Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Examples: Monday, today, last week, Mar 26, 3/26/04
Welcome home! Please contact lincoln@icrontic.com if you have any difficulty logging in or using the site. New registrations must be manually approved which may take several days. Can't log in? Try clearing your browser's cookies.

The Hermit May Have Become a Befitting Way to Be....

A short history of my past self:

During adolescence, many acquaintances met at the park during school. My impression was that these are friends, while smoking and acting like total territorial baboons around their girlfriends. They called themselves my friends. We had many things in common, then.

But as time went by the realization struck that these acquaintances are the mirrors of my self. Some things that I saw brought me joy; where as, other things made me want to deny them of my presence.

Now, at the of 37, I have lost touch with all of them but one. He even invited us over to his house for a nice vegan meal. He is a loyal character. I turned him down, today, despite the special bond that we have.

Four precious teenagers are my children now. They have lost interest in having a father as a "buddy" and found many other friends their age group. I am fine with this. They are getting to know how the social world feels to them, also. It is their turn.

It is rather simple to let them go because for seventeen years, now, the closet, literally, has been my stead. Here, solitude is preserved to meditate, write, create ceremonies, fast, practice the craft, play music, and delve in secrets with nobody to impress. It is private here. It is a source of fulfillment. It is where understanding is met. Joy is found in this closet; however, it precludes friends and family and this doesn't bother me.

My friend and children have decided to deem my presence as one who is "the hermit," also a "cave man." We are well bonded. All of us are. But they're right. As much of a bond that we have, solitude is a great part of that bond.

Now... My knowledge of the wisdom of Buddhism is severely limited. But trishna is a thirst or a kind of attachment, greed, lust, craving, clinging, etc. to impermanence, anitya. According to Buddhism, this contributes to more suffering, duhkha. Well... My thirst is for solitude.

Isn't solitude a permanence?
Let's discuss this, please.

Comments

  • robotrobot Veteran
    edited July 2011
    Where is your wife in all of this? My guess is she gave up on trying to live with someone who stays in the closet.
  • Mr_SerenityMr_Serenity Veteran
    edited July 2011
    We all thirst solitude once in a while, and most of us also thirst human interaction. But if you were truly fine with being a hermit, maybe you would not have to post your thoughts on here. I think we naturally crave socialization more than we crave solitude, but there is a balance. There is beauty in both solitude and socializing.

    When friends I like invite me out, I tend to go. Friends are rare, and sometimes not easy to make good ones. Relationships while always temporary like everything, are special when they're there. In my opinion they're what makes life more meaningful. Self love and exploration of the world on your own is great. But relationships are unpredictable, fun, nourishing, they're supposed to bring love to our lives.

    Relationships with people test many factors of our intelligence and wisdom. In essence having relationships with people is a huge part of what Buddhism is meant for. So they're special. I enjoy them too much to consider being a hermit. But you have to look deep and ask yourself why you want something and if it seems genuine then just go for it, and maybe eventually you will want something different.
  • edited July 2011
    @robot
    LOL!
    What ever my wife's, ex-wife's story is, it is her own. If I delve in to that then I would be telling a story that isn't mine.

    My apologies, robot, but, I will not tell you where she is. She has rights to her privacy and it is not good action to reveal where a person is to strangers. LOL!

    But, this is what has to be said about my solitude. It is due to my fulfillment with people as to why solitude is so fulfilling. The closet is just one of those places. If it was out in the deep wood by a lake or a river, I wouldn't even be on this site. I would have no internet. But, I work and am a single father. My way wasn't always what my friend and children call, "that of a hermit."

    If you are wondering, now, about my parental skills, they are functional. After work we clean the house together. We speak to one another, they do most of the talking. My daughters and I cook together and their brother, we dine together, listen to one another; however, when it is time to do homework, I resign to the closet until they are done and check on them. If all is well, they get their rewards of leisure, and I resign to the closet again. Other than that, my presence as a parent is ever known to them.

    However, the time will come when they will leave their father first before their father dies, alone, of old age like many others. Only, my aloness will not be dealt by loneliness, but met in solitude. I look forward towards that.

    On the other hand, in the distant past, loneliness was wallowed until I could wallow no more. But, rest happened and the next day found me fulfillment in solitude. Lesson learned: Loneliness is such an unnecessary emotion.


    @MrSerenity
    Good question.
    Supposedly, tossing this out now seems to be helpful because I have children. They have certain requirements that they have expressed. They would like to see their daddy have friends.

    So, upon doing some recollection of previous meditation, Buddhism seemed to be very close to something beneficial towards a compassionate life changing decision. Yes this change, it is for their joy and I am seeking for a source of joy for all of us.

    I am on this site to see the source towards fulfillment that Buddhism provides the followers of it, just so that I know if this is worth it or not. This is my path of inquiry because my requirement is to see for myself if the middle way is worth the sacrifice.

    Socializing outside of my children and, occasionally, my one loyal friend has never really appealed to me. LOL! I don't even have a facebook! I do have my own email address for work, but not for this social site. This is the digital age and I must step up to it. This social site seems to be the only choice for me.

    However, If there were no responsibilities, the closet would be of no use. My stead would be faraway by a river or lake with plenty of wind. I love the sound of it and the look and sound of moving water, the trees, etc......

    But, being a single dad doesn't provide those privileges.

    However, when the lucky shots have started their own lives my walk will take exile as my permanent life after. My trust is beyond reasonable doubt that everyone will find joy in the end. I will just go.
  • aMattaMatt Veteran
    edited July 2011
    Ideally, the hermit doesn't stay in the cave. He removes himself from the dance of humankind in order to find stability and clarity. That stable clarity could benefit others.

    I understand how exile and solitude is comforting, nourishing. However, you have strength and compassion that could be of great service to others. In terms of investment, going into the cave and helping one, helps one. Going into the community and helping many, helps many.

    Perhaps Buddhism could help you uncover why the cave is far more peaceful for you than being out and about. Both contain moving atoms, bouncing light. What is it that disrupts your peaceful resolve? Consider that that might be a good place to look, because if you could be as nourished helping the community as sitting alone in your cave, wouldn't you rather help others?
  • @aMatt

    I am touched by your answer, aMatt. I will contemplate on the strength of stable clarity and post later.

    My thanks to you, with Deep Peace and much respect to you, aMatt.

    SimpleWitness
  • (...)
    Isn't solitude a permanence?
    (...)
    no...
    anicca
  • @Vincenzi

    Anicca...... What is anicca, Vincenzi? ⁠
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited July 2011
    My friend and children have decided to deem my presence as one who is "the hermit," also a "cave man."
    ;D
    But trishna is a thirst or a kind of attachment, greed, lust, craving, clinging, etc. to impermanence, anitya. According to Buddhism, this contributes to more suffering, duhkha. Well... My thirst is for solitude. Isn't solitude a permanence?
    The Buddha said an attribute of a good monk/hermit/caveman is 'delighting in solitude'.

    In Buddhism, the word for solitude is 'viveka', which, at its highest level, is a synonym for Nirvana.

    There are three kinds of solitude, namely: physical solitude, mental solitude (mind with meditative concentration/jhana) and spiritual solitude (mind free from attachment & self-view).

    Thirst (tanha/trishna/lust) for solitude is only a problem if we begin to shut out necessary relationships (for example, when we see our son thru the window coming to visit us, we run and hide, under the bed, or somewhere).

    Genuine solitude is peace & freedom and in-tune with the mind/heart.

    Kind regards

    DD :)

  • @Vincenzi

    I read about it and came to a laughter at my self for having attempted to cling to permanence...LOL!

    "The three kinds of feelings, O monks, are impermanent, compounded, dependently arisen, liable to destruction, to evanescence, to fading away, to cessation — namely, pleasant feeling, painful feeling, and neutral feeling."

    Anicca is impermanence! That IS the only permanence.
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited July 2011
    in Buddhism, Nirvana is permanent thus spiritual solitude can be permanent

    it is conditioned things (rather than the unconditioned element) that are impermanent

    the unsankhata dhatu (unconditoned element) is permanent

    :)
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited July 2011
    'Do I take delight in solitude?' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an10/an10.048.piya.html
    Bhikkhus, how do the seven factors of awakening that one has developed and made much of perfect knowledge (vijja) and liberation (vimutti)?

    Bhikkhus, a bhikkhu in this Training develops mindfulness as a factor for awakening that depends on viveka (solitude, aloneness), that depends on viraga (fading away), that depends on nirodha (quenching), that leads to vossagga (dropping away, letting go).

    He develops analysis of dhammas as a factor for awakening... persistence as a factor for awakening... rapture as a factor for awakening... serenity as a factor for awakening... concentration as a factor for awakening... equanimity as a factor for awakening dependent on solitude, dependent on fading away, dependent on cessation/quenching, resulting in relinquishment/letting go.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.118.than.html
    Like a lion — forceful, strong in fang,
    living as a conqueror, the king of beasts —
    resort to a solitary dwelling.
    Wander alone
    like a rhinoceros.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/snp/snp.1.03.than.html
    :)

  • I once read a scholar's words that he sought to study Buddhism in pursuit of answering "how do i live without exploiting others" (do no evil). I think that's a good way to put ethics into perspective. I don't think you would be exploiting anyone in the closet. Then again, are you neglecting some sort of commitment to those around you?

    In light of Buddhism, I think solitude would be considered a permanence since it would be non-attachment to people/socializing. However, in light of other world views, such as the Craft, I think there's an understanding that there is a deep interconnectedness between all life. Some people can make conscious contact with others while being alone. Is that solitude?
  • My friend and children have decided to deem my presence as one who is "the hermit," also a "cave man."
    ;D
    But trishna is a thirst or a kind of attachment, greed, lust, craving, clinging, etc. to impermanence, anitya. According to Buddhism, this contributes to more suffering, duhkha. Well... My thirst is for solitude. Isn't solitude a permanence?
    The Buddha said an attribute of a good monk/hermit/caveman is 'delighting in solitude'.

    In Buddhism, the word for solitude is 'viveka', which, at its highest level, is a synonym for Nirvana.

    There are three kinds of solitude, namely: physical solitude, mental solitude (mind with meditative concentration/jhana) and spiritual solitude (mind free from attachment & self-view).

    Thirst (tanha/trishna/lust) for solitude is only a problem if we begin to shut out necessary relationships (for example, when we see our son thru the window coming to visit us, we run and hide, under the bed, or somewhere).

    Genuine solitude is peace & freedom and in-tune with the mind/heart.

    Kind regards

    DD :)

    Neither my friend nor my children are familiar with Buddhism, so to go as far as to say, "I'm a monk;" past life, perhaps? Certain behaviors of mine tend to attribute that. But, I would be too speculative at this point of my consciousness to speak of it with certainty.

    However, it is purely sacred space to be with simplicity, that has my interests. A healthy bond develops between people me, yet, they just seem to be too burdensome, most of the time. So, to refrain from going beyond what I must do in order to work or live with them, I withdraw to my closet to be and witness each day that has come to pass on the screen of my mind by crafting, gazing, listening to the ringing in my ears, feeling my lungs breath, discovering secrets that I never knew about the self, etc. There's a new one, now, and that is having discussions on this site by means of my cell after all of these things. lol!

  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited July 2011
    I once read a scholar's words that he sought to study Buddhism in pursuit of answering "how do i live without exploiting others" (do no evil).
    This scholar obviously does not understand Buddhism, given he regards the essence of Buddhism as social morality.

    The Buddha himself advised his path is not for the sake of morality but for the unshakeable freedom of mind. (see MN 29 & 30)

    In summary, all Buddhas teach: (1) do not evil; (2) be ready to do good; (3) purify the mind

    Regards :)

  • 'Do I take delight in solitude?' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an10/an10.048.piya.html
    Bhikkhus, how do the seven factors of awakening that one has developed and made much of perfect knowledge (vijja) and liberation (vimutti)?

    Bhikkhus, a bhikkhu in this Training develops mindfulness as a factor for awakening that depends on viveka (solitude, aloneness), that depends on viraga (fading away), that depends on nirodha (quenching), that leads to vossagga (dropping away, letting go).

    He develops analysis of dhammas as a factor for awakening... persistence as a factor for awakening... rapture as a factor for awakening... serenity as a factor for awakening... concentration as a factor for awakening... equanimity as a factor for awakening dependent on solitude, dependent on fading away, dependent on cessation/quenching, resulting in relinquishment/letting go.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.118.than.html
    Like a lion — forceful, strong in fang,
    living as a conqueror, the king of beasts —
    resort to a solitary dwelling.
    Wander alone
    like a rhinoceros.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/snp/snp.1.03.than.html


    :)

    This brings me happiness to have read. Thank you very much for sharing the Buddha, Dhamma Dhatu.

    :)
  • You're welcome :)
  • edited July 2011
    @eChrisr
    .................Then again, are you neglecting some sort of commitment to those around you?

    ........ However, in light of other world views, such as the Craft, I think there's an understanding that there is a deep interconnectedness between all life. Some people can make conscious contact with others while being alone. Is that solitude?
    It is by being ever present for my children that we have such a healthy bond.

    While crafting mandalas, weaving straw, carving candles, scribe work in various writings in languages, creating ceremonial poetry, etc. It is done with a sober mind. There is no aspects of entities, if that is what is implied.

    My practice is true pure solitude. There is liberation that provides a sense of ecstasy sometimes, other times there is the joy of witnessing what is on the screen of the mind, there are also times that I just sleep and rest, when the energy to be mindful is low. Its the most simple way to be in harmony with existence.

    :)


  • jlljll Veteran
    IMO, solitude is wonderful & a necessary part of the spitirual path.
    In our society, most people fear solitude.
    It is considered strange, even abnormal to like solitude.
    I think instead of justifying the need for the love of solitude,
    those who dislike it should contemplate on why they find solitude so
    difficult.
    As my wise teacher say, 'we are all petending to be something'.
    Perhaps, when alone, we can be our true self......
    .....and to discover ........anatta......
  • What is anatta, jll? Where in the Dhamma can I find it?
  • @SimpleWitness

    anicca is impermaneance.
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited July 2011
    Anatta = "not self"

    It means, ultimately, nothing we have in life really belongs to us or is 'us'

    The natural physical & mental phenomena 'we' interact with are just 'gifts' or 'borrowed goods', experienced during 'borrowed time'

    :)

  • edited July 2011
    @Dhamma Dhatu

    Yes! 'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.' [SN 22.59]

    When sitting alone, thoughts begin and end in repetition. They are not resisted. They are welcome until their relations fulfill their span and dissipate on their own. The whole time they were being witnessed, they never defined any part of anything, neither within nor without.

    Every-time this happens there is a point when there is no thought, no self, no judgment of form at all, nothing is analyzed. It just witnessed until the mind goes totally blank and that's when the secrets happen from within: An awareness that is beyond what words will symbolize; but, it is just a glimpse of it. It is supremely profound!

    Ugh! If only this could be communicated better.

    Well it can, perhaps this is what the Buddha is speaking of here:

    You do not have to read all of it, as I'm sure you already have. I'm just overjoyed.

    [SN 22.59]

    "Form, monks, is not self. If form were the self, this form would not lend itself to dis-ease. It would be possible [to say] with regard to form, 'Let this form be thus. Let this form not be thus.' But precisely because form is not self, form lends itself to dis-ease. And it is not possible [to say] with regard to form, 'Let this form be thus. Let this form not be thus.'

    "Feeling is not self...

    "Perception is not self...

    "[Mental] fabrications are not self...

    "Consciousness is not self. If consciousness were the self, this consciousness would not lend itself to dis-ease. It would be possible [to say] with regard to consciousness, 'Let my consciousness be thus. Let my consciousness not be thus.' But precisely because consciousness is not self, consciousness lends itself to dis-ease. And it is not possible [to say] with regard to consciousness, 'Let my consciousness be thus. Let my consciousness not be thus.'

    "What do you think, monks — Is form constant or inconstant?"

    "Inconstant, lord."

    "And is that which is inconstant easeful or stressful?"

    "Stressful, lord."

    "And is it fitting to regard what is inconstant, stressful, subject to change as: 'This is mine. This is my self. This is what I am'?"

    "No, lord."

    "...Is feeling constant or inconstant?"

    "Inconstant, lord."...

    "...Is perception constant or inconstant?"

    "Inconstant, lord."...

    "...Are fabrications constant or inconstant?"

    "Inconstant, lord."...

    "What do you think, monks — Is consciousness constant or inconstant?"

    "Inconstant, lord."

    "And is that which is inconstant easeful or stressful?"

    "Stressful, lord."

    "And is it fitting to regard what is inconstant, stressful, subject to change as: 'This is mine. This is my self. This is what I am'?"

    "No, lord."

    "Thus, monks, any form whatsoever that is past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near: every form is to be seen as it actually is with right discernment as: 'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.'

    "Any feeling whatsoever...

    "Any perception whatsoever...

    "Any fabrications whatsoever...

    "Any consciousness whatsoever that is past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near: every consciousness is to be seen as it actually is with right discernment as: 'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.'

    "Seeing thus, the well-instructed disciple of the noble ones grows disenchanted with form, disenchanted with feeling, disenchanted with perception, disenchanted with fabrications, disenchanted with consciousness. Disenchanted, he becomes dispassionate. Through dispassion, he is fully released. With full release, there is the knowledge, 'Fully released.' He discerns that 'Birth is ended, the holy life fulfilled, the task done. There is nothing further for this world.'"

    That is what the Blessed One said. Gratified, the group of five monks delighted at his words. And while this explanation was being given, the hearts of the group of five monks, through not clinging (not being sustained), were fully released from fermentation/effluents.

    :)
  • robotrobot Veteran
    How does solitude change anything apart from eliminating the distraction of interacting with other people? If in solitude one continues to distract one self with various activities, what is gained. If, while in the company of others one believes they are 'not alone', or are somehow joined with another person or persons, in what way is that possible? Are you really more alone on your journey simply because others are not present? I think that this is a solitary journey whether or not I am in the company of others. Craving for company feels the same as craving the distraction of tv or reading or many other activities that I can engage in while alone. I like to be alone, but I am not convinced that the depth of my realization would increase with an increase in my time spent in solitude.
  • @robot

    The search for depth may be your journey, robot. However, it is not everybody's.

    The solitude is the freedom to be not the self; but, having joy with it by all of these means. There is fulfillment in it that is gained in solitude that can be shared with others when time has it.

    My joy is found by the simplicity of various practices with nobody to impress. It is not found by the journey to seek depth.

    Depth is endlessly equivocal. It deals unnecessary suffering to the mind. It is best not to journey down a pit of that which is not meant to be understood before it is time.

    Respectfully, robot.
    SimpleWitness
  • robotrobot Veteran
    Simplewitness,thank you. Perhaps I should have used the word breadth.If freedom of not-self gained in solitude reverts to I/other when in company, where is attainment? What I was getting at was that the concept of solitude or multitude is illusory and comes down to the level of distraction that one is subject to. Thats the way it seems to me anyway. I like to be alone to watch movies, cook, use the internet and meditate. When I want company I phone one of the kids, or go to the gear store for a coffee and some bs.
  • @robot
    The purpose for being added to this site, robot, benefits inquiry. Witnessing the followers of the Buddha and of his doctrine is very effective on this path of it.

    The way to know the supreme masters is by witnessing their followers, without a single judgment. My discovery is availed by seeking a healthy practice within, true, it is also interconnected by seeking the healthy practice which is without. Everybody's way of this is different. My way is as a witness. If it deepens upon awareness it is a virtuous path on its own, however, if it dissipates upon awareness it had no virtue to begin with.
    So, my thirst is for solitude. The way to a conscious decision to be on a path is done by inquiry alone with nobody to sway a view this way or that. In solitude, there is no other to thwart the path but self. There is no one to start blame, but the self, which becomes endless blame until we decide to be as the witness in our solitude without either. This is where the path always has been and always will be.

    The results are supreme fulfillment of a phenomenal awareness: spiritual solitude. The passion of what was once self dissipate become a very creative energy: solitude of mind. This fulfillment is shared with all at once we are fulfilled with our physical solitude. Much like picking up the phone to call the ones we are bonded with. The results of simplicity is being.

    My trust is that this is sensible.

    Respectfully, yours robot.

    SimpleWitness
Sign In or Register to comment.