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Should we as individuals stop supporting certain sports?
hermitwin
Veteran
Certain sports eg boxing, american football causes serious long-term injury
to the players. Other endurance sports eg cycling and rowing is all about
how much pain you can endure. Unsurprisingly, cycling has a bad rep
when it comes to dopng. Tour de France for eg requires superhuman
strength and endurance.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2013/07/21/is-malcolm-gladwell-right-should-college-football-be-banned/
to the players. Other endurance sports eg cycling and rowing is all about
how much pain you can endure. Unsurprisingly, cycling has a bad rep
when it comes to dopng. Tour de France for eg requires superhuman
strength and endurance.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2013/07/21/is-malcolm-gladwell-right-should-college-football-be-banned/
1
Comments
if it is harmful to the players.
Yes, it would be better if this was not supported.
I do support boxing for adults. They are mature enough to understand the issues involved, they are all looking for the million-dollar-plus box office pay-off. In terms of personal safety and health, one adult doesn't need to tell another adult how to live.
If you watch folks harming each other for entertainment then you are the one creating that harm.
We are funny beings surely when we can speak ill of the Thai sex trade on one hand while supporting the boxing industries with the other.
That's a heckuva lot different than Floyd Mayweather and Canelo Alvarez getting purses of 41 and 5 million dollars, respectively, earlier this month in a sporting event in which they each voluntarily sought the match. And again, one adult doesn't need to tell another adult how to live.
Or develop 'sport samadhi', which was my first kensho . . .
But I will NOT pay to watch boxing, and I choose
not to watch it on TV either. note that the OP
ask how as individuals we can play our part.
Watch as many sweaty men hurting each other as you like.
As you say, each to his own....... but are you really justifying one form of violence here by reasoning that it's not as bad as other forms.
Is any violence somehow turned into peace through us paying the players enough money.
If one adult never needed to tell another how to live...the Buddha would have remained silent.
I have provided an initial blueprint of possible events . . .
http://yinyana.tumblr.com/post/24320417803/spiritual-olympics
Do you feel any new events would be welcome?
Guru bashing? Candle making? Competitive enlightenment?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-immolation
:wave:
Seriously, though, dangerous sports must be stopped - one adult cannot tell another adult what to do? Then many unlawful things will become legal. Dangerous precedent.
Perhaps.
Perhaps sport is 'play war' and better than the alternative. :thumbup:
I have practiced contact based martial arts, you don't have to but it would probably be very beneficial . . .
If I was going to ban a sport it would be 'Christian baiting' or 'Moslem bashing' but they are such willing martyrs . . . difficult to regulate . . . maybe we need rules of engagement?
:wave:
Instead of a nanny-state, a nanny-religion?
If you don't support stopping boxing, for example, you're not a real Buddhist?
How far are you taking this?
It is not that I don't understand the appeal of violence.
I spent years sparring in a full contact, no padding martial art and was proficient with a wide range of weaponry from blade to glock.
None of it however made a lick of sense to continue fostering once my meditation showed me the real fool that I was trying to defend.
If your ego is unfed from your support of violence against others, then I bow to your practice, and ask for your teaching on how to achieve such a thing.
Oh.. and while waiting for my Buddha license to be returned, I might point out that there is a difference between telling someone what they should and should not do....and pointing out to them what they are currently doing.
Oops, flashback.
This was the dance style I learned, another sort of 'Morris Dancing'.
hmmmm........
For myself, I've pretty much forsaken most contact sports. I've lost my taste for the violence. In some cases I've developed revulsion for the sports, seeing them as little more than society - sanctioned of gladitorial combat (football and hockey especially). I haven't watch a round of a boxing match since the Holmes/Cobb fight in '82. MMA fights make me ill. I happen to think such things mark a society in decline.
Now if someone else wants to partake of such violence, that's not really something I care to take up with them. As it turns out, one of my teachers - an Acharya lama - really likes pugil sports (boxings, etc). I have a lot of friends who have similar attractions to contact sports. In fight nights or game day, I won't be in attendance.
Examples; People who equate those who choose to have a couple of beers with friends on a Friday night .... with someone who can't stop himself from downing 3/4 of a bottle of gin, falling into the gutter and sleeping in his own vomit every Friday night....
People who can't resist equating someone smoking a joint, on their own back porch, watching the sun set on a beautiful fall evening after a long and busy day ... to someone shooting heroin into their veins 6-8 times a day and failing to provide or care for their children on a daily basis ...
I personally don't 'support' most professional sports by spectating nor with my dollars. Sports never interested me all that much. For a while I was a pro baseball fan, (Mets) but that was many years ago - I eventually just lost my zeal for that as well.
Do I have a certain admiration for athletes and their talents and dedication to [their] sport? Yes, I do. It's a lot of hard work and they sacrifice plenty to get into Pro status. Do I think it's justifiable to be paid multi-millions of dollars a year to play a sport? No I don't. When a high school teacher can make as little as 35-40k a yr, but some 6'7" 25 yr old who can dunk a basketball can bring home 1.8 mil that same year; well, there's a problem with priorities within our culture...
Is the answer to ban all sports, or even just "violent" sports? I don't think so. The solution is to change oneself, which in turn might change those around you, which in turn might change society- eventually - so that the demand for these 'games' and sports drops off to the point where it's not profitable enough for the Big Guys who own the teams and the venues.
YMMV
I think for people who want to ban sports (or even violent sports), instead they should go to each athlete one on one and try to persuade them to quit sports. That would bring the human element back into the mix.
@maarten
Really? ...... what? I'll be happy to clarify, but I'm not sure what you are asking "Really?" about....
except those who are not in favour of banning sports.
if that makes any sense.
it's just that I don't recognize the picture you are painting. I don't remember reading any post saying that you should not drink at all, or never smoke anything. My impression is that people don't go any further than saying that the buddha advised against it. Maybe I missed some of these threads, or maybe I skipped them.
These types of discussions usually happen/ed when the topic of Precepts comes up- especially #1 and #5.
People literally 'fretting' over the killing of ants or mosquitos in the same way they'd fret over the killing of a bear or a whale. Taking the precept literally, & fundamentally, without grey areas, nor consideration for any sort of (food chain, or 'sentience') science...
Some people feel the 5th precept is also an absolute; No alcohol, No mood-enhancing substances, etc. No middle ground, no middle way, no exceptions... Why? because of their conflating the extremes with that middle ground, (as I said in my other post) thereby making it all the same to them.
^^^ "Personal preference" or "interpretation"? Are these two terms interchangeable?
I think sometimes they are, sometimes they're not. But individuals do decide for themselves, and I'm OK with that (for sure!).
But you've got to admit, @vinlyn, there have been many discussions on this board, on several different topics, when a few people stick to the written word /dogma like glue, and/or believe their interpretation is the only "correct" one; no?
But I find it odd that someone will say, "One should never kill any life, even a dengue-infected mosquito because of Precept number 1, but drinking and drugs is sort of okay, despite Precept number 5."
I suppose, then, that your read of the Dharma and judgement of us mere mortals should be sufficient for each and every one of us to follow.
Maybe you should start gathering students.
Second, again, just read the post directly above your post, Chaz.
But, perhaps you can show me where one of the precepts says "always", and others say "as you like".
Observation does not always equal judgement. I don't really read that sort of judgement in @Vinlyn's post. He's just retelling an observation he's made regarding a general atmosphere he/we sometimes see in this forum about some topics.
Why the negativity?
With a judgemental attitude. I'm not being negative.
Check this:
Take a drink. I smoke a little pot. I eat a lot of meat. I kill things. I break a few precepts. My teachers know this. My guru knows this. None of them presume to lecture me on my path relative to the 5 Precepts, or even suggest that I'm not aware of what they say. None of them have ever said a single thing about this.
The truth is that I don't really care all that much about the pop Buddhist attitude of a fundamental approach to things like the 5Ps. A fundamental approach to religion led to the near total destruction of my family. I HATE fundamentalism. If someone like Vinlyn presents something I think is preachy fundamentalism, I get REALLY pissed.
If being pissed is "negative", then maybe I AM being negative.
And I think I'm OK with that.
And, you're being judgmental about someone you think is being judgmental.
I am very close friends with a Catholic couple. They are very Catholic...he being a former seminarian and she spent some time in a convent. We sometimes talk about religion, in general, as well as Catholicism and Buddhism.
The woman never goes to confession. The man frequently goes to confession.
The woman says confession is no longer mandatory in the Catholic Church. The man says it is still mandatory.
He's right. I've read a number of sources about it due to our discussions. It's still mandatory.
She, like me when I was still Catholic, decided that she personally doesn't agree with the teaching. And that's fine with me. But the official position is still the official position. I don't believe in confession. I don't care if any Catholic goes to confession. But it's still the official position.
___________________
And, that's how I see the 5 basic precepts. If you choose to drink or smoke pot, I don't give a shit. But it's still the precept not to. Just as I don't accept the way the first precept is read by many. I eat meat. I kill true animal pests. And I don't give a shit if the vegetarians don't like that. Part of my reasoning is about the term sentient. I think there is vast room for disagreement about that definition.
But whether or not you smoke or drink or eat meat or veggies...it's your decision...it's your path. But that doesn't change what the teaching says.