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All that I am is the result of all that I have thought - Buddha.
DaltheJigsaw
Mountain View Veteran
All that I am is the result of all that I have thought - Buddha.
Discuss!:)
Do thoughts create our realities?
Discuss!:)
Do thoughts create our realities?
0
Comments
awareness is before and after a mental phenomena.
so you can feel your fingers on your keyboard, which would be the pure experience/awareness of it. then you can overlay and idea onto that pure experience. like "fingers", "keyboard", etc.
when there is no thinking, there is no you. when there is no judgement, there is no you or other.
it's rather straight to the point. no thinking, no you. think and there you are.
some people walk around reality only seeing solutions.
some people walk around reality only seeing food.
some people walk around reality only seeing sex partners.
the buddha walks around reality only seeing infinite potential.
I like the Gil Fronsdal translation.
Ch 1. Dichotomies, verses one and two...
"All experience is preceded by mind,
Led by mind,
Made by mind.
Speak or act with a corrupted mind,
And suffering follows
As the wagon wheel follows the hoof of the ox.
All experience is preceded by mind,
Led by mind,
Made by mind.
Speak or act with a peaceful mind,
And happiness follows
Like a never-departing shadow."
So I think the quotation needs attribution, first of all, because that doesn't sound to me like something the Buddha would have said.
The quotation fails to account for karma and external reality as well.
Did the people of Libya think Kadafhi into existence? I think not.
For a grounded view of mind only school (cittamatra) I recommend Khenpo Gyamptso Tsultrim Rinpoche's Progressive Stages of meditation on Emptiness, a book. It was very interesting and it encouraged me that all (traditional buddhist or tested) views are ways of attaining the same goal. To alleviate suffering. Each can be a good meditation.
so in a way we do create the evil in the world from our thoughts.
even if we harbor "good" thoughts. good only exists when evil exists. vice versa. they are dependent on each other.
conservatives create democrats and democrats create conservatives. they are both taking a fragment of objective reality and creating an idea that "they project" as the way we should view reality. both are right and both are wrong. either way it is all baseless because reality allows for everything.
life does happen. bad things and good things happen. now what you think about or how you interpret that "event" is up to you.
What if I had gotten a different draft (conscription) number for the Vietnam War? In 1970, those numbers actually were determined by lottery, as in they actually used those ball-tumblers like they use at church bingo. Did that depend on my thinking it?
What if that woman had not hit on me at my friend's wedding and subsequently had not made my life a living hell? Did that depend on my thinking as well?
And finally, the Grumpy Old Fart thinks this belongs in General Banter because it's by no means an advanced idea. The GOF just got up from his nap.
Thinking creates this and that. Thinking creates the buddha, suffering, liberation, vice versa. Cut off thinking and there just is reality as it is. Whether you live in pain or you live in luxury. That is reality.
And here's a theory or hunch from what I've experienced in my "short" life. Everything happens for a reason. There are no accidents or random acts. Any "what if" situation is just a thought. All thoughts are baseless.
Thus when you don't label reality, you see reality as it is. NO division.
Much love.
I sympathize with the great wondering and feeling surprised that something worse than what has happened to me hasn't. My friend in highschool (not too close) broke his back and became paralyzed. I was very depressed and had social anxiety and felt like I couldn't help him.
Though they make you wonder that isn't what I was critical of. I think absolutely wonder why things happen. We may not get an answer but asking isn't wrong.
What I am critical of is dismissing mind only school. It is a valid view just as the shravaka - emptiness of skandas. It has a history and powerful thinkers. My point was that we use these views to avoid suffering rather than as philosophers to find the right answer.
"A whole lot of what I am is a result of getting hit by a car and getting my brain smooshed when I was 25." To take away that part of what I am means that "All that I am is the result of all that I have thought" is not true.
And the quotation still hasn't been definitively attributed to the Buddha yet anyway. So what we have here is one of those discussions that go in a circle based on a quote that hasn't been substantiated.
In Africa over the past few decades, thousands of women were raped as acts of war between powers that wanted to control the natural resources and wealth. That's no hypothetical. That's real. Or did all those women just think they were raped?
In Fronsdal's notes to the first two verses, he points out that the Pali version of the Dhammapada is the only one that uses the expression "manomaya", which means "made by mind". The other versions use an expression that means "impelled by mind".
the buddha says, "all that i am is the result of all that i have thought". the buddha is referring to identity. thinking creates "i, my, me". don't think and where are you?
it's not saying that thought itself can make things happen.
thinking in accordance with action can make people do crazy shit. it can also make people do good things.
thinking also creates a false division that is baseless. when that is removed. you won't have problems like people getting raped for natural resources.
it all stems from thinking.
Here is the actual quote I found, dazzle had it dhamapada ch.1 v.1 & 2
I have a great deal of confidence in this translation, and feel it is one of the - if not THE - MOST accurate translations.
Original:
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sltp/Dhp_utf8.html#v.1
Translation:
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/dhp/dhp.01.than.html
1-2
Phenomena are preceded by the heart, ruled by the heart, made of the heart. If you speak or act with a corrupted heart, then suffering follows you — as the wheel of the cart, the track of the ox that pulls it.
Phenomena are preceded by the heart, ruled by the heart, made of the heart. If you speak or act with a calm, bright heart, then happiness follows you, like a shadow that never leaves.
Pick the bones out of that!!
I think generally that people are dismissive of the mind because science has found that mind is outside its scope. As such it can only test brain function and behaviour. It is left with the black box problem of which no suitable solution has been found. So many scientists think of mind as brain by default, which is completely unscientific as there is absolutely no proof of this. As mind is completely intangible, ie experience is not part of the physical domain, any possible future proof of brain and experience seems unlikely.
The argument is that when you state that experience is the domain of mind, people automatically assume that you are denying the role of the brain in our existence. That is not true, all that I'm denying is that mind is exclusively emergent from the physical body.
Back to OP, my personal preference is to consider the mind only interpretation of reality as it is very good in highlighting the role of mind in the Buddhist path. Physical reality can be said to exist, yet it is observed through the filter of the mind, so that it doesn't really matter about the ontology of the situation as what really matters is the soteriological view.
Finally its a personal preference, if this doesn't resonate with some then opt for a dualistic view of physical/mind. I suppose that a purely physical view of reality could work as well, though this view doesn't withstand intensive analysis and would tend to end up as either eternalistic or nihilist in outlook depending on whether one is considering matter or mind.
Four monks were meditating in a monastery. All of a sudden the prayer flag on the roof started flapping.
The younger monk came out of his meditation and said: "Flag is flapping"
A more experienced monk said: "Wind is flapping"
A third monk who had been there for more than 20 years said: "Mind is flapping."
The fourth monk who was the eldest said: "Mouths are flapping!"
(It always makes me giggle)