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Dhamma friends from other religions

Invincible_summerInvincible_summer Heavy Metal DhammaWe(s)t coast, Canada Veteran
As I don't have time to find a sangha to join (or regularly attend one for that matter), I don't have any in-the-flesh "dhamma friends," or people who are also Buddhist that I can share the spiritual path with.

However, I do have a couple of friends who are Christian that I talk to about spirituality, even if we're not on the same page about specific doctrines or practices. Their desire to lead a spiritually fulfilled life (for Jesus) is helpful for me to be around as well.

Do any of you have dhamma friends that are Buddhist? Or maybe of other religions? Do you feel it's just as helpful to be around committed followers of other faith traditions, as it would be to be around committed Buddhists?

Comments

  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    I often talk religion to 3 of my current friends...both Catholic and Methodist.
    Invincible_summer
  • DharmaMcBumDharmaMcBum Spacebus Wheelman York, UK Veteran
    I have a friend who recently rediscovered his Witnessing of Jehova (if that's the correct term) We agree on many basic philosophies of living. It leads to a few interesting conversations and I think it's good to be able to listen to others views.
    Invincible_summer
  • howhow Veteran Veteran
    Most of my friends are long term Buddhist practitioners.

    That within a Buddhist practice which allows me to connect with them is the same thing that allows me to connect to anyone trying to address the human condition through a spiritual path.


    Invincible_summer
  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    edited March 2014
    I have both, and actually our Sangha has some people that aren't completely decided on being Buddhist or are a combination of faiths. Whatever you find helpful that works for you is really all that matters. For me personally it makes a big difference in my life to be able to share time with people who truly share my beliefs, because we have discussions and bounce questions and understandings off each other. We have our weekly group here and then our larger Sangha maintains an online discussion group as well which was encouraged by our teacher to put together. My teacher is about 250 miles from here so I don't see him very often, but online allows all of his students around the state to keep in touch and answer questions about teachings and so on. He youtubes all his teachings as well, which is nice. So even if I can't be there, I can still get what he teaches every week. There are a lot of teachers who do that, so maybe something like that will work for you, if it's something you are looking for.

    If you are comfortable in your practice and enjoy the discussion with your other-faith friends, then why not? Buddha didn't say only to hang out with people who are Buddhist. Just not to waste your time with fools who might cause you to stray from your own faith. (that's my understanding of it, anyhow). If you feel supported and cared for in your group, and can have open and honest discussions, then I think that's great!

    The people in our Sangha who are Christian, or Christian-Buddhists have been a huge blessing to our group. Bringing other faiths together can actually enhance understanding of both of those traditions, and it's increased my understanding of Jesus' teachings a lot.
    Invincible_summer
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran
    My friends / family are all pretty much athiest / consumerists so I have no-one to talk about spirituality with......kinda sucks!

    It's kind of a coincidence that you post this actually @Invincible_summer. I was at my nieces 10th birthday yesterday with most of my direct family and some of their friends and I felt a bit ostracized. If they weren't talking about the behaviour of their 4 year old (my wife and sister in law) they were discussing house prices, share prices and overseas holidays.......yawn!

    Anyway, don't want to hijack your thread. I think what you are doing is wise!!
  • An interesting question. Personally I prefer the company of Buddhists but I am spoiled for choice. There are for example dervish groups, gnostic Christians, pagans and various other groups around. Of the Christian mainstream I would probably aim for Quakers.
    Invincible_summer
  • NirvanaNirvana aka BUBBA   `     `   South Carolina, USA Veteran


    Do any of you have dhamma friends that are Buddhist? Or maybe of other religions? Do you feel it's just as helpful to be around committed followers of other faith traditions, as it would be to be around committed Buddhists?

    Yes, I have friends of all religions. As long as they don't have a religious agenda (i.e., actually more of a political one), all's okay. I meet about weekly with friends for spiritual readings in all the traditions. It's nice, and I like the discussions. But I would like a few more pauses and ones a bit longer. Silence is a Gift beyond price. That silence should be (and is) the very ground of spiritual discourse and peace.

    But I don't like to discuss religion or spirituality generally, as most people feel their beliefs Must Not Be Questioned even by themselves. I feel as though I've graduated from that (and the Church) and am better off just moving on. I get in enough hot water on NewBuddhist from people who refuse to contemplate for just a few minutes anything outside their experience. "Caught in the trap of their own beliefs" is what I think.And then they just start polluting everything with their juggernaut thoughts.
    JeffreyInvincible_summer
  • VastmindVastmind Memphis, TN Veteran
    edited March 2014
    Out of my three closest friends (all are Christian)...I only
    speak religious/spiritual stuff with one.
    And she's a First Lady...(Here, that's what they call
    a pastor's wife). It has turned out to be a wonderful
    friendship! :) We already know each other's views...so
    there is no back and forth. Just sharing and listening.
    The other two? Nope....I don't bring up anything like
    religion.....they're not open to listening to anything
    different. They know I'm Buddhist...but pretend
    like I'm not...hahaha.

    Two friends at the Temple...but I found the
    friendships hard to maintain just bec we are
    at different stages with different priorities in
    life.
    Same with the retreats....
    It's hard to keep in touch and maintain with so many
    people in large groups coming and going.

    Aside from deep friendships....I'll talk, hang out
    and entertain just about anybody as long as their
    nice. :D
    DharmaMcBumInvincible_summer
  • ChazChaz The Remarkable Chaz Anywhere, Everywhere & Nowhere Veteran

    As I don't have time to find a sangha to join (or regularly attend one for that matter),

    You don't have time? Seriously? What do you do all week?
    I don't have any in-the-flesh "dhamma friends," or people who are also Buddhist that I can share the spiritual path with.
    That would make perfect sense. If you don't "have time" to find a sangha, you surely don't have time to make Buddhist friends.

    That's a shame.
    Do any of you have dhamma friends that are Buddhist?
    Absolutely. I belong to a sangha made up of wonderfull people. I'm socially connected to several other sanghas as well. My best friends are Buddhists.
    Or maybe of other religions?
    My wife is Wicca, but that's about as much as I know about my non-Buddhist friends. In mosy cases, I don't really know what kind of religious leanings they have and to be honest, I couldn't care less
    Do you feel it's just as helpful to be around committed followers of other faith traditions, as it would be to be around committed Buddhists?
    No, not really. I take refuge in the Buddha, Dharma and Sangha. Where non-Buddhists find refuge isn't of much interest or importance to me. I value my friends for reasons other than their religion.
    Invincible_summer
  • DharmaMcBumDharmaMcBum Spacebus Wheelman York, UK Veteran
    @Chaz I don't have the time to find a sangha, I work all week and family whats left of it. My practice comes from meditation when I can, reading when I can and to some extent discussion on here. Time is a precious resource.
    It's also possible that @Invincible_summer hasn't found a sangha that sits well with them yet? Or that they sit well with, whichever.
    VastmindBunksInvincible_summer
  • howhow Veteran Veteran
    edited March 2014
    It is amazing how unimportant the religious differences, that two friends might have,
    become in the moment that two sincere practitioners can stay in.
    Here, all manner of differing dogmas can take a back seat compared to the vast space that one shared heart takes up.
    Because all of our existences arose from a mistaken belief that we were somehow apart from that heart, all the sentient life you meet is just another expression of karmic searching for a resolution to that mistake.
    The saying "that when the student is ready, the teacher appears" is just another way of saying that each one of us, in each moment, can either be part of that separation or it's resolution.
    A friend to me is being some manifestation of that resolution,
    VastmindlobsterInvincible_summerKundo
  • DharmaMcBumDharmaMcBum Spacebus Wheelman York, UK Veteran
    how said:

    It is amazing how unimportant the religious differences, that two friends might have,
    become in the moment that two sincere practitioners can stay in.
    Here, all manner of differing dogmas can take a back seat compared to the vast space that one shared heart takes up.
    Because all of our existences arose from a mistaken belief that we were somehow apart from that heart, all the sentient life you meet is just another expression of karmic searching for a resolution to that mistake.
    The saying "that when the student is ready, the teacher appears" is just another way of saying that each one of us, in each moment, can either be part of that separation or it's resolution.
    A friend to me is being some manifestation of that resolution,

    This is similar to what I have with my Witness friend. I simply don't agree about the "faithier" elements of his belief but I also do not question his justification of some of his opinions and he has more or less accepted this. The final results of the opinions and of how things should be are pretty much the same though.
    We also talk about all the normal family and work and life stuff too. Regardless of the rest of it.
  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    A couple people brought up an interesting point that I didn't consider, and that's, what exactly do you mean by a friend?
    I have a friend who I have known for all by 6 weeks of my 38 years on the planet. We have been best friends since we were babies, and we remain so. It is a very special friendship. He is not Buddhist, and currently does not identify specifically with one religion. He is happy to listen to me share what I wish to share and I listen to him as well. I have other friends who are not nearly the same level, and then I have many acquaintances. In our local Sangha, which has maybe...10-15 regular attendees, I have 2 I consider friends. But all of them are Dharma brothers and sisters, and that itself is a very special relationship even though I don't consider most of them social friends just because I do not see them out of Sangha and all we do talk about is Buddhism.

    You might be surprised if you just open yourself to the possibility of a Sangha. You might not have to search for it if you merely open yourself to it instead of having already convinced yourself you don't have time. Take a look when you have time, and check it out. Not much time commitment required. My Sangha meets for about 90 minutes every Saturday. I can't always make it due to family schedules, but that's ok. I make it most of the time and I find myself hardly waiting to get up and go to our meetings because being in a space with people who are on the same path (though perhaps different areas of that path) is invaluable.
    Bunks
  • genkakugenkaku Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
    Although several friends of mine have Buddhist training, the older I get, the easier it I find it to be among those who are, to the best of my knowledge, not Buddhist.

    Among the friends who do have Buddhist training (with one notable exception -- a monk who might understandably be forgiven :) ) we almost never talk Buddhism.

    Sometimes I think it is easier/more likely to receive good teaching from those who haven't got clue-one about anything as wonderful as "Buddhism." No criticism intended here ... just surveying the landscape.
    VastmindInvincible_summer
  • ChazChaz The Remarkable Chaz Anywhere, Everywhere & Nowhere Veteran
    edited March 2014

    @Chaz I don't have the time to find a sangha, I work all week and family whats left of it. My practice comes from meditation when I can, reading when I can and to some extent discussion on here. Time is a precious resource.

    As it is for all of us. I work - at a job tht often requires more than the 40 hours most of us work in a week. I have familial responsibility. I manage 2 blogs. I have various social commitments.

    I also have time for a sangha, both to find and to serve. My sangha is nearly an hour's drive away It is, in some ways, inconvenient; it can be a real pain in the ass. I don't go as often as I'd like, but when I do go it's both precious and wonderfull; a blessing.

    I have this because I made it a priority. I made time to find a sangha and make time to keep and support it. It's important to me. I would not have a path were it not for that most precious jewel of refuge.


  • @Chaz a lot of people don't have enough energy for your life as you said.
  • ChazChaz The Remarkable Chaz Anywhere, Everywhere & Nowhere Veteran
    Jeffrey said:

    @Chaz a lot of people don't have enough energy for your life as you said.

    It doesn't take that much energy, @Jeffrey. It does take some commitment, though.

  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    It might not take energy for you, but some things like you described are exhausting for people of different personality types and different jobs, and so on. I have a lot of free time because I'm a stay at home mom and all 3 of my kids are in school to some degree. However, some days are extremely busy and I literally do not have the time. I missed 3 out of 4 weekends with my Sangha because of ski races and basketball tournaments. So it just depends on a lot of factors and you can't really fairly use your life and your personality and so on and tell someone else that they can do it the same way if you can, because often, they can't for reasons they don't even need to explain.
    Vastmind
  • ChazChaz The Remarkable Chaz Anywhere, Everywhere & Nowhere Veteran
    karasti said:

    It might not take energy for you, but some things like you described are exhausting for people of different personality types and different jobs, and so on. I have a lot of free time because I'm a stay at home mom and all 3 of my kids are in school to some degree. However, some days are extremely busy and I literally do not have the time. I missed 3 out of 4 weekends with my Sangha because of ski races and basketball tournaments. So it just depends on a lot of factors and you can't really fairly use your life and your personality and so on and tell someone else that they can do it the same way if you can, because often, they can't for reasons they don't even need to explain.

    Well, I'm not really suggesting or telling anyone they should do things "my way", but if someome says they "don't have time" to do something, I don't see anything wrong with using my own experience to contrast theirs.

    The thing is, we all spend our time the way we see fit. More often than not when we say we don't have time, what it really means is we don't make the time. A day in the life is the same length for all of us. We all prioritize. Our priorities differ.

  • DaftChrisDaftChris Spiritually conflicted. Not of this world. Veteran
    The majority of my friends are not Buddhist. Most are Atheist, with a few Pagans, Christians, and Jews thrown in for good measure. I'm able to discuss spirituality and religion with the vast majority of them.

    I think it's good to have diversity in one's life; wherever one can find it.
    Invincible_summermisterCopeDharmaMcBum
  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    @Chaz very true. We certainly have different priorities and have to make choices with how to use our time. But what @Jeffrey said is true too, that there are people who don't have energy to do what you do because of the type of job they have or whatever. It might not feel like it takes energy to you, but to others it certainly does.
    Invincible_summer
  • My wife is a quaker, and most of my in-person spiritual conversations are with her and other quakers. Don't really have a recommendation on the question one way or the other, though.
    Invincible_summer
  • My best friend is an atheist. We discuss everything.

    No one in my family is particularly religious. My sister has done Buddhist practices with me and attended meditation centres but probably more out of desperation with depression/delusions. My mother sometimes blesses me with a New Age 'Marks and Spencer' blessing 'St Michael to the left, St Michael to the right, St Michael Above, St Michael in front, St Michael Behind'
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Michael_(brand)
    This is a watered down 'lesser pentagram invocation' that I have done that calls on all four Arch Angels.
    http://m.wikihow.com/Perform-the-Lesser-Banishing-Ritual-of-the-Pentagram

    The M&s comes from my Grandmother who followed this group
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_Universal_and_Triumphant
    . . . what were you thinking granny . . .
    . . .It is enough to turn one to dharma . . .
    Bunks
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran
    What was granny thinking @lobster?

    Whenever one is directed to a "new age" religion on a wiki page there always seems to be a Controversy section!
  • Invincible_summerInvincible_summer Heavy Metal Dhamma We(s)t coast, Canada Veteran
    Chaz said:


    You don't have time? Seriously? What do you do all week?

    I'm a full-time student. School and studying and part-time work takes a lot out of me, and the sanghas that I would be interested in attending are either too inconvenient for me to get to by public transit (I don't own a car) or meet at times that would be a detriment to my studies (weekday nights).
    No, not really. I take refuge in the Buddha, Dharma and Sangha. Where non-Buddhists find refuge isn't of much interest or importance to me. I value my friends for reasons other than their religion.
    So you don't feel that sharing commonalities in spiritual practice can be beneficial?

    That's a shame.
    how said:

    It is amazing how unimportant the religious differences, that two friends might have,
    become in the moment that two sincere practitioners can stay in.
    Here, all manner of differing dogmas can take a back seat compared to the vast space that one shared heart takes up.
    Because all of our existences arose from a mistaken belief that we were somehow apart from that heart, all the sentient life you meet is just another expression of karmic searching for a resolution to that mistake.
    The saying "that when the student is ready, the teacher appears" is just another way of saying that each one of us, in each moment, can either be part of that separation or it's resolution.
    A friend to me is being some manifestation of that resolution,

    Indeed. And what I've found interesting is that if the person I talk to is genuinely interested in just sharing their spirituality (vs. debating doctrine), it can be a very enriching experience for both parties.
    fivebells said:

    My wife is a quaker, and most of my in-person spiritual conversations are with her and other quakers. Don't really have a recommendation on the question one way or the other, though.

    Quakers? Interesting! What have you gleaned from your conversations with them?

    And by the way, I wasn't looking for a recommendation - just fuelling conversation. :)
    vinlynNirvana
  • DairyLamaDairyLama Veteran Veteran


    Do any of you have dhamma friends that are Buddhist? Or maybe of other religions?

    I have Buddhist friends ( from a number of different schools ) but also friends in other traditions - it's good sometimes to have different perspectives.
    Invincible_summer
  • As I don't have time to find a sangha to join (or regularly attend one for that matter), I don't have any in-the-flesh "dhamma friends," or people who are also Buddhist that I can share the spiritual path with.

    However, I do have a couple of friends who are Christian that I talk to about spirituality, even if we're not on the same page about specific doctrines or practices. Their desire to lead a spiritually fulfilled life (for Jesus) is helpful for me to be around as well.

    Do any of you have dhamma friends that are Buddhist? Or maybe of other religions? Do you feel it's just as helpful to be around committed followers of other faith traditions, as it would be to be around committed Buddhists?


    Sometimes, I think I am very lucky to be here where I am living. There are many Buddhist temples I can go to, Theravada, Mahayana, you name it. There's one beautiful one up the hill, nestled among the lush tropical forest
    http://sasanarakkha.org/about.html and you get to 'party' there during Vesak or Kathina. Then, there is also a Tzu Chi Branch not very far away and other places too, one which teaches children Di Zhi Gui. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Di_Zi_Gui

    Since you have part of your roots in this part of the world, you'd most certainly know that there are many Hindus and Muslims here. So, there are many churches, mosques and Indian temples too. I know some Indians who are Hindus, Malays who are Muslims but no, they are never Dhamma friends. Talking about religion sometimes could be a very sensitive matter. People become very protective over what they believe in. Some could be overzealous and try to convert you; not that I am afraid of being converted. It is enough that we can have a friendly chat.

    Now, as for dhamma friends who are Buddhists - Not every Buddhist is a joy to be with. A Buddhist can just be as a pervert as anyone else and even if he or she is not, one just must click together to go along. When you are so spoilt for choice, sometimes you don't really care and you don't learn to appreciate.

    Now that you have asked - no, I don't think I have any dhamma friends who are Buddhists . At the moment, I just have you. A virtual Dhamma friend. That serves me enough at the moment.
    ChazlobsterInvincible_summer
  • ChazChaz The Remarkable Chaz Anywhere, Everywhere & Nowhere Veteran


    So you don't feel that sharing commonalities in spiritual practice can be beneficial?

    That's a shame.

    No not really. Most people don't really care about what sort of path I'm on, even if they're on a path of their own. Most of those willing to discuss such things have so much misunderstanding of Buddhism that I spend more time trying to correct the misunderstanding than sharing commonalities. Most of those who have misunderstanding don't care about being corrected. It becomes a huge waste of time. Better to discuss the secular stuff we have in common

    Invincible_summer
  • misterCopemisterCope PA, USA Veteran


    Do any of you have dhamma friends that are Buddhist? Or maybe of other religions? Do you feel it's just as helpful to be around committed followers of other faith traditions, as it would be to be around committed Buddhists?

    I don't actually know any other Buddhists in real life. My best friend is atheist. My girlfriend is Christian. My closest friends (who are also the people that lead meditation group with me) are a Wiccan, a devout Muslim, and a Jew. So, I can't form an opinion about having Buddhist friends. I can, however, say that the conversations that I have had with my friends of other faiths are some of the most interesting. Now that you've made me think about it, I'm actually quite glad that my Sangha is so atypical.
    lobsterInvincible_summer
  • I don't actually know any other Buddhists in real life.
    I make a point of not having Buddhists friends in my home, unless dharma is not an issue for them . . . I would never discuss religion with the last Christian girlfriend I had beyond a certain point. Your meditation group sounds wonderful. I have a Buddhist meditation group a short walk away but am wary of attending. Maybe I will attend just to hear the latest local dharma gossip . . . ;)
  • NirvanaNirvana aka BUBBA   `     `   South Carolina, USA Veteran
    edited March 2014

    ...sharing commonalities in spiritual practice can be beneficial...

    No doubt, unless one is on a superior path and chooses not to have any meaningful contact with us poor mortal "losers."

    I find it very uplifting to be around people that are uplifted by their commitments, convictions, and love of arts and sciences of all kinds. The greater the diversity, the more interesting life is. I can find no real or genuine moral compass within myself, by myself, and bent on only the ideas I accept at the moment. No, It's all about Love, about accepting and embracing any possible good thing that may happen if ones heart be so attuned. For myself, I learn so much from others that I'll want wider exposure, not narrower.

    Invincible_summerlobsterVastmind
  • Well said @Nirvana.

    Are we Buddhists first or people first?
    http://www.buddhistpeacefellowship.org/
    Vastmindzsc
  • VastmindVastmind Memphis, TN Veteran
    Well....look what the good lord buddha brought me....

    One of the two people I mentioned above from the
    Temple that I lost touch with just sent me a lovely e-mail
    today, reaching out and sending love! :)
    What a nice surprise!
    Gratitude for friendships.
    Invincible_summer
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