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There is a consequence to every action. It's just physics. It might not meet your personal, internal standard for justice, you might not even be able to see it, but it's undeniably there.
Think of that super boiled water - water boiled above 100 degrees. It doesn't bubble, or look like it's boiling at all. It looks like a regular glass of water. It appears that heating it has had no effect on it whatsoever, and the you disturb it... BIG boom. It was boiling all along, you just couldn't tell.
Perhaps. But what happens with karma to a person who is amoral?
I think that being amoral or without conscience is an effect of karma in itself. Also, as a believer in literal rebirth, I see no "escape" from the consequences of their actions other than divine intervention because the karma will be there throughout their lifetimes until they undo it.
How exactly does one "undo" something they didn't know existed to begin with?
Do you mean people without conscience? Because they don't experience guilt and so have no internal corrective process and generally don't realise there is a problem?
I think that would have to be a case of divine intervention.
Perhaps being without conscience IS the karma for something so in playing it out throughout their life they're undoing it just by being it.
What's wonderful to me is that, no matter how you believe about the details, karma in Buddhism says you are ultimately responsible for your own actions and any consequences. You can't say "The devil made me do it" or "I was only following orders" or even "It wasn't me, it was the drugs". Your actions, your karma.
While "actions have consequences" seems obvious to us, many people refuse to believe this observation applies to them. A man is on trial for murder. He waved a gun in a man's face while robbing him, and the gun went off, killing the victim. This man will tell you, "It was an accident. The gun just went off. I didn't mean to shoot him." and think that makes a difference. The consequence of robbing someone at gunpoint, even if you don't walk into the gas station planning on killing, is that you've made it possible for you to kill someone. You might not shoot someone this time, but eventually it will happen. Actions have consequences. But the man will continue to argue it was an accident. Not his fault. So even this basic karma can be ignored.
There is a consequence to every action. It's just physics. It might not meet your personal, internal standard for justice, you might not even be able to see it, but it's undeniably there.
Think of that super boiled water - water boiled above 100 degrees. It doesn't bubble, or look like it's boiling at all. It looks like a regular glass of water. It appears that heating it has had no effect on it whatsoever, and the you disturb it... BIG boom. It was boiling all along, you just couldn't tell.
Perhaps. But what happens with karma to a person who is amoral?
I think that being amoral or without conscience is an effect of karma in itself. Also, as a believer in literal rebirth, I see no "escape" from the consequences of their actions other than divine intervention because the karma will be there throughout their lifetimes until they undo it.
How exactly does one "undo" something they didn't know existed to begin with?
Do you mean people without conscience? Because they don't experience guilt and so have no internal corrective process and generally don't realise there is a problem?
I think that would have to be a case of divine intervention.
Perhaps being without conscience IS the karma for something so in playing it out throughout their life they're undoing it just by being it.
No, what I mean is, if something has happened to you based on karma from a previous life, you don't know what that was. So how can that karma be "undone"?
You know, it just struck me that a lot of Buddhists assume rebirth must go with past life karma, and that evidence for rebirth means evidence for karma over multiple lives. It's that desire for justice.
.
Or it could just be that that's what the Buddha taught and one just believes it out of faith. And not necessarily a desire for something or another.
Why do people never imagine that rebirth is a fresh start?
Because the Buddha taught that the making of karma is what causes rebirth to begin with? And that samsara is considered "beginning less"? And to say rebirth is a completely "fresh start" without a cause, contradicts the idea of a chain of dependent origination?
I don't think one needs to think that it's a completely, from a beginning, fresh start. The idea that it is completely modifiable with current and future right actions, right speech, etc. is more than enough IMO.
There is a consequence to every action. It's just physics. It might not meet your personal, internal standard for justice, you might not even be able to see it, but it's undeniably there.
Think of that super boiled water - water boiled above 100 degrees. It doesn't bubble, or look like it's boiling at all. It looks like a regular glass of water. It appears that heating it has had no effect on it whatsoever, and the you disturb it... BIG boom. It was boiling all along, you just couldn't tell.
Perhaps. But what happens with karma to a person who is amoral?
I think that being amoral or without conscience is an effect of karma in itself. Also, as a believer in literal rebirth, I see no "escape" from the consequences of their actions other than divine intervention because the karma will be there throughout their lifetimes until they undo it.
How exactly does one "undo" something they didn't know existed to begin with?
Do you mean people without conscience? Because they don't experience guilt and so have no internal corrective process and generally don't realise there is a problem?
I think that would have to be a case of divine intervention.
Perhaps being without conscience IS the karma for something so in playing it out throughout their life they're undoing it just by being it.
No, what I mean is, if something has happened to you based on karma from a previous life, you don't know what that was. So how can that karma be "undone"?
Kindness is relative bodhicitta. It is like knowing how to do something. But ultimate bodhicitta is the sea of possibilities. For every karma there is a possibility to react to that karma in some way. The ways are kindness, but without the field of possibilities you could never manifest.
It's like you love someone and don't know what to say. The right way has not manifested yet. But the ultimate bodhicitta/love is just fine as it is.
And we look in so many places like drugs. These places might rarely manifest a ray of ultimate bodhicitta, but mostly not.
In my understanding, karma can't be undone; however, it can be mitigated/softened/counter-balanced by the skillful karma you are presently creating. If you were always subject to the full force of past karma, you couldn't ever enact change. Its the present karma creation interacting with the past karma that allows this whole things to work, including awakening.
What's wonderful to me is that, no matter how you believe about the details, karma in Buddhism says you are ultimately responsible for your own actions and any consequences. You can't say "The devil made me do it" or "I was only following orders" or even "It wasn't me, it was the drugs". Your actions, your karma.
This is what I've always liked, too. Plus the fact that you don't get off scott-free if you repent on your deathbed. The seeds of karma are already laid, and can't be retracted. So you need to always be mindful throughout your life.
Except there are traditions that do seem to allow you to mitigate the effects of negative karmic seeds sown, I learned awhile ago. But I don't think that's common.
Bad Karma can be offset by performing good deeds. Freeing animals bound for slaughter, offsets negative karma of whatever we killed. Charity work and helping others when they need help also works to purify our bad karma. Chanting the correct sutras for the departed, the sick also helps a bit.
Think of it as your bank balance, whether you make more withdrawals or deposits.... spend wisely.
For me, I look at Science and Psychology, it connects very well with these two studies. In addition, experiences are showing me that Karma exist and is part of the Samsara. On the other hand, I do not see how reincarnation can be applied here, thus I pay attention to what I can at hand, which is each thought arising and subsiding.
The question of knowing anything for certain always leaves me lost. Meditation demonstrates existance itself in a constant state of fluidity. Certainty is relative, at best. Because of this, I approach any personal search for certainty as just another manifestation of ego best addressed through my meditation.
I don't pay much attention to proof or it's lack when the practise of meditation is really little more than the observation of life's cause & effect....or Karma.
1 Power of Remorse - The full power of remorse involves a feeling of great regret over the previous evil deeds and full declaration of confession in front of objects.
a investigate the meaninglessness of non-virtue
Parents, siblings, sons, wives, Servants, wealth, and other relatives Will not follow beyond death. But one's deeds will follow
b investigate the fear of its result
While I am lying in bed, Although surrounded by friends and relatives, The feeling of life being severed Will be experienced by me alone
c by investigating the need to be free from it quickly
The untrustworthy Lord of Death Waits not for things to be done or undone; Whether I am sick or healthy, This fleeting life span is unstable.
2 The Power of Antidote
One who committed evil deeds Can purify them with virtue and Radiate in this world Like the sun and moon emerging from behind the clouds
3 Power of Resolve
One who lacks self-guidance And later possesses mindfulness is like a radiant moon being freed from the clouds For example, Nanda, Angulimala, Ajatashatru, and Udayana.
4 Power of Reliance [refuge]
Like entrusting myself to a brave man when greatly afraid By entrusting myself to this [Awakened Mind] I shall be swiftly liberated Even if I have committed extremely unbearable evils. Why then do the conscientious not devote themselves to this?
Comments
I think that would have to be a case of divine intervention.
Perhaps being without conscience IS the karma for something so in playing it out throughout their life they're undoing it just by being it.
While "actions have consequences" seems obvious to us, many people refuse to believe this observation applies to them. A man is on trial for murder. He waved a gun in a man's face while robbing him, and the gun went off, killing the victim. This man will tell you, "It was an accident. The gun just went off. I didn't mean to shoot him." and think that makes a difference. The consequence of robbing someone at gunpoint, even if you don't walk into the gas station planning on killing, is that you've made it possible for you to kill someone. You might not shoot someone this time, but eventually it will happen. Actions have consequences. But the man will continue to argue it was an accident. Not his fault. So even this basic karma can be ignored.
I don't think one needs to think that it's a completely, from a beginning, fresh start. The idea that it is completely modifiable with current and future right actions, right speech, etc. is more than enough IMO.
Loser pays next lifetime :P
It's like you love someone and don't know what to say. The right way has not manifested yet. But the ultimate bodhicitta/love is just fine as it is.
And we look in so many places like drugs. These places might rarely manifest a ray of ultimate bodhicitta, but mostly not.
Except there are traditions that do seem to allow you to mitigate the effects of negative karmic seeds sown, I learned awhile ago. But I don't think that's common.
Freeing animals bound for slaughter, offsets negative karma of whatever we killed.
Charity work and helping others when they need help also works to purify our bad karma.
Chanting the correct sutras for the departed, the sick also helps a bit.
Think of it as your bank balance, whether you make more withdrawals or deposits.... spend wisely.
Meditation demonstrates existance itself in a constant state of fluidity.
Certainty is relative, at best.
Because of this, I approach any personal search for certainty as just another manifestation of ego best addressed through my meditation.
I don't pay much attention to proof or it's lack when the practise of meditation is really little more than the observation of life's cause & effect....or Karma.
1 Power of Remorse - The full power of remorse involves a feeling of great regret over the previous evil deeds and full declaration of confession in front of objects.
a investigate the meaninglessness of non-virtue b investigate the fear of its result c by investigating the need to be free from it quickly
2 The Power of Antidote 3 Power of Resolve 4 Power of Reliance [refuge] It's standard teaching in Tibetan Buddhism.