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What is Nirvana?

Hi

Do somebody know what Nirvana is (more or less)?

In Theravada Buddhism its understood as a
"liberation from the cycle of death and rebirth and freedom from the effects of karma"

And His Holiness Dalai Lama defined Nirvana as
"state of freedom from cyclic existence".

can it be experienced in this life or only after death?

If we are free from the effects of karma...what then, when we loose good and bad, ying and yang?

And when the humanity is gone will Nirvana dissolve as well? Plants/animals cant read Dharma and attain enlightenment
(and humans will not exist again because the sun is gone).

Was Buddha the first person to come into this state, and how did he know this, just like Jesus open up heaven, Buddha opened up Nirvana?


What do you think/believe?







«1

Comments

  • It can be experienced in this life. We are free from good or bad but the only thing of importance is awakening beings. Yes if there are no sientient beings anywhere in the universe then there would be no nirvana. It could be a muli-verse though.
  • howhow Veteran
    Today I believe Nirvana is the Buddhist version of Monty Python's holy hand grenade.
    I submit as proof, a perusal of any of NB previous threads on this subject.
    vinlynSabre
  • Rather than being some magical blissed-out state, as many seem to think, scholars say it's the falling away of illusions and clinging.
    Theswingisyellow
  • I don't find the holy hand grenade of Monty Python to compare with the entire purpose of Buddhism ie enlightenment.
    Sabre
  • howhow Veteran
    edited November 2013
    @Jeffrey
    Not meaning to mock anyone's sacred cow. Oh wait...I am!
    Perhaps, one person's holy hand grenade is another person's Holy Grail.

    Check out the intensity & dissension that has blossomed on the other NB threads about getting the description for Nirvana, just right.

    I think it's mostly about ego because I'm dammed sure Nirvana doesn't care.

    I have often found that the conceptualization of Nirvana to be both a hindrance to the practice as well as one of the more common Buddhist manifestations of spiritual avarice.
    So much attachment to the ungraspable.

    Yes it doesn't have to be........but that's still a lot of suffering over imagining the transcendence of suffering.


    MaryAnneEvenThirdlobsteranataman
  • I understand Nirvana is the ultimate goal of the spiritual path, but when you dont really know what Nirvana is what then? Faith will come into picture? You believe if I do good now, i will receive some good later or (if iam lucky) come to Nirvana.

    And we do good to others because the karma will bring us to a Nirvana state. Is it the ego speaking?
    "Do compassionate deeds, but Dont expect to get anything back" they say,
    but deep inside we laugh and say "We will get reward sooner or later".
    Is it the egoistic mind speaking, is it hypocritical?

    And who is counting the karma? Who decide if you are going to be an animal next life, or a flower or coming into Nirvana. So there need to be a Judge/God?

    Its about faith i think...faith in what Buddha said..or should we kill the Buddha?

    MaryAnneEvenThird
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    edited November 2013
    I don't find it that way. I'm not going to the other thread. Different strokes for different folks. Nirvana is no ego. It is extinguishing.

    @how said:
    I think it's mostly about ego because I'm dammed sure Nirvana doesn't care.


    I'm not sure if I understand, but are you saying nirvana is ego? It's actually non-ego. It means the extinguishing of concoction, fabrication, sankhara.

    @how said:
    I have often found that the conceptualization of Nirvana to be both a hindrance to the practice as well as one of the more common Buddhist manifestations of spiritual avarice.
    So much attachment to the ungraspable.
    Right on. We can always screw up our practice if it isn't light hearted enough. If you make a heavy project of trying to get to Nirvana it is a hindrance. But just because the dharma can be turned into a demon does not mean that it will for everyone. For a lot of people it is inspiring to think of nirvana. It's a core teaching that Thich Nhat Hanh says is the fourth dharma seal. You can't have a path without a destination. And for many people that destination is the freedom from birth and death.

  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    @Jason, I like your summary.
  • Namada said:

    I understand Nirvana is the ultimate goal of the spiritual path, but when you dont really know what Nirvana is what then? Faith will come into picture? You believe if I do good now, i will receive some good later or (if iam lucky) come to Nirvana.

    And we do good to others because the karma will bring us to a Nirvana state. Is it the ego speaking?
    "Do compassionate deeds, but Dont expect to get anything back" they say,
    but deep inside we laugh and say "We will get reward sooner or later".
    Is it the egoistic mind speaking, is it hypocritical?

    And who is counting the karma? Who decide if you are going to be an animal next life, or a flower or coming into Nirvana. So there need to be a Judge/God?

    Its about faith i think...faith in what Buddha said..or should we kill the Buddha?

    Altruistic activity is the most selfish thing we do. It's kind of neat how that works. The more we value others the more enriched our own mind is. Win win situation. There is no judge of karma. So that I have no idea of. Who judges what pip a dice rolled will turn up? Do we need a god or judge for a dice roll?
  • anatamananataman Who needs a title? Where am I? Veteran
    No person can show Nirvana if it is liberation from self, but the buddhas teachings can help realise it. 'I' doubt if 'I' can help 'you' any more than that; just start with the 4 Noble Truth's and see where that leads 'you'...

    Good luck - there is the middle way just over there, it's quite interesting and there are some nice stories about it, but it is easy to get a little lost at times so it's a good idea to pick up the free guide about the eight-fold path that is really an extension of the 4NTs and may be useful along the way

    ah here's one, take it if you will:

    http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/8foldpath.htm

    No it's not explosive, but could be expansive

  • NamadaNamada Veteran
    edited November 2013
    Jeffrey Said:

    "There is no judge of karma. So that I have no idea of. Who judges what pip a dice rolled will turn up? Do we need a god or judge for a dice roll? "

    -----------------

    No, but some one need to roll the dice? And gambling is not a wholesome action either, so i dont think or next life depends on a dice roll...
  • howhow Veteran
    edited November 2013
    Jeffrey said:



    @how said:

    I think it's mostly about ego because I'm dammed sure Nirvana doesn't care.


    I'm not sure if I understand, but are you saying nirvana is ego? It's actually non-ego. It means the extinguishing of concoction, fabrication, sankhara.

    You can't have a path without a destination. And for many people that destination is the freedom from birth and death.



    @Jeffrey
    My Bad!
    I thought shooting Nirvana in it's foot before it ran away on us again was worth a
    shot. Now all I have is holy shoes.

    Nirvana itself is a good description of the absence of ego. It was the grasping after Nirvana which I was pointing out as ego.
    &
    A path without a destination is a passable description of Zen meditation.
    Dennis1
  • You don't have to gamble to play dice. You can play role playing games like dungeons and dragons.

    The dice example doesn't correlate perfectly to a 'karma king' scenario. I'm just saying that phenomena in the world operating does not need a God. Through science we understand physics and chemistry and we don't need a God making the molecules dance. So how about a better example than dice? Do we need a judge to make the wind blow?
  • My personal opinion is that we all interpret karma the wrong way.I dont think karma is this magical idea that is kept track of when we help people. I believe that everytime you feel unbias compassion and want to spread that compassion because you want to share something that is beautiful, in this moment you are gaining karma. When you feel negative feelings, you are desiring to spread that negative feeling because you dont want to be the only one feeling it. You want to drag others down with you, this is how you gain bad karma, by simply having the desire to drag others down with you. One does not simply gain good karma with actions. You cannot simply manipulate the system and do good things when you dont actually want to. Doing good things is only an idea, are these really "good" things that you are doing? Or is that only a bias perception of your actions? Thats what the word "act" in "action" represents because it is only a fasod. These "good actions" are not fundamental compassion it is a false manipulation.
    Jeffrey
  • NamadaNamada Veteran
    edited November 2013
    Jeffrey I understood what you meant :) Anyway i think Karma is about growing good seeds, and also accept what ever is coming, so if the deices or wind are blowing this or this direction, we need to accept it, be open to what ever is coming.

    Anyway its impossible to understand...why iam born in this body? Did i get what i deserved? Is it a weight saying: Sorry Little bit (or actually many) more good deeds and you would be born as a prince...

    Maybe its here "the dont know mind" is coming in, and let it be as it is.





    EvenThird
  • EvenThirdEvenThird NYC Veteran
    edited November 2013
    ^^^
    "the don't know mind" is a pretty alright place to be. :)

    @heyimacrab
    One of the ways I've seen karma described that resonated with me is as "volition," which is similar to it's literal translation of "action" but includes motivation and intention as well as physical action. Although it's good to remember that by saying karma is "action" you include all mental formations(or mental "actions") as well.
    Sabre
  • Can Nirvana be achievable for a lay practitioner? Or do i need to leave my kids and wife and become a monk? I saw an interview with a monk on tv, he had left his wife and 6 kids for becoming a monk...where is the compassion? Anyway Buddha did the same...so i think you need to be little bit selfish, and your ego will never dissolve, its impossible, you have desires all the time, now i want to meditate, now i want to be a better person!
    Dennis1
  • misecmisc1misecmisc1 I am a Hindu India Veteran
    edited November 2013
    what is Nirvana?
    not again... :-/
  • misecmisc1misecmisc1 I am a Hindu India Veteran
    i heard an easy answer for the question - what is nirvana? and the answer, which i heard was (i think from Ajahn Brahm) - nirvana is not that thing, which we can think it to be. so relax and try to be in here and now, just being, not doing.
    EvenThirdJeffrey
  • SabreSabre Veteran
    edited November 2013
    I for one think it is quite an important question to ask, because what is more foolish: getting into the same discussion multiple times or following a path not knowing where it should lead? So I shared my views on nirvana more than once if I recall correctly, but I'm happy to share them again. I am having some tea which is still very hot, so I have some time. So hold on to your helmets (or holy hand granades). ;) Like Jason I prefer to work in some suttas, so people can do their own reading. Of coarse I don't mean we should take them as authority or as substitute of practice.

    The Buddha asked us to reflect upon nirvana (or pali: nibbana), so asking questions such as this are part of the practice.
    (7) “And what, Ānanda, is the perception of cessation? Here, having gone to the forest, to the root of a tree, or to an empty hut, a bhikkhu reflects thus: ‘This is peaceful, this is sublime, that is, the stilling of all activities, the relinquishment of all acquisitions, the destruction of craving, cessation, nibbāna.’ This is called the perception of cessation.
    http://suttacentral.net/an10.60/en/
    Nirvana is not a thing, not a place, not a state of being. I think it's often best to see nirvana as meaning 'going out' or as in the quote above, as a synonym for cessation. The most important thing I think there is to know is that the Buddha used the word to refer to multiple things cessating. The most prominent place in the suttas where that is described is here: (nibbana-dhatu is nibbana-elements or nibbana-'natures'). This also answers the question "can it be experienced in this life or only after death?" - depends on which you are talking about.
    "Bhikkhus, there are these two Nibbana-elements. What are the two? The Nibbana-element with residue left and the Nibbana-element with no residue left.
    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/iti/iti.2.042-049x.irel.html
    We shouldn't see these in terms of what's left behind, but by what is abandoned. The one with 'residue left' is the 'going out' of greed, anger and misunderstanding. This is the 'experience' of a living enlightened being and the residue is the five aggregates that make up that being.

    The 'no residue left' is after death of an enlightened being. Here the aggregates also fall apart. All that is conditioned is cessated. Birth is ended and so there will be no new life: existence is cessated. :)
    He understands: ‘With the breakup of the body, following the exhaustion of life, all that is felt, not being delighted in, will become cool right here; mere bodily remains will be left.’
    http://suttacentral.net/sn12.51/en/
    Perhaps I should say that merely having this as an intellectual idea is not enough. It is to be known and seen, only after that can we really learn to embrace it.
    Friend Saviṭṭha, apart from faith, apart from personal preference, apart from oral tradition, apart from reasoned reflection, apart from acceptance of a view after pondering it, I know this, I see this: ‘Nibbana is the cessation of existence.’”
    http://suttacentral.net/sn12.68/en/
    I'll leave it at this for now. :hiding:

    Perhaps I'll try to find my older posts on this while I'm finishing my tea (which will mainly come down to the same thing, but still).

    Metta to all,
    Sabre
    EvenThirdanatamanNamadacvalue
  • SabreSabre Veteran
    edited November 2013

    My personal opinion is that we all interpret karma the wrong way.I dont think karma is this magical idea that is kept track of when we help people. I believe that everytime you feel unbias compassion and want to spread that compassion because you want to share something that is beautiful, in this moment you are gaining karma. When you feel negative feelings, you are desiring to spread that negative feeling because you dont want to be the only one feeling it. You want to drag others down with you, this is how you gain bad karma, by simply having the desire to drag others down with you. One does not simply gain good karma with actions. You cannot simply manipulate the system and do good things when you dont actually want to. Doing good things is only an idea, are these really "good" things that you are doing? Or is that only a bias perception of your actions? Thats what the word "act" in "action" represents because it is only a fasod. These "good actions" are not fundamental compassion it is a false manipulation.

    Karma indeed is not just the bodily act, but also (or mainly) the mental act. In Buddhist context, however, bodily and mental acts are often combined under the word 'action'. So sharing loving kindness mentally is also an 'action'. This can be confusing, but that's due to the word. (I agree with you that still many people especially in Asia seem to have a very superstitious idea of karma)

    edit: I now see EvenThird already said this. :)
    EvenThird
  • Thank you all for your comments :) I don`t have any sangha near me, neither any friends whit this kind of knowledge about Nirvana or other similar questions, so its good to have a place like NB to brief this kind of questions and get some new input :)
  • Am I smelling teen spirit here?
    MaryAnneSabre
  • No No, iam very old actually! Or maybe Curt Cobain can answer for me, he have the notes.
  • DairyLamaDairyLama Veteran
    edited November 2013
    Jason said:


    .... the commentarial tradition of Theravada, as well as many scholars such as Bhikkhu Bodhi, take the position that "nibbana is not only the destruction of defilements and the end of samsara but a reality transcendent to the entire world of mundane experience, a reality transcendent to all the realms of phenomenal existence." Hence nibbana doesn't depend on any causes or conditions, including the existence of human beings.

    This is an interesting question, and I think analogous to whether the realms are seen as objective planes of existence or subjective psychological states - or both.
    In terms of moving towards the Deathless, I think one can look at it in terms of either connecting internally or externally - or both.
  • SilouanSilouan Veteran
    edited November 2013
    Another Christian perspective: All clear distinct ideas are a form of ignorance; true knowledge is an infinite ignorance. - Evagrius Ponticus;Kephalaia Gnostica
    FullCircle
  • matthewmartinmatthewmartin Amateur Bodhisattva Suburbs of Mt Meru Veteran
    Here is my modern, relatively secular reinterpretation. It's my personal motivation for engaging in buddhism:

    Nirvana is peace, the sort of happiness where you aren't ecstatic or sad, but a sort of balance see-saw in the middle at peace-- a state of equanimity, where you can still react, but aren't overly bother by things or jumping up and down happy about it.

    I think it can be obtained in this life, before you die, by a lay person or a monk, maybe animals (maybe it's easier for an animal, hard to ask them if they feel at peace). I think it is easy enough that modestly smart and modestly talented people can achieve it. I think non-buddhists can achieve it accidentally and monks might have a easier time of it because they simplify their life down the the point there the problem of finding peace is more manageable.

    But the more I read about monks, I'm not sure about if monastic life makes things simpler. Where I struggle with the complexities of a job and family, Zen monks struggle with the complexities of applying a stamp perfectly straight, mapping the tiny crevices in the wall they zazen at and the minutia of ringing bells-- the small stuff just gets magnified until it fills the consciousness again.
  • the small stuff just gets magnified until it fills the consciousness again.
    Too true. I do hear that in the Purelands everyone is suffering over who gets to radiate the most metta. My sort of suffering . . .
    Vastmindmatthewmartinanataman
  • Maybe all of you have seen this video before, anyway here is what Thich Nhat Hanh think what Nirvana is...



    VastmindJeffrey
  • anatamananataman Who needs a title? Where am I? Veteran
    That was a very beautiful speech by TNH - I have never walked personally with him and don't expect to but he is welcome to come to my home. Mentally he is the one beside me who is non-judgemental and is one of my personal guides. Walk and pray.. Walk and pray.

    Thank you for this post namhada

    Few people inspire me - well done - in this way!
    Namada
  • It is knowing the game so that the game can be played.
  • anatamananataman Who needs a title? Where am I? Veteran
    All are TEACHERS and STUDENTS.

    Just have faith in the ability to be what you already are... How lucky are 'you' and 'I' to be incarnate... Let me provide a definition of incarnate: to embody or represent (something or/and/not/with/equal to nothing) in human form.

    Clouds - Rain - River - Sea - evaporate (repeat) - life is a cycle of birth, death and re-birth - (Nirvana?) - But this is just a point a view. It is not 'the view', it is a concept. When it is fully understood 'I' cannot conceptualise 'it' that is Nirvana... Or do you conceptualise it otherwise?

    These online Sanghas are really just worlds of words and sentences that convey the limits of our understanding and fragility and suffering. Sometimes they ring true sometimes not.

    Just be honest and true to yourself.

    Mark Twain said - 'If you never tell a lie you never have to remember anything'






  • Simply put, Nirvana a state of mind, where all desires, attachments and delusions are extinguished. It is neither a place or time, just a state of consciousness.
  • Billyboy said:

    It is neither a place or time, just a state of consciousness.

    Though Nirvana is unconditioned, and consciousness isn't, so...?
  • edited November 2013
    @Namada

    Nirvana literaly translated means a blowing out, extinction, or extinguishing. The syntactic implications of this can be deduced from the fire sermon. In other words there is no more suffering. By no more suffering i mean exactly that, there is no suffering in nirvana. The difficulty for sentient minds regarding this principal lies in the fact that buddhas and arhats live in the world and in nirvana. The buddha still dies, he still feels hunger and thirst, he or she still gets sick. The 3rd noble truth says that there is an end of suffering, it does not say that there is and end of phenomena. In nirvana there is still cause and effect, but for a buddha there is no pain in any effect.

    Think of it this way, pain is only pain because one sees it as such. If you remove the negative associations from pain all it is is sensation; it is nerves firing, the same nerves that feel pleasure. Phenomena are devoid of a self or intrinsic essence, this does not mean that they are not there; it means that the "nature" of theses occurences are projections of the mind.

    The reason getting beaten hurts is becuase being beaten leads to death. If it was simply the impact that caused pain, we would fear hitting someone as much as being hit because the body in turn impacts the fist. One can and often does break ones hand upon hitting someone.

    Death, likewise, is nothing but the cesation of bodily function; it is the end of a chemical reaction. The reason we fear death is because of our associations with death. Damnation, greving, the unknown, these are the pains not death it self.

    Conversely the same is true of pleasure.

    A buddha or arhat, has looked so deeply upon the world, and all of its suffering, for so long that he or she has perfectly realized this truth in every function. His or her mind is not the same as a sentient beings because instead of the ingrained tendency for aversion and attatchment, he or she has ingrained the tendency for buddhahood.

    If you do not believe me, the next time you meditate make sure you are hungry. Cast aside all of your persistant thoughts about your hunger, let go of your emotions of frustration, lethargy, and otherwise, and sit quietly and peacefully looking one pointedly at your hunger.

    I have done this many times, apart from the sensation in your stomach there is an atendent lightness and coolness in the body that is actualy kind of nice, and also once the mind is setled, for and hour or so it is more calm and focused than when full. Again we only see hunger as pain because it leads to death, all our atendent frustrations and anxietys arise from that. It takes several weeks to die of hunger, why are we so frigtened?

    The buddha saw this in all the sufferings of his life, when you can do that as well it is called nirvana.

    Right view, right view, right view, right view, right view!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    The first and most important of the 8.

    Om mani padme hum
    Gate gate paragate parasamgate bodhi svha
    Namadapegembara
  • Neither said:


    Think of it this way, pain is only pain because one sees it as such. If you remove the negative associations from pain all it is is sensation; it is nerves firing, the same nerves that feel pleasure.

    Not really, there are distinct pain receptors which give rise to the physical sensation of pain.
    Dennis1
  • Neither said:


    Think of it this way, pain is only pain because one sees it as such. If you remove the negative associations from pain all it is is sensation; it is nerves firing, the same nerves that feel pleasure.

    Not really, there are distinct pain receptors which give rise to the physical sensation of pain.
    Then why to some people get aroused by being spanked.
    Not that there is anything wrong with that.
  • robot said:

    Neither said:


    Think of it this way, pain is only pain because one sees it as such. If you remove the negative associations from pain all it is is sensation; it is nerves firing, the same nerves that feel pleasure.

    Not really, there are distinct pain receptors which give rise to the physical sensation of pain.
    Then why to some people get aroused by being spanked.
    Not that there is anything wrong with that.
    Sure, mild pain is stimulating to some people, but severe pain would I think be unpleasant for everyone.
  • Perhaps you could learn about the three ignorances which cause bewilderment. Nirvana is Samsara without the bewilderment. Samsara is just what is. Freedom from cyclic existence is accomplished by non-bewildered awareness. The cycle is one thought followed by another and another etc. The Buddha said " When a person was looked for none was found." So what would reincarnate? The Buddha makes his view clear in the Prashnaparamita Sutra. We recreate our small self continuously with discursive thought. It is the self-cherishing-motivated, cycle of unaware existence which compulsively creates the self-over and over and over, which ceases and allows unbewildered awareness. We cease the third ignorance (creating the imaginary in order to have an external view of self). Best, Dennis
    JeffreyNamadaInvincible_summer
  • anataman said:

    No person can show Nirvana if it is liberation from self, but the buddhas teachings can help realise it. 'I' doubt if 'I' can help 'you' any more than that; just start with the 4 Noble Truth's and see where that leads 'you'...

    Good luck - there is the middle way just over there, it's quite interesting and there are some nice stories about it, but it is easy to get a little lost at times so it's a good idea to pick up the free guide about the eight-fold path that is really an extension of the 4NTs and may be useful along the way

    ah here's one, take it if you will:

    http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/8foldpath.htm

    No it's not explosive, but could be expansive

    Anataman: Thank you this is an excellent resource. I read it and it is very fine.
    Some things are worth seeing many times. This teaching is like that. mtgby

  • Namada said:

    I understand Nirvana is the ultimate goal of the spiritual path, but when you dont really know what Nirvana is what then? Faith will come into picture? You believe if I do good now, i will receive some good later or (if iam lucky) come to Nirvana.

    And we do good to others because the karma will bring us to a Nirvana state. Is it the ego speaking?
    "Do compassionate deeds, but Dont expect to get anything back" they say,
    but deep inside we laugh and say "We will get reward sooner or later".
    Is it the egoistic mind speaking, is it hypocritical?

    And who is counting the karma? Who decide if you are going to be an animal next life, or a flower or coming into Nirvana. So there need to be a Judge/God?

    Its about faith i think...faith in what Buddha said..or should we kill the Buddha?

    I like your comment but I would like to say: You do for others because you care for others. You help because you want to see others uplifted. You are available because you hope to be used. Bodhicitta isn't for merit. Merit is a consequence not a motivation. The motivation is the aspiration that the good may accrue to the other person. Without this motivation Buddhist practice is like grasping after heaven for the sake of self. Buddha never taught that. Do good for others and take no notice of the self in the mandala. Isn't that why the Mandala is destroyed. To help us learn to cease self grasping? may the good be yours-mtgby.

  • When I try to find dukkha. There she is.
    When I try to find Nirvana. Nothing.
    Bliss! :)
  • Dennis 1 I agree with you, its not the merit for or own sake we are seeking, but the well being for the other person.

    Anyway I think Buddhism its kind of counterproductive when its coming to helping others in a strange way. We are supposed to not cling and get attached, but if we dont have this kind of feelings how can we help our self or others?
    You do metta meditation because you are attached to your self, and others. You cling to it, and as long as you are attached and are clinging its difficult to let things go.

    But Maybe some of you have heard about Hiri, and Ottapa?

    I found it another forum where they defines it as: "Hiri (moral shame) and ottapa (moral fear), which are collectively said to be "guardians of the world" in the sense that they provide self-restraint and help forestall degeneration into shameful behaviours".

    So there is fear involved in the path of liberation, fear of not doing right effort, fear of not having the right view?

    Have some of you heard about Hiri and Ottapa?







    Dennis1
  • Good Craving, Clinging, Becoming.

    "...All too often in the Buddhist world, we're told that desire is a bad thing, it causes suffering. But the actual truth is that there are good and bad desires."
    Namada
  • Obama felt a glimpse of Nirvana here?



  • pegembarapegembara Veteran
    edited December 2013
    The cessation of dukkha through the ending of desire, aversion and delusion by the thorough comprehension of the nature of samsaric existence.
    can it be experienced only after death?
    No
    And when the humanity is gone will Nirvana dissolve as well? Plants/animals cant read Dharma and attain enlightenment
    (and humans will not exist again because the sun is gone).
    Samsara and nirvana will make sense only to human like intelligence.
    Was Buddha the first person to come into this state, and how did he know this, just like Jesus open up heaven, Buddha opened up Nirvana?
    No. He was not the first nor will he be the last.
    Dennis1NamadaJeffrey
  • bad desire is the cause of Samsara. That is desire motivated by self grasping. Desire motivated by Bodhicitta is not 'bad' desire but is still karma forming as the cat lady experiences when suffering because of other peoples suffering.

    Cyclic existence can be viewed as the compulsive creation of thought after thought.
    This is dual perception or thought with an object. Not simple awareness.
    This is from Shantidiva and I'm pretty sure that is the Dalai Lama's view also. Gautama said: "when a person was looked for none was found." What would reincarnate.
    Probably not the person.
    Namada
  • DaftChrisDaftChris Spiritually conflicted. Not of this world. Veteran
    Nirvana? Of course I know what it is...a grunge band from the 1990's. :p

    In all seriousness, I have absolutely no idea what Nirvana is; as, at least as far as I know, I haven't experienced such a thing.

    Perhaps Nirvana is something completely different than what most people consider it to be? Maybe it's not a literal place of bliss, but merely an idea. Or maybe it's a state of being.

    Perhaps Nirvana is nothingness itself?
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