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Why sentient beings?

JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
edited June 2012 in Buddhism Basics
Why don't texts say 'people' instead of sentient beings. It just struck me today how Buddhism invented itself in the west.

My thought is that sattva was translated to 'being' and now it is typical. But how would feel if the rousing bodhicitta prayer said:

May all people be free from suffering, and the causes
May all people have happiness, and the causes

Comments

  • BekenzeBekenze
    People typically infers humans.

    Dogs, cats, whales, etc, are not humans.
  • ToshTosh Veteran
    What's your definition of 'sentience', Jeffrey?

    Animals are both 'beings' and 'sentient' too, you know?

  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    People typically infers humans.

    Dogs, cats, whales, etc, are not humans.


    Generally speaking -- :thumbsup:

    I think the difficult question comes in where to draw the line.
  • taiyakitaiyaki Veteran
    Sentient is dependent on what we deem as sentient.
  • Invincible_summerInvincible_summer Heavy Metal Dhamma We(s)t coast, Canada Veteran
    "Sentience" as defined in Buddhism:
    Translating various Sanskrit terms (jantu, bahu jana, jagat, sattva), sentient beings conventionally refers to the mass of living things subject to illusion, suffering, and rebirth (Saṃsāra). Less frequently, sentient beings as a class broadly encompasses all beings possessing consciousness, including Buddhas and Bodhisattvas
    Source.

    So I guess any living being is "sentient."
  • BonsaiDougBonsaiDoug Simply, on the path. Veteran
    To be sentient, does there also need to be self awareness?
  • LostLightLostLight Veteran
    To be sentient, does there also need to be self awareness?
    Insects and bacteria are not aware, yet Buddhists go to great lengths to preserve their lives, so I guess no.
  • BonsaiDougBonsaiDoug Simply, on the path. Veteran
    edited June 2012
    To be sentient, does there also need to be self awareness?
    Insects and bacteria are not aware, yet Buddhists go to great lengths to preserve their lives, so I guess no.
    They may go to lengths to not snuff out a "living thing," but I have to wonder whether that truly indicates they are "sentient" life forms. Do these life forms perceive they are alive? That indicates a thought process. I just don't know.
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    To be sentient, does there also need to be self awareness?
    Insects and bacteria are not aware, yet Buddhists go to great lengths to preserve their lives, so I guess no.
    They may go to lengths to not snuff out a "living thing," but I have to wonder whether that truly indicates they are "sentient" life forms.


    :thumbsup:
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    The topic is more about the word choice than animal protection. Still I think the broadness of sentient applying to all beings makes sense. It would just make me feel more immediate to say people. Loving an idea is easier than loving a person.
  • BonsaiDougBonsaiDoug Simply, on the path. Veteran
    Loving an idea is easier than loving a person.
    Thich Nhat Hanh reminds us that: "Our love is not contingent upon the other person being lovable."
  • SattvaPaulSattvaPaul South Wales, UK Veteran
    Maybe you can just substitute the word "living" for "sentient" (in your mind, as you recite the prayer).
  • white_wolfwhite_wolf
    edited June 2012
    I struggle with this one too. I've always thought sentient meant self-aware and as far as I know humans are the only creatures that fit that category. Though, in a few billion years that might change and some other animals may evolve to the point of being truly sentient.

    Of course, we still shouldn't harm animals, because at the very least they can feel pain and we shouldn't subject them to something we wouldn't want to be subjected to.
  • LostLightLostLight Veteran
    edited June 2012
    I struggle with this one too. I've always thought sentient meant self-aware and as far as I know humans are the only creatures that fit that category. Though, in a few billion years that might change and some other animals may evolve to the point of being truly sentient.

    Of course, we still shouldn't harm animals, because at the very least they can feel pain and we shouldn't subject them to something we wouldn't want to be subjected to.
    Buddhism is one of the few practices that asks followers to refrain from eating meat they suspect is killed for them. A buddhist believes that animals fear for their lives and suffer like humans, so killing them is seen as almost as bad.

    Maybe that will help.

    When it comes to bugs, however, the issue with killing bugs is not their deaths as much as the state of mind a person has to be in in order to kill. (Annoyed, Scared ect...)

    I refrain from killing any sort of bug even though I greatly dislike them.
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    Remember, this thread is not about animals and killing. It is about the arousing bodhicitta prayer and the use of words.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    I have always regarded a sentient being as one that can feel, and process the experience of pain, on an emotional level, because suffering is relative to emotion.
    we classify suffering pain, as something that has the potential to make us suffer emotionally as well. Hence the 'twin arrows' teaching.
    Research has been carried out extensively, to ascertain whether insects have an ability to process pain on an emotional level and it would appear that this is not the case, as insects have been observed, having been subjected to an injury, carrying on as normal.

    Besides, while an insect has to endure a prolonged existence when caught by a predator, We as humans tend to inflict a swift, sudden and very abrupt end, therefore, the 'brain' of an insect does not even have sufficient time to understand it is being swatted.
    Insects have brains, but they only control certain physical functions - they do not process thought patterns, as ours do.

  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Remember, this thread is not about animals and killing. It is about the arousing bodhicitta prayer and the use of words.
    Yes, those words being 'sentient beings' instead of 'people' and for the sake of clarification, we're trying to effect a distinction.

  • LostLightLostLight Veteran
    edited June 2012
    @LostLight

    Just a heads up, your link doesn't seem to be working for me. It just brings me back to this post.
    I'm still relatively new and don't really know how to fix the link at the moment, but if you highlight the link and copy and paste it into your address bar it works.
    Sorry for the inconvenience.

    Mod note: link fixed.
  • LostLightLostLight Veteran
    I have always regarded a sentient being as one that can feel, and process the experience of pain, on an emotional level, because suffering is relative to emotion.
    we classify suffering pain, as something that has the potential to make us suffer emotionally as well. Hence the 'twin arrows' teaching.
    Research has been carried out extensively, to ascertain whether insects have an ability to process pain on an emotional level and it would appear that this is not the case, as insects have been observed, having been subjected to an injury, carrying on as normal.

    Besides, while an insect has to endure a prolonged existence when caught by a predator, We as humans tend to inflict a swift, sudden and very abrupt end, therefore, the 'brain' of an insect does not even have sufficient time to understand it is being swatted.
    Insects have brains, but they only control certain physical functions - they do not process thought patterns, as ours do.

    This is how I always felt until I started reading further into Buddhist teachings. Many buddhists will tell you that killing an insect is still wrong regardless, but they don't think that killing plants is wrong. It's weird, because if you think about it, the venus fly trap, not having a brain or nervous system, acts on instinct and instinct alone, as do insects. It is a carnivore in plant form, yet it's not regarded as wrong if you took its life because it's seen as different than insects.
    I guess I'll just stick with the "I won't go out of my way to kill bugs, but if I have to, I won't let it bother me to no end."
  • seeker242seeker242 Zen Florida, USA Veteran
    If the bodhicitta prayer only said people, you would be leaving out many other beings and that would not be appropriate imo. They are stuck is suffering too and they need help too.
    To be sentient, does there also need to be self awareness?
    I don't think so. Newborn infants could be said to have no "self awareness", but they are still sentient. It's generally regarded as "the ability to feel, perceive or be conscious, or to have subjective experiences." Or simply the capability to endure suffering. If it can suffer, then it's sentient.
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