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Venting - Pro or Con?
AllbuddhaBound
Veteran
In most approaches to western psychology, venting is considered a key factor in coping with anger. Listening to Pema Chodron, venting is habitual and leads to more anger.
Are there other Buddhist thinkers who would dispute this? Are those who say serenity now, insanity later (quoting an old Jerry Seinfeld show) telling it like it is?
Are there other Buddhist thinkers who would dispute this? Are those who say serenity now, insanity later (quoting an old Jerry Seinfeld show) telling it like it is?
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Venting in this case might look more like breathing than shouting... and not at a person or event, rather, simply acknowledging that there is something agitating your body. I have personally done some cathartic thrashing (some years ago) and found it to be healing, but not the final healing of the misconception by any means.
Its important to have the right view, so I would suggest finding a teacher that can help you relate to it skillfully.
Good luck,
Matt
I'm particularly thinking of what happens to human beings who are traumatized and are unable to get in touch with their inner resources of strength or meditate.
What I don't think Pema Chodron meant is that 'stuffing it' is recommended.
In the CD series called "Getting Unstuck", she describes anger for example, as moving away from the present moment. She called the distraction a pattern of habituation. Habituated in a pattern of leaving. We get comfort in leaving. Whatever we do to become distracted (venting our anger, drinking or any other activity that takes us away from the moment), we are strengthening that habit. She says don't feed discursive mind with thought.
She states people use numbing out, revenge/anger, and/or craving to avoid uncomfortable states. These she stated, are the 3 main causes of suffering. She says staying with it is the key. Not avoiding it in any way, even to be ruthlessly honest, moving to the place of nothing to hide.
Shenpa - attachment but doesn't really get to the power of it. Not thought, but almost emotion. Pema says it is a state even before emotion. It results in being hooked, or getting stuck. Common feeling. Urge to scratch scabies for example. It provides temporary release but then it makes the scratcher suffer even more afterwards.
She says if we catch it when it just starts, then it is manageable but when we perseverate, it spins out of control. (My thoughts are venting would definitely qualify as persevering).
We are generally well into the scratching before we notice it. The scratching is the habit. Very common in west to turn the thoughts against ourselves. Begin to think "something is wrong with me".
She further states habituation is ego based. She suggests we open up space without twisting it into our own way to do the scratching. Anger is tool we use to scratch the shenpa. Have to experience the shenpa without acting it out. Renunciation shenluc. Turns shenpa upside down. Not about casting anything out, it is about seeing it clearly. (my thoughts are acceptance like a scientist observing the process). Healing has nothing to do with ego grasping, but a determination toward healing. She states that is the spirit of how we need to view things.
She then talks about loving kindness towards self. We view the scabies scratching (or anger, or alcohol for an alcoholic) as something that will give us comfort. These 'comforts' are only short term
Critical mind is a major shenpa. Deep uneasiness, we are critical but gives us puffed up ego short term, but at same time, we are poisoning ourselves.
Meditation is the way through it. Shenpa to positive experience, and shenpa to negative experience it does not matter. Positive Not hooked, but when we think we have been successful, leads to arrogance or poverty of mind because next session we don't experience the same success. Then negative meditation, might be wildly discursive, and we think it is bad. It was not bad though. It just was. Not attached, let the experience happen and stay with the uneasiness or tightening or the itch or scratching so that habits do not become stronger.
First step, acknowledge. Know that we are hooked. Then after we have experienced it in meditation, then re-experience it again. Don't go to the content, go to the process underneath. Be the dispassionate observer. 4 Rs Recognizing, Refraining, Relax into it, Resolve. Resolving to keep on practicing and work your way through it by looking at the process rather than the content.
Carol Tavris (1989) is a well known anger researcher and it was observed that the people who are most prone to vent their rage simply get more rather than less angry when they do so. (Eifert, McKay, Forsyth)2006 described it as a popular myth in their book "Act On Life, Not On Anger."
It is something worth considering. I too have a lot of faith in Pema Chodron's teachings and it appears that the scientific community is beginning to find the same truths.
Namaste
Tara Brach has a website and many podcasts of her teachings. I think it's important to not fault someone who may be stuck in venting. (Not that you're doing that ABB).
I guess I'm personalizing. I'm in recovery for PTSD and I'm at the stage of healing rage. It's not pleasant to sit through or stay with such an uncomfortable mind state. Rage is a natural reaction to violation. Most of mine is very young, dating back to my abusive childhood.
This is the absolute opposite of venting. At the same time I have to take care to really stay with the state. I know only too well how to dissociate and split from an unpleasant mind. I'm concerned that someone may hear your advice on not venting as an injunction to stuff feelings. We don't progress by shutting down and stifling ourselves either.
PS. I have that "Getting Unstuck" teaching and have listened to it many times. It's still possible to miss a point no matter how often I listen to it. Thanks for sharing AbB.
... dispute this? No. Not that I know of.
... like it is? No. Cute quip, but those suffering from psychiatric disorders are anything but serene.
Yes. There is a big difference between ignoring or denying feelings and acknowledging feelings without acting them out.
You are of course, quite right. And the way I state things, I may be stuck in my own shenpa trap I am not fully aware of. Another day, more learning to do.
Namaste
Just my misguided attempt at being funny. It doesn't really help in the discussion does it? I am going to have to look at my propensity for being trite.
Namaste
thank you for that helpful advice! I think there is a Middle Way with this one. I think it is ok to vent as long as a.) it's not destructive (and prolly doesn't include swearing b.) it acknowledges the issue and helps to get down to W.R.M.H (what really matters here) and c.) Isn't hurtful to the person you're disccussing with.
*namaste*;)
I love the way you express this. I think this is right on, we have the perception or the hurt that drives us into the emotion of anger... we need to work out that anger, then talk about the seeds of disharmony with the person (if it is something that will resurface in the relationship of course). The worst thing we can do is use the anger as the energy of the communion. Well, or kick them in the jibbies... that'd be pretty bad too.
With warmth,
Matt
All that we are is the result of what we have thought. If a man speaks or acts with an evil thought, pain follows him. If a man speaks or acts with a pure thought, happiness follows him, like a shadow that never leaves him.
Whatever words we utter should be chosen with care for people will hear them and be influenced by them for good or ill
Yours in the Dharma,
Todd
I think just paying attention to how things are or telling it like it is involves facing what causes these ventings without the venting. Cause as soon as you "vent" you cover up the feeling that causes is.
I think a good question is:
When you vent are you letting something out or are you forcing something out?
Leaking faucet and a glass underneath.
Emptying the glass once in a while = venting.
Emptying the glass is only dealing with the result of the problem.
You can turn off the faucet without emptying the glass.
Emptying the glass does make you feel less full so you might want to do this, and some people might be so preoccupied by the glass filled with water that they cannot even consider the faucet so you might want to empty it just for that reason.
But understanding how the faucet got turned on in the first place, and turning the faucet off is more important.
That is a great analogy. Dumping the glass is a short term, crude solution. Understanding and turning off the faucet takes some skill and self awareness.
1. find someone who agrees with me
2. listen as they mirror back exactly my frustrations (sometimes word for word)
3. we are both angry (or any other strong emotion).
4. we are happy because we agree - so my anger(or sadness) is justified and so is yours.
Its very sad since it is done in the absence of mindfulness. The happiness gained in this situation is not because anything was learned but because the feelings were identified and validated. The attachment to this kind of happiness just drives it further into the consciousness that one will try to recreate this pattern.
so here is a real-world example. if the person who lives downstairs took your/my parking spot we could vent about it for hours, or we could just go downstairs and knock on the door and ask them politely to move. The path that leads to fixing the problem I see as helpful - the other, not so much.
With warmth,
Matt