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Impermanence and friendships? Do all come to an end?

StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
edited August 2011 in Buddhism Basics
As we should not attach to anything in this life, guess friendships fall in this category to.

In your opinion all friendships end besides the reason is death?

Lets say your very good friends with this person and then something changes and it come to an end? Whats the insight of buddhism when it comes to friendship?

Personally I feel they all come to an end so there is no point even calling it a friendship, just some people that at some point in time you will hang out and cooperate, but all they are bound to end. At least thats been my expirience.

What you people say? :nyah:

Comments

  • MountainsMountains Veteran
    People change. People grow together, then often they grow apart. The simple act of growing apart does not always imply an end point however. I have several friends whom I might not communicate with for sometimes years at a time. But when we do pick back up, it's as if we'd spoken the day before yesterday. But sometimes there is an end point. And that's just the way life is. That is no reason to value friendship any less when it does happen though. That's a cynical view that could extend into every area of life. Life is going to end, so why bother doing anything? Well, because you've got decades (probably) before it ends, so why not make the best of every moment between now and then? Think of all the good you can do. Think of all the joy a friendship can bring to you, your friend, and the world. If you just blow it off because you know the friendship is going to end "someday", you'll go through life very lonely.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    People change. People grow together, then often they grow apart. The simple act of growing apart does not always imply an end point however. I have several friends whom I might not communicate with for sometimes years at a time. But when we do pick back up, it's as if we'd spoken the day before yesterday. But sometimes there is an end point. And that's just the way life is. That is no reason to value friendship any less when it does happen though. That's a cynical view that could extend into every area of life. Life is going to end, so why bother doing anything? Well, because you've got decades (probably) before it ends, so why not make the best of every moment between now and then? Think of all the good you can do. Think of all the joy a friendship can bring to you, your friend, and the world. If you just blow it off because you know the friendship is going to end "someday", you'll go through life very lonely.

    Thanks for the wisdom Mountains
    :)

    I think you are right, but im not going to that cynical extreme you mention. Is just that there is no reason to think that they will stay there forever. And as you say when the time is proper enjoy them but no to attach to them. The example you put about your friends that spend years withouth talking but when meet again enjoy as you where talking everyday, when you meet in a proper time its nice but if you cant is indifferent?.


  • Kwantum_KevKwantum_Kev
    ... but im not going to that cynical extreme you mention.Is just that there is no reason to think that they will stay there forever. And as you say when the time is proper enjoy them but no to attach to them.
    I think you summed it up perfectly right there StoicBuddhistAlex. The Buddha taught moderation, and so it is with friendships and everything else - and that includes our views on those things.

    True, we must accept their impermanence. But just because the sunset at the end of a day is impermanent, does that mean we find no joy in it for the few minutes that it emblazons the sky with its beauty? Something to ponder.

    Namaste'

    Kwan Ken

  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited August 2011
    What you people say? :nyah:
    I say true friendship never ends (except by death)

    The Buddha spoke often about true frienship vs false friendship (at the links)

    With metta (friendship) :)

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/snp/snp.2.03.irel.html

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/dn/dn.31.0.nara.html

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn45/sn45.002.than.html
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    ... but im not going to that cynical extreme you mention.Is just that there is no reason to think that they will stay there forever. And as you say when the time is proper enjoy them but no to attach to them.
    I think you summed it up perfectly right there StoicBuddhistAlex. The Buddha taught moderation, and so it is with friendships and everything else - and that includes our views on those things.

    True, we must accept their impermanence. But just because the sunset at the end of a day is impermanent, does that mean we find no joy in it for the few minutes that it emblazons the sky with its beauty? Something to ponder.

    Namaste'

    Kwan Ken


    Thanks for your reply
    :)

    Actually this is something that is hapening to me. My best friend looks not to want to spend time as in the past. So im using this to reflect on impermanence.

    Seems to me that he is saying farewell.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    What you people say? :nyah:
    I say true friendship never ends (except by death)

    The Buddha spoke often about true frienship vs false friendship (at the links)

    With metta (friendship) :)

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/snp/snp.2.03.irel.html

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/dn/dn.31.0.nara.html

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn45/sn45.002.than.html
    Wow very nice links altough i really didnt get the one of the holy life of monks. Im to dumbo :dunce: LOL

    Very nice guidelines for friendship :)


    My best friend seem to want distance when in the past we shared a lot of time. I really dont remeber best friendship than that. But now he seems to want to go separate ways.


    So I guess this is a farewell. Dont want to be needy or puching to much, I feel I did my part now is his time to show any signs or farewell...
  • goshikigoshiki
    In Buddha is pure emptiness , there is all equal and same . In knowing purity , there is no relationship in Buddha , my son is not "mine" even my body is not mine . Nothing is connected to others as all living and non-living is on their own purification process in their way , their own speed , they own awareness , changing shapes , transform to be pure .
    In search of Buddha....we cannot "owned" others including ourself .
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited August 2011
    Buddha taught & functioned according to both conventional & ultimate reality

    This is one title & quality of a Buddha, one who teaches both essence & convention

    For example, if I ask a person for help and they refuse, they are not a friend. why are they not a friend? because they do not demonstrate the act of friendship

    similarly, if a person calls me "friend" but do not act to help me, they are not really a friend. the Buddha called such "false friends". why? because they do not demonstrate the act of frienship

    'Friendship' is good-will. It does not have to be 'personal'

    Understanding such distinctions is the difference between an enlightened mind :) and a zombie mind :wow:
  • andyrobynandyrobyn Veteran
    edited August 2011
    Hi DD, I also say that true friendship never ends - I have been fortunate to be a part of at least two true friendships in my life and in both there have been long periods of time when for a variety of reasons there has been no contact. I have found that true friends can not always act and help in the way that we would like them to and this is a part of the nature of true friendship.
  • ZendoLord84ZendoLord84 Veteran
    i've lost friendships and i've gained them.....
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    In Buddha is pure emptiness , there is all equal and same . In knowing purity , there is no relationship in Buddha , my son is not "mine" even my body is not mine . Nothing is connected to others as all living and non-living is on their own purification process in their way , their own speed , they own awareness , changing shapes , transform to be pure .
    In search of Buddha....we cannot "owned" others including ourself .
    Its hard to apply that but its seems to be the moest healthy way.

  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Buddha taught & functioned according to both conventional & ultimate reality

    This is one title & quality of a Buddha, one who teaches both essence & convention

    For example, if I ask a person for help and they refuse, they are not a friend. why are they not a friend? because they do not demonstrate the act of friendship

    similarly, if a person calls me "friend" but do not act to help me, they are not really a friend. the Buddha called such "false friends". why? because they do not demonstrate the act of frienship

    'Friendship' is good-will. It does not have to be 'personal'

    Understanding such distinctions is the difference between an enlightened mind :) and a zombie mind :wow:
    In my case seems to me that there was a friend in some time who demostrated the friendship but now is going away and saying no more frendship with his actions.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Hi DD, I also say that true friendship never ends - I have been fortunate to be a part of at least two true friendships in my life and in both there have been long periods of time when for a variety of reasons there has been no contact. I have found that true friends can not always act and help in the way that we would like them to and this is a part of the nature of true friendship.
    If there were good reasons that made impossible to have some fun toghether then no problem. But when about the only reason is that they suddenly no longer want to be your friends.

  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Actually is something like this:

    http://questionland.com/questions/1169-are-you-bothered-when-people-dont-want-to-be-your-friend-anymore-and-they-wont
  • andyrobynandyrobyn Veteran
    I have found that focusing on being a friend to others rather than getting friendship from a particular person is a good way forward.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    I have found that focusing on being a friend to others rather than getting friendship from a particular person is a good way forward.
    Very sound advice. But some times people dont even wana be your friend or look to exploit you.
  • andyrobynandyrobyn Veteran
    Yeah, unfortunately .... it takes time to get to know people, and it is not realistic to expect people to be always be and act the way we think they are !!!
  • NOTaGangstaNOTaGangsta
    When your character improve, you will know when to leave drop kick punk "friends" and get to know Good People that helps you improve.

    Change yaself nikkah!!!
  • yemanjayemanja
    people always change and there is always a point when they behave in a way you are not expecting!for myself it is very strange because i seem to accept more things from certain persons it must be a sort of natural connection or even karma but the most difficult is to go through disapointment! i never knew so much people are loosing their friends as i do i thought i was especially resentful or not gifted to keep friends but it seems to be that everything must come to an end it is the natural evolution of things.. the word friend itself has to have the right definition!what is a friend? i find difficult to cope with disapointment and to forgive people but if i try it does not come naturally i wonder what is the buddhist method to be able to talk again normally to somebody that did something bad to you.. it seems to me it will never be like before because some disappointing stuff has happened and i know i have to work on that it is difficult to read the buddhist teachings about compassion and to find the way to apply them ! it is not always coming from the heart! who can tell me more about that cause even when i try i do not feel like to have compassion or to forgive even if my intellectual side says yes.. and i loose the past friends for that!YEMANJA
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    edited August 2011
    Yeah, unfortunately .... it takes time to get to know people, and it is not realistic to expect people to be always be and act the way we think they are !!!
    Guess we really dont know anybody
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    When your character improve, you will know when to leave drop kick punk "friends" and get to know Good People that helps you improve.

    Change yaself nikkah!!!
    Heheh. Hard to know what to change.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    people always change and there is always a point when they behave in a way you are not expecting!for myself it is very strange because i seem to accept more things from certain persons it must be a sort of natural connection or even karma but the most difficult is to go through disapointment! i never knew so much people are loosing their friends as i do i thought i was especially resentful or not gifted to keep friends but it seems to be that everything must come to an end it is the natural evolution of things.. the word friend itself has to have the right definition!what is a friend? i find difficult to cope with disapointment and to forgive people but if i try it does not come naturally i wonder what is the buddhist method to be able to talk again normally to somebody that did something bad to you.. it seems to me it will never be like before because some disappointing stuff has happened and i know i have to work on that it is difficult to read the buddhist teachings about compassion and to find the way to apply them ! it is not always coming from the heart! who can tell me more about that cause even when i try i do not feel like to have compassion or to forgive even if my intellectual side says yes.. and i loose the past friends for that!YEMANJA
    Thanks for your deep answer. With my best friend or at least what i tought to be be a "friend", i know that at some point we were realy friends but now he just seem to not care and try to avoid me. I already stoped calling him or anything but as you say now that i know that he droped me as a friend and he didnt care about the friendship, I dont know if I can even act in a heartufl good way to him. I feel the only reasonable thing is to be indiferent to him. Yes people do change and this been the same with all good buddies i had in my life. They come and they go.

    Maybe is not about forgiving or anything but act and think indifferent to them.

    But yeah you are not alone when it comes to having friends that walk away from you. Its not that im perfect but at least with that friend i know i wasnt bad to him in such a manner to totally drop on me in that way.


    At least sex is more honest than all this so called "friends".

  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Its something like:

    My friendships never explode, they just sort of dissipate when I realize that, hey, I've been the one setting everything up and they never call me so screw em
  • andyrobynandyrobyn Veteran
    edited August 2011
    Yeah, unfortunately .... it takes time to get to know people, and it is not realistic to expect people to be always be and act the way we think they are !!!
    Guess we really dont know anybody
    Yeah, I remember having that very thought, in a disillusioned way - with myself, more than anything, at a time when I was in uncertainty in regard to relationship in my life.

  • andyrobynandyrobyn Veteran
    Yeah, unfortunately .... it takes time to get to know people, and it is not realistic to expect people to be always be and act the way we think they are !!!
    Guess we really dont know anybody
    Yeah, I remember having that very thought, in a disillusioned way, in regard to myself more than anything when I was uncertain regarding the nature of relationship in my life.

  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Yeah, unfortunately .... it takes time to get to know people, and it is not realistic to expect people to be always be and act the way we think they are !!!
    Guess we really dont know anybody
    Yeah, I remember having that very thought, in a disillusioned way - with myself, more than anything, at a time when I was in uncertainty in regard to relationship in my life.


    Yeah we maybe dont even know ourselfs.

    Is just sucks that when you trust in somebody so much that he knows all of you, your secrets, your dreams etc. and seems to be the best friend and sudenly he acts in a way like if you are disgusting and you are making all the effort.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Hhahaha the only thing i like about this is that for sure im gona end up stronger from this hardship. This only proves buddhism about attachment and desire.

    To add one more point.

    I see the "friend" all fridays. I even go to church to hang out with him not becouse i belive in it. His family is very chatolic so they kinda force him to call me all fridays to go to his house have dinner and then go church. In the past we talked and have fun but now he acts distant. He puts the TV instead of talking. He seems to hate the situation. And i kinda know that if i stop going he is never going to talk to me again.. So im planing to quit going to his house and say farewell for ever. What sucks is that he knows all my secrets, dreams etc. wich kinda make me feel vulnerable.
  • auraaura Veteran
    Do you suppose that all the music stops playing in the great dance of life and everything comes to a halt when someone suddenly withdraws from hanging out with friends to pursue a slow private dance with a potential love relationship or to pursue the dancing whirlwind of a potential new direction of personal or career growth?

    Authentic friendship blesses others on their journeys and their growth and realizes that partnerships and alliances have life according to where one is intent on going...
    not according to where one has been.

    Once you know where you are going...
    you will observe that in the great dance of life dancers change partners all around, but that the music of life never stops playing...
    and there will always be people volunteering to share the fun of your best creations and adventures.
  • auraaura Veteran

    I see the "friend" all fridays. I even go to church to hang out with him not becouse i belive in it. His family is very chatolic so they kinda force him to call me all fridays to go to his house have dinner and then go church. In the past we talked and have fun but now he acts distant. He puts the TV instead of talking. He seems to hate the situation.
    On Friday nights he wants to go socialize with that cute girl...
    but his family forces him to call you on Friday nights to go to his house and have dinner and then go to church...
    because they want to guarantee that he goes to church instead of pursuing that cute girl (unless perhaps she attends the same church and they know and approve of her family).

    In the past spending time with him was fun... but now he turns on the television instead of talking.
    If his family is very Catholic, he is not going to talk about it and likely does not even possess the skills to talk about it, but heck, if he were a rabbit, he would have chewed through the bars of his cage by now...
    What does any of this have to do with you or friendship at all?
  • SpacelessSpaceless
    It will materialize into the supreme love of buddha nature :thumbsup:
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Do you suppose that all the music stops playing in the great dance of life and everything comes to a halt when someone suddenly withdraws from hanging out with friends to pursue a slow private dance with a potential love relationship or to pursue the dancing whirlwind of a potential new direction of personal or career growth?

    Authentic friendship blesses others on their journeys and their growth and realizes that partnerships and alliances have life according to where one is intent on going...
    not according to where one has been.

    Once you know where you are going...
    you will observe that in the great dance of life dancers change partners all around, but that the music of life never stops playing...
    and there will always be people volunteering to share the fun of your best creations and adventures.
    Hehehe yeah i think i was in the anger stage. But now im kinda tranquil. Thanks for your words of wisdom.

    Wish him the best in his life.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran

    I see the "friend" all fridays. I even go to church to hang out with him not becouse i belive in it. His family is very chatolic so they kinda force him to call me all fridays to go to his house have dinner and then go church. In the past we talked and have fun but now he acts distant. He puts the TV instead of talking. He seems to hate the situation.
    On Friday nights he wants to go socialize with that cute girl...
    but his family forces him to call you on Friday nights to go to his house and have dinner and then go to church...
    because they want to guarantee that he goes to church instead of pursuing that cute girl (unless perhaps she attends the same church and they know and approve of her family).

    In the past spending time with him was fun... but now he turns on the television instead of talking.
    If his family is very Catholic, he is not going to talk about it and likely does not even possess the skills to talk about it, but heck, if he were a rabbit, he would have chewed through the bars of his cage by now...
    What does any of this have to do with you or friendship at all?
    Well what i was triying to say is that I should break any contact with him, especially this wich is based on force i guess. And by force nothing is good.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    It will materialize into the supreme love of buddha nature :thumbsup:
    Guess the buddha will say that im attached and I have selfish love. Guess the buddha will say that i bee thankful for the time i spent and now let go and wish him the best :)
  • yemanjayemanja
    i wonder still what is involved when we decide to be indifferent to a friend.. i feel this is not right still and maybe some resentment is in it! to me friendship does not mean so much cause i had all sorts of surprises when i broke my ankle and ends up without help even from my own family i realise people always misunderstand us or are not aware of us the way we should like this must have been my karma to spend one or two days with a bag of potatoes when i needed somebody to shop for me!even my mother went to vacations and my best friend two streets further did not even show up for a week!everybody is leading their life quite selfishly and we too probably! it is hard to meet and all we can do is give thanks when it happens!but to tell you the truth really relationship is very limited we better find the peace within no matter what happens!it is nice to meet total stranger in a public place or a plane and have sometimes a deep talk with them a good exchange and maybe this is the best relationship: it happens right now and this is enjoyable and fine .. for myself i have more pleasure nowadays with this kind of exchange where nothing is expected!am i too pessimistic?YEMANJA
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    i wonder still what is involved when we decide to be indifferent to a friend.. i feel this is not right still and maybe some resentment is in it! to me friendship does not mean so much cause i had all sorts of surprises when i broke my ankle and ends up without help even from my own family i realise people always misunderstand us or are not aware of us the way we should like this must have been my karma to spend one or two days with a bag of potatoes when i needed somebody to shop for me!even my mother went to vacations and my best friend two streets further did not even show up for a week!everybody is leading their life quite selfishly and we too probably! it is hard to meet and all we can do is give thanks when it happens!but to tell you the truth really relationship is very limited we better find the peace within no matter what happens!it is nice to meet total stranger in a public place or a plane and have sometimes a deep talk with them a good exchange and maybe this is the best relationship: it happens right now and this is enjoyable and fine .. for myself i have more pleasure nowadays with this kind of exchange where nothing is expected!am i too pessimistic?YEMANJA

    Thanks for sharing your story =). I dont think you are pessimistc just realistic and wise.

    With that mentality you avoid all the emotional attachment and still aprecciate and have fun in the moment.

  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    i wonder still what is involved when we decide to be indifferent to a friend.. i feel this is not right still and maybe some resentment is in it! to me friendship does not mean so much cause i had all sorts of surprises when i broke my ankle and ends up without help even from my own family i realise people always misunderstand us or are not aware of us the way we should like this must have been my karma to spend one or two days with a bag of potatoes when i needed somebody to shop for me!even my mother went to vacations and my best friend two streets further did not even show up for a week!everybody is leading their life quite selfishly and we too probably! it is hard to meet and all we can do is give thanks when it happens!but to tell you the truth really relationship is very limited we better find the peace within no matter what happens!it is nice to meet total stranger in a public place or a plane and have sometimes a deep talk with them a good exchange and maybe this is the best relationship: it happens right now and this is enjoyable and fine .. for myself i have more pleasure nowadays with this kind of exchange where nothing is expected!am i too pessimistic?YEMANJA
    Yes we live very selfish lives.

    This are words from a guy of other forum:

    Friends are an a temporary illusion. As they say, you come into this world alone and you will leave it alone. Do not fret about friends. Do not think of yourself as lonely or hurt. You are alone, you always will be. Get comfortable with that and you need not worry about these silly things like temporary friends.

    L'Etranger C'est Moi a
  • BeachHouseGuyBeachHouseGuy
    No
  • footiamfootiam Veteran
    Friendship changes and can change towards the better. When it ends, it leaves a beautiful memory.
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    No
    No what xD?
  • StoicBuddhistAlexStoicBuddhistAlex Veteran
    Friendship changes and can change towards the better. When it ends, it leaves a beautiful memory.
    Good way of taking things. In that way you never loose :)
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