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Giving up earthly possesions
Last week, I asked my mom (I would say mother, but it dosen't make a difference to her or me) for some money to buy school materials with. When I came back home, the first thing I did was give back the change, plus on an impulse, decided to see what it would be like to give up all of the money I had on me. I gave up the last of it, even change to where my pockets were empty, except for my documents. I felt the same way without the money as I did with it. However, she said "hold on to it" and I accepted it as charity. It's happened a couple of times. What does it mean if I am able to relinquish personal items without feeling a loss? I heard giving up earthly possesions mentioned, but in today's world, I understand that is only feasible for the monks and "nuns", to live off of charity only.
P.S. I have shelter and everything I need because I live so close to my school, it is impracticle for me to move out before graduating, so I do have everything I need pretty much, plus many gifts. I don't have room for a meditation area or even for an altar because of fear of backlash from the family - how should I treat that?
P.S. I have shelter and everything I need because I live so close to my school, it is impracticle for me to move out before graduating, so I do have everything I need pretty much, plus many gifts. I don't have room for a meditation area or even for an altar because of fear of backlash from the family - how should I treat that?
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Comments
Continue to cultivate this feeling. Sometimes feeling loss isn't the point; sometimes giving personal stuff isn't the point. The point changes, but attachment is subtle. This is a good way to start.
I don't think you don't need any of it. Perhaps others would disagree. It's nice to have a dedicated space, but sometimes having a space leads to more attachment. The important thing is to continue to cultivate mindfulness. Continue your practice, whatever it is. Just do it. Nothing else matters.
Peace,
As far as space for meditation is concerned, my thoughts on that are pretty simple. You should be able to meditate in a 6' by 4' bamboo prison box in Southern Asia. lol! Meditation doesn't have to be formal all the time, either. You can study in a meditative way. You can walk in a meditative way. It's all about being aware and paying attention to what's going in right in front of you in this very moment. You don't need to build anything to meditate. All you need is your mind. When you're paying attention to your driving and staying alert, you're meditating. You can sit on a cushion on the floor of your room and practice formal sitting meditation. You don't need a special space.
Even though Tibetan Buddhism is what I'm most attracted to, I'm also drawn to the simplicity and minimalism of Zen Buddhism. I like the idea of training myself to be able to meditate even of I'm surrounded by loud noises and other distractions. I don't want to form bad habits in which I'm dependent upon things like chanting, silence, incense, and a shrine to be able to meditate. I want to be able to do it even if I'm being tortured. You know what I mean? Under any and all circumstances.
But that's just me. I like things to be simple and uncluttered and since I have very little control over my surroundings the only place I can exercise simplicity is inside myself. But being able to focus is not one of my challenges so it's easy for me say that I don't need the techniques others use. I know, for example, that they're are many people who have brain chemistry that makes focusing on one thing very difficult, if not impossible and they may need things to help them build they're ability to focus well enough to be able to meditate. For these people, chanting and other techniques are essential. For others these techniques are tools and they're able to meditate without them.
Keep in mind that what I'm saying is the opinion of a beginner who is having trouble understanding the significance of Buddhist accessories. I understand that having a personal temple with pictures and offerings and such are meaningful and useful but this idea is lost on me. I don't want to become dependent upon tools that produce a certain mind frame or ability to visualize. I want to be able to practice under any situation. I think this has a lot to do with personality. So this is my personal answer. Lots of caveats, eh? And I have a sneaking suspicion that I'm missing something somewhere regarding the issue of the whole Buddhist meditation tools thing. But as we are often encouraged to approach practice with the mind of a beginner I'm not too ashamed to admit it. lol!
Brigid
Brigid
Anyway, its late. I've had another very trying day. Good to see everyone now and always.
Peace,
This is a very different thing to releasing 'stuff' voluntarily, and there is an accompanying sense of loss... despair, even.....
On a Human plane, it is very frightening...it feels as if one is caught in a maelstrom, and there is no means of finding a hand-hold to steady the experience.....Everything is out of your control, and the only thing guiding it is circumstance and the Will of others....
Relinquishing control in this way, is a very sobering experience.....I have never before been in the situation where every single thing I do is governed by the decisions other people make...Decisions over which I have absolutely no say whatsoever.... And awaiting uncertain outcomes is daunting, to say the least.
On a Spiritual Plane, I would be completely lost without my Buddhist practise.
All the people I love are alive, so I have, to date, not had an opportunity to put what I have learned, into practise.
Well, now, I have. And I know, hand on heart, that without the Support of the Buddha, the Dharma and particularly, the Sangha, there is every possibility I would not have survived the onslaught.
Whilst my 'outside' manifestation has known and been deeply affected by all that has happened, my Interior 'Self' is more composed, serene and at peace than I would ever have thought possible.
Let go of every physical vestige of personal property you want.... You'll have to in the End, anyway.....
Never, ever get rid of the overwhelming and abiding virtues of Love and Compassion.
For others, and for yourself.
I'm cool, Quest. I just like to compare my life to that of a political prisoner or other wrongly imprisoned person and apply it to my practice in an effort to be build a practice with no holes. When I'm behaving like a spoiled rotten Developed World brat it helps to slap me back into reality and feel grateful for what I have.
Brigid
Thank you.
Brigid
Human beings tend to acquire more than is strictly needful. Having lived in a community that was vowed to poverty, we novices noticed that we still had food, shelter, warmth, etc., whereas, on the streets of the city up the road, we had brothers and sisters who slept on benches and under bridges. Our "poverty" was defin ed as having no individual possessions. Indeed, we did not say "my book" or "my toothbrush"; they were "our book", "our toothbrush". We found this unsatisfactory but were under obedience.
Renunciation of the things we no longer want is the easiest thing in the world. Now find the things that you will regret giving away - and give them. Learn to experience and transform the regret that you will feel, the loss. This is what ego does: it clings.
To give you a personal example: I used to have a near-perfect memory, trained and honed by techniques that were handed down to me. I could tell you on what page of a specific book a particular phrase could be found and quote the paragraph. I needed no address book or diary. Then, a dozen years ago, I had a heart operation and lost great swathes of memory! It took me quite a time to stop raging/being annoyed by my new forgetfulness. Being a 'mystrical Christian' at the time, I came to a place where I could receive the gift of being stripped of memory. I could see it as a gentle present from Holy Wisdom, taking away my pride!
As an ageing socialist (yes, there are still some of us, keeping the flame lit), I also subscribe to Pierre-Joseph's 1840 statement:
La propriété c'est le vol.
(Ownership is theft)
Good post Simon. Thanks.
But.... I can't help it. Is having guitars(plural) a bad thing? I love playing music.
I also have more vehicles than I really need.
I feel like a whore.
-bf
we have already discussed this.
I gave you a solution.
so far you have declined.
I think handing over a prize collector's item would do much to appease your sense of self-debasement.
But Oooooooh, no.
OK.
I tried.
Let me know if you reconsider.
I have bought the fluffy dice and a Starsky cardigan.
Just in case.
Not to pressure you or anything.
As ever,
'Lead-Foot.'
Anyway, the money I gave away (that was later used for necessity - food) would have been used to buy more trading cards, something that I have/had a passion for. I had the money to buy many cards, so I guess in a way, it is sort of like giving away a prized item. Although since it was mentioned, I could give away my car or Xbox, pretty much anything I need to (except my laptop - I don't necessarily give away items receieved through charity) that I once treasured.
Unfortunately, this outfit would probably fit better in my car
-bf
Is having possessions the same as attachment?
Is losing attachment the same as having to give it away?
Can you think of a circumstance where you would gladly give up them?
Do you spend time worrying about them reather than doing more worthwhile things?
If you feel like a whore at least you place some value to yourself
You can keep your guitars if I can keep all of my shoes !
Namaste,
Michelle
p.s I truly enjoy your sense of humor
Hmmmmmmm.......
That was it.
Like the questions though....
Letting go has everything to do with attachment...that's the whole point, but there's a big difference between 'attachment' and clinging or grasping....
Some attachments are positive and constructive....like attachment to the Eightfold Path and the Five Precepts....But a possessive, negative attachment, like jealousy (to be extreme) is destructive and a distraction from your practise....
I know this kind of came out of the blue but it's been on my mind a lot recently. Sorry. Now I've gone and harshed everybody's fun buzz. :-/
Great thread, though (until I posted, lol!). I was LMAO for a while there.
Brigid
I guess the only answer to this is to be Mindful, and to understand that we're all interconnected... What we do to others, we do to ourselves....
One of my favourite quotations is:
"Be ye not afraid to shew a kindness to strangers,
For thereby have some entertained Angels unawares."
Angels is as angels does.... it works both ways.
I know this to be true.
I guess my real challenge is with people I already know, like family and some friends. I see myself really clearly when it comes to strangers or acquaintances but sometimes I lose myself with people that are close to me. We have history with our family and friends and I've noticed that I'll withhold sometimes, with certain people, and not treat them nearly as well as I would a stranger. It's like I'm not as generous with them, maybe because I'm still holding on to the past, to my anger and resentment. Well, not maybe, definitely. I can be generous in many ways and to many people and other beings but I can be terribly miserly with my own "loved ones". I have more work to do on impartial compassion and lovingkindness. I want to be fully aware of this which is probably why I'm writing this out for you all to see. Once a Catholic...lol! I'm very glad that Tibetan Buddhism includes a sort of confession ceremony. I don't always have to put it into words but I do need the ceremonial acknowledgment that I'm still having a few regrets and would like to grow up and get the hell over myself. lol!
Brigid
Bad girl!
Don't do it again.
Next!!
"Familiarity breeds contempt"
Sometimes it's easy to help or be kind to those that we don't know - because we don't KNOW them. Maybe it's our ego or presenting a "good face" - who knows.
But, once we do know them, it is easy to bark sharp words or withhold comfort and attention. These are lessons we can work on and practice on a daily basis.
-bf
Enough said, includes myself as well.
On another board I attached some Meditations of Transformation that I had been working on. I tried to upload here but it was too long. Full credit for these belong to Tich Naht Hahn- These are presented as written in "The Blooming of the Lotus".
http://www.buddhachat.org/forum/showthread.php?t=362&page=6
See file attached to response #29.
Consider if everything were taken by an uncontollable force, such as the loss of everything by the victims of huricane Katrina or the victims of the tsunami last year. Myself, I was challenged this week with costly unexpected car and plumbing repairs. Last year I lost my Grandmother to cancer, I was present to help others grieve, yet felt no sense of loss. To me she was free of the shackles of her infirm physical form.
Often from the generations that are to follow us. Think of what we're wasting the next time you fill your gas tank, or utilizing any resources. I certainly do.
I don't know, I have an electric guitar, an accoustic, and two amplifers, as well as, a recently restored 1949 Lester piano and a Korg Triton LE WorkStation that my wife got me for Christmas. (her Catholic Habit,LOL !)
There's the rub!! LOL! I'd have a hard time without my laptop as well.
1.No, 2.no, because you said "having " to give it away-implies externally influenced action, 3.Yes, 4.No, well except for when they breakdown. I did lose my laptop for 3 months, the LCD inverter "thingamajig" went out and it was in the shop, and "no" I didn't take the loaner either.
I can groove with that! I don't know if you heard the one about the Buddha telling his students to get rid of their attachments. Seeing how they were struggling he got on them for clinging to non-attatchment.
Whew! that sure was a zigner for me as well, back in the day. I still battle that now and again. For me some of that stemmed from the relationship that I had with my family of origin. I needed to get to a point where I had some sort of say in where my resources were going not just because felt some blind obligation or that I was being guilted into something.
Blessings on those who do, in secret that is!
Wow!! I could go into correlates of consciousness, but that's a whole other board. Well, I mentioned it in an earlier post awareness recieves impressions, impressions are solidified into images, and so forth. If you haven't seen it yet I would recommend the film " What the Bleep Were We Thinking". It's kind of wierd, but stick with it. Quick experiment, what do you think when I say, Conservative, Liberal, George Bush, previously stored correlates register anywhere from 100 to 300 milliseconds. That is a fact, sorry I passed the reference to a friend already. So, where does that leave us? Once I know that this is the process I can do something about it, because I know that no matter how aware I think I was when those images were formed they are incomplete because awareness is incomplete. I thereby, can free myself from the illusion of solidity that Ihave given these images. I created them, I can break them. This whole understanding has changed the entire level of my practice.
I have to laugh at myself at writing that :type: , because I still fall into the same traps and clinging before I get enough pain to do something about it. :winkc:
Great thread everyone, keep it real!!
In Gassho
IAWA