Enlightenment as a goal

dkode

Hello,

After reading around on some forums and wikipedia, I was wondering about the general consensus of enlightenment.

I see alot of people discussing it and such, what I am curious about is if in the buddhist lifestyle, if this is a strong goal for all buddhists or more really of something you keep in the back of your mind?

I came across one article from a person claiming to be enlightened. In it, he describes that only once you stop trying to achieve enlightenment does it become available to you. He also goes on to say that there is nothing to achieve, everyone is in truth enlightened (I think he means from his point of view), there is nothing to seek and nothing to strive for.

I think my belief thus far is that enlightenment is not a direct goal, if I am meant to be enlightened in this cycle, then it will be bestowed upon me, or is this wrong and should all buddhists strive for enlightenment as it being the final goal of buddhism.

Sorry if this brews a flame war, but I am curious about this.

federica

I personally believe a person can become enlightened in their lifetime. However, it is not something "out there", or to be worked for; some external explossive happening. All you need to do to become enlightened is to release all conditioning, attachment, craving, clinging and desire, and understand the transitory impermanence of all things... it really is that simple. Let go of entrenched opinions, of feeling the need to get somewhere, and just be.

There is a little saying that goes:-
"If people were presented with two doors, one marked 'Enlightenment' and the other marked 'How to achieve Enlightenment' - most people would still go for the second door."

You are enlightened. You're just not 'awake'.

dkode

that is quite interesting.

I think as a general population, we try to strive for "instruction manuals" for everything we do. Like you mentioning people choosing the second door.

Even though the solution seems so simple, because of the way we are conditioned as you mentioned, we have a hard time letting go and letting nature guide us.

That gives me a great degree of insight. Thank you!

Frizzer

As a follower of zen (Soto Zen) I believe that we are already enlightened, it's just that we've covered it up and forgotten it's there.
I was listening to a talk at our group meeting on Monday and one of the monks was saying that we should get out of the habit of thinking that we practice to gain enlightenment. Practice IS enlightenment, they can't be separated.
I like that idea but I'm still trying to get my head around the concept !

Brian

I think westerners are, almost wholesale, confused about enlightenment. I believe that we think it is a state that can be "reached" - a goal to be permenantly attained and then it never goes away.

I am slowly learning that enlightenment is found in the moment, and nowhere else. I think that's what they mean when they say "stop seeking enlightenment to find enlightenment".

My most peaceful moments have been just that - moments.

YogaMama

Frizzer wrote:

I was listening to a talk at our group meeting on Monday and one of the monks was saying that we should get out of the habit of thinking that we practice to gain enlightenment. Practice IS enlightenment, they can't be separated.
I like that idea but I'm still trying to get my head around the concept !

I love that idea as well. I will spend some time trying to get my head around it too....

not1not2

Also, I prefer the term 'awakening' to 'enlightenment' personally. This seems less like some exotic, transcendent state that is impossible to achieve. Instead we become more awake and aware and live life more deeply, especially in relationship to the 4 noble truths. In order for this to happen, it has to be in the forefront and in the back of my mind, though this does not mean thinking 'I must get enlightened'. Instead it means continually reaffirming my practice by actually practicing. It means that I am continually reasserting awareness towards suffering as it arises, the cause of that suffering and the cessation of that suffering. I am also taking notice which actions lead the cessation of suffering and which do not, and I adjust accordingly.

Anyway, gotta go.

take care

_/\_
metta

Jason

dkode,

There are many different views and opinions regarding this question. To tell you the truth, I do not know why. It is my guess that there are many reasons, and many explanations which come from various different points of view. I personally take many of my answers concerning the Dhamma directly from the Pali Canon. There are many Suttas in the Pali Canon that deal specifically with the goal of the holy life. The Buddha did his best to explain this goal in every possible way, and one of the best ways to do this was through the use of similes. The reason is that Nibbana is by nature undifferentiated, and words simply fail to grasp what cannot be grasped by the intellect. In essence, Nibbana can only be pointed to. In the Pali Canon, the Buddha explains that final liberation is something that can be experienced by the devoted practitioner, even in this very life. He explains that Awakening comes about not by wishful thinking, but only through deliberate effort. One Sutta in particular that illustrates this through various similes is the Nava Sutta:

At Savatthi. There the Blessed One said, "I tell you, monks: It is for one who knows & sees that there is the ending of the effluents. For one who knows what & sees what is there the ending of the effluents? 'Such is form, such its origination, such its passing away. Such is feeling... Such is perception... Such are fabrications... Such is consciousness, such its origination, such its passing away.' It is for one who knows & sees in this way that there is the ending of the effluents.

"Even though this wish may occur to a monk who dwells without devoting himself to development — 'O that my mind might be released from effluents through lack of clinging!' — still his mind is not released from the effluents through lack of clinging. Why is that? From lack of developing, it should be said. Lack of developing what? The four frames of reference, the four right exertions, the four bases of power, the five faculties, the five strengths, the seven factors for Awakening, the noble eightfold path.

"Suppose a hen has eight, ten, or twelve eggs: If she doesn't cover them rightly, warm them rightly, or incubate them rightly, then even though this wish may occur to her — 'O that my chicks might break through the egg shells with their spiked claws or beaks and hatch out safely!' — still it is not possible that the chicks will break through the egg shells with their spiked claws or beaks and hatch out safely. Why is that? Because the hen has not covered them rightly, warmed them rightly, or incubated them rightly. In the same way, even though this wish may occur to a monk who dwells without devoting himself to development — 'O that my mind might be released from effluents through lack of clinging!' — still his mind is not released from the effluents through lack of clinging. Why is that? From lack of developing, it should be said. Lack of developing what? The four frames of reference, the four right exertions, the four bases of power, the five faculties, the five strengths, the seven factors for Awakening, the noble eightfold path.

"Even though this wish may not occur to a monk who dwells devoting himself to development — 'O that my mind might be released from effluents through lack of clinging!' — still his mind is released from the effluents through lack of clinging. Why is that? From developing, it should be said. Developing what? The four frames of reference, the four right exertions, the four bases of power, the five faculties, the five strengths, the seven factors for Awakening, the noble eightfold path.

"Suppose a hen has eight, ten, or twelve eggs that she covers rightly, warms rightly, & incubates rightly: Even though this wish may not occur to her — 'O that my chicks might break through the egg shells with their spiked claws or beaks and hatch out safely!' — still it is possible that the chicks will break through the egg shells with their spiked claws or beaks and hatch out safely. Why is that? Because the hen has covered them, warmed them, & incubated them rightly. In the same way, even though this wish may not occur to a monk who dwells devoting himself to development — 'O that my mind might be released from effluents through lack of clinging!' — still his mind is released from the effluents through lack of clinging. Why is that? From developing, it should be said. Developing what? The four frames of reference, the four right exertions, the four bases of power, the five faculties, the five strengths, the seven factors for Awakening, the noble eightfold path.

"Just as when a carpenter or carpenter's apprentice sees the marks of his fingers or thumb on the handle of his adze but does not know, 'Today my adze handle wore down this much, or yesterday it wore down that much, or the day before yesterday it wore down this much,' still he knows it is worn through when it is worn through. In the same way, when a monk dwells devoting himself to development, he does not know, 'Today my effluents wore down this much, or yesterday they wore down that much, or the day before yesterday they wore down this much,' still he knows they are worn through when they are worn through.

"Just as when an ocean-going ship, rigged with masts & stays, after six months on the water, is left on shore for the winter: Its stays, weathered by the heat & wind, moistened by the clouds of the rainy season, easily wither & rot away. In the same way, when a monk dwells devoting himself to development, his fetters easily wither & rot away."

Jason