A question (is it wrong?)

kc39850p

Okay, a kind of non-hypothetical hypothetical question for you. Avoiding wrongful speech is one of the ten perfections, but I can't decide if what I did is wrong.

See, I work with an amateur musician. He has a great voice, and writes is own songs, but can't get anywhere because he has no connections. And suffers from a bit of a race issue, as he sings R&B, but is white, and thus is often written off by most people he tries to work with.

So, I came up with an idea. I told him a good way to increase his popularity would be to do something charitable. I suggested releasing his songs as singles for a dollar each, and donating 100% of the proceeds to charity.

I figured at the time, that I was doing good. I was suggesting something that would both benefit those in need, and at the same time help my friend. But now, reflecting on it, I realize I did not make my good intentions clear, and I feel as though I manipulated my friend into doing good without him knowing he's been manipulated. Though I suppose both will be better off, it's win/win after all. charities make money, and he gets his music a little further out there. But I still feel guilty.

Does this seem wrong to anyone else? Or is it justifiable because it's good for everyone? even though I manipulated my friends greed to do it (because ultimately I know he wants to become wealthy).

zenff

The “buddhist” way of looking at it, I suppose, is this.
The crucial thing is intention.
Your intention was to help a friend. That’s a good intention.
In the process you wanted to get some money to charity. There’s nothing bad about that either.

You blame yourself for not getting the same helping intention into the head of a friend. Don’t blame yourself for that.
Your friend is responsible for his own intentions. (He’s the owner of his karma if that sounds better to you).
When we trick someone else into doing something good/bad, for that person, all that counts is his own intention.

Also there's no buddhist rule against trying to make some money.

vixthenomad

I'm only a novice but I can't see anything wrong with this. There was no deception or trickery involved and your friend is (presumably) a grown-up and able to see every advantage and disadvantage of your suggestion for himself, and to exercise his right to say "thanks but no thanks" if he didn't agree with it.

Mountains

Why do you feel guilty for making a suggestion to him on a way to increase his popularity and success? Am I missing something? As Vix noted, your friend has the right to do whatever he wants to, and it sounds to me like he'd be wise to take your suggestion.

kc39850p

It's not that I feel guilty over the outcome, so much as the fact I hid my intentions, as good as they may have been, in order to deceive a friend. I know he's an adult, and responsible for himself, but that's no excuse. I don't believe humans are ever really grown, seeing as my perception of karma is cause and effect. The intention was to cause a good effect, but I feel as though I did it through an innapropriate means. Kind of like, if you kill a predator to protect another animal. The intention was good, but the way in which it was achieved is wrong. And I'm reinforcing my own negative karma by lying. like if I lie this time and it works out well, then am I really going to believe that to lie is wrong? Which according to the ten precepts, it is. I just don't know if what I did was the best way to go about it.

vixthenomad

I must confess, I'm a little confused as to what you thought you were lying about. I feel like a piece of the puzzle is missing somehow. You didn't mention lying in the original post. (Or if you did, I'm missing the reference.) If you have genuinely and intentionally lied, then own the action and do what you can to rectify it then move on. If not, then what are you stressing about?

I think comparing what you've done to killing a predator to save another animal is maybe a bit of an exaggeration. Perhaps it's time to stop using the precepts as a stick to beat yourself with and focus on doing what you can to make the situation right, if indeed there is anything to make right.

I know I sound blunt, and if I have caused pain by doing so then I am truly sorry. Just that I think it is possible to take the regret thing too far and make oneself into a martyr, which doesn't help anyone, least of all you.

With kind regards
Vix

Mountains

I don't understand what you were "lying" about. You made a suggestion to your friend. How is that lying or deceitful?

You told your friend to do something charitable. That's good. If doing that brings him success in his endeavor, you should both be happy about it. There was no lie that I can see.

Scott

I agree with both vix and Mountains. Even though you didn't tell him your intention was to help other people as well, saying that he should give the money to charity would have probably made that clear to him. I'm sorry if I'm missing something, but I don't really see how this would go against the precepts. To me it seems like a good act all around.