I visited Thailand a total of about 3 years, and lived there for 2 years. My partner was Thai. I lived more Thai style than American style, albeit in a Western-style condominium. 99% of the people I dealt with every day were Thais (or the occasional Indian or Japanese ex-patriot). I had a Thai a Thai family that treated me as a member of the family. But any thought that I could fully understand the Thai perspective on life was folly. Yes, I had breakthroughs in some matters, and certainly knew more about Thai culture and life than a one-time tourist, but always, just when I would think I was figuring things out, I would learn something that would require me to modify my viewpoint.

    That didn't mean that I saw Thai people as less or more. I saw them as equal, but not congruent (look it up in your old geometry text). And the Black teacher/assistant principal -- same for him. People from different cultures have different experiences, and that makes us different, but not better or worse.

    Invincible_summerJeffrey
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    If this is at all relevant:

    Because frankly, I have no idea where the OP is coming from, or even why, for that matter.

    Background info helps.

  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    "This" was a big black blank screen when opened it...and then it shut down my internet.
  • Since we are not living another's experience, we can never truly know how someone else feels about something.

    There's culture, socio-economics, history, politics, etc that all come together in various ways that affect how each individual views the world.

    Again, we can't ever really know what someone is going through, even if we've been through a similar situation ourselves. And I think it's sometimes more compassionate to understand this and just listen, rather than try to pretend to understand and complicate the situation.

    Yep you can never understand somebodies situation 100% even if you have gone through it yourself as everyone reacts differently and thinks differently. That is one reason why I think in Buddhism we are suggested to go and find out things for ourselves as teaching the same thing to a whole range of people is pretty hard lol
    Invincible_summer
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited April 2013
    vinlyn said:

    "This" was a big black blank screen when opened it...and then it shut down my internet.

    odd - it's a 'metapicture' in its own tab.....
    This (with additional reference to a transcript of the interview, in a British newspaper), is what it says:

    Interviewer: So, 'Black History month', you find....?
    Morgan freeman: Ridiculous.

    Iv: Really?? Why??
    MF: You want to relegate Black History to a Month - ?!

    Iv: Oh, come on....!
    MF: What do you do with yours? When's 'WHITE History Month'...?

    Iv: (Pause) Well, actually, I'm Jewish....(Federica note: How does being 'Jewish' have anything to do with being 'white'....?) :wtf:
    MF: Ok...'When's Jewish History Month'...?

    Iv: There isn't one.....
    MF: Oh, really? Would you like one....?

    Iv: Erm....no, not really....
    MF: Right. Well, I don't either. Black History is part of American History, and part of the history of other countries too..

    IV: Well, how would you combat racism?
    MF: Stop talking about it.
    I'll stop seeing you as a white man, if you stop seeing me as a black man. How about we just see each other as 'men'...?
    JeffreyMaryAnneStraight_Man
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    Black History month has always been a difficult concept, and no more so than in education circles.

    On the one hand you have American history itself, which for its first century pretty much allowed no significant accomplishments by Black people. They were relegated to the background, with half the country under the laws of slavery, and the other half far less accepting of "Negroes" than many people today understand.

    Then, for the next century, Blacks were freed, but treated wholly unequal.

    And so, Blacks complained that American history was taught from a White perspective. Which I'm not convinced was true. It's just that the movers and the shakers in America -- who are those that history usually teaches about -- were White. For example, it's quite natural that in a national history you would learn about the supreme rulers of a country...and they were all White presidents...and an almost entirely White legislature...and a totally White judiciary.

    And so, the idea was developed to highlight the contributions to American history made by African-Americans. And not even groups of people had common viewpoints of that.

    I remember when I was still assistant principal, our principal put me in charge of Black History month...not a task I was looking forward to, because it is often a "no win" position to be in. But I decided to do something different. Instead of us White folks telling our Black kids who they should respect and honor, I decided to let our Black kids tell us who they respected and honored. So I found 20 of our Black kids who were willing to do a morning announcement telling who (and why) they as individuals respected some particular Black historical figure. It started out well -- Martin Luther King was, almost of course, the first figure profiled. But on the third day, the student chose Malcolm X. When the principal heard that profile she became rather unhinged. "They can't discuss radicals like Malcolm X." And my response was blunt: "Joan (name changed to protect the guilty), it is not up to us White people to tell Black children who they should respect." Total silence, but the point was made. "Okay, go ahead, proceed with your program for the rest of the month" (but shaking her head as she said it).

    And of course, you never quite no where people are coming from. The first year I was principal, I hadn't yet begun to work on my plan to substantially increase the number of our teachers who were Black. Most all the years I had been at our school we only 1 or 2 Black teachers. But we hadn't been through my first hiring season. And during our late-spring orientation program, two Black parents came up to me after the formal program and asked, "We'd like to know what the odds are that our gifted daughter will have a Black teacher next year." So I explained what our current staff racial makeup was and how I was working to seek more minority candidates for vacancies. When I was done, the Black parents said, "We're sorry to hear that. We don't want our daughter to have second-rate Black teachers."

  • ZeroZero Veteran
    Federica note: How does being 'Jewish' have anything to do with being 'white'....?) :wtf:
    I think it may be because Jewish people see themselves as an ethnic group rather than a religion.
  • JoyfulGirlJoyfulGirl Veteran
    edited April 2013
    I can see how it can seem offending, on the other hand wouldn't you find it offending if someone claimed to understand fully what it is like to be you or go through your struggles? At least I would, I would prefer to be asked, and have a conversation where one would share expiriences. I am a sociologist, and imagine if I went out there and claimed absolute knowledge about the people's expiriences I want to study. Even after months of analyzing and collecting data-material and interviewing, I still can never understand fully. And that's okay :)

    But when people say you can never understand, I think it becomes a way of shutting down a conversation. At least it depends on the manner in which it is said. If it is said angrily, then it is a stopper. But it is true though, that we can never understand fully.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Cory said:

    It's a little bit of both :thumbsup:
    Let's put it this way, the individual Implied this: You don't understand because you are not black.

    It's safe to say they don't understand because they're not white.

    If we're going to want equality, it means it works both ways.

    Duzznit?

    chela
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