Buddhists against factory farming

Sabre

Factory farming causes a lot of harm to both animals and the environment. It also is a breeding ground for diseases amongst animals, like mad cow disease and chicken flu. I think somehow Buddhists should have a voice against this crazy industry, not only on a personal level - but also more outspoken as a group. Compassion is central in our practice, we can't allow what's happening to animals. If you don't know, just google for factory farming. What do you think? Any ideas to spread this message? Any tips to do something actively aside of refraining from animal products produced by such farms? Do you think this is an issue for Buddhism at all or not?

Below is some more information for you:

The external environment is seriously polluted because the internal environment in the mind is seriously damaged. The bottomless greed has pushed mankind to satisfy excessive and unnecessary demands, and take them into endless competitions, leading to self-destruction and environmental damage. Contrasting to the unwholesome and greedy mind is the spirit of simple living and contentment by those who practise the Buddha's teaching.

Living in contentment does not mean the elimination of desire of knowledge and truth, but to live in harmony with all beings and with nature. On that basis, those who understand the Buddha's teaching will limit their selfishness, to live in harmony with nature, without harming the environment. They will see what should be explored and to what level, what should be protected for future use by the next generations and other beings. Excessive greed to possess everything for themselves, or for their own group, has make men becoming blind. They are prepared to fight, make war, causing deaths, disease, starvation, destruction of life of all species, gradually worsening the living environment. By all means, they try to maximise their profits, without being concerned of the negative impact of unplanned exploitation leading to depletion of natural resources, discharge toxics into the air, water, earth, leading to environmental pollution, destroying the ecological balance.

...
I think it is still not too late for all religions, all strata of the society and all nations to come together, jointly participate in the protection of the environment for all living species, based on the harmonious model which Buddhism always advocates.

http://www.budsas.org/ebud/ebdha006.htm

"Of two people who practice the Dhamma in line with the Dhamma, having a sense of Dhamma, having a sense of meaning — one who practices for both his own benefit and that of others, and one who practices for his own benefit but not that of others — the one who practices for his own benefit but not that of others is to be criticized for that reason, the one who practices for both his own benefit and that of others is, for that reason, to be praised.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an07/an07.064.than.html

With metta,
Sabre

sukhita

Overpopulation is the culprit here - need factory farming to meet demand.

tmottes

sukhita said:

Overpopulation is the culprit here - need factory farming to meet demand.

Greed is the problem right now. Could be overpopulation in the future.

sukhita

Perhaps both ... but let's agree to disagree.

karasti

I think it would be both. Overpopulation is a problem, there is no way around that. But part of it is also want vs need. American's especially have this cultural thing where they eat meat not only every day, but often multiple times a day. That's not necessary (nor is it really good for most people).

I'm not sure what anyone can do, short of just living by setting an example and talking about it when the opportunity presents itself. Pushing your opinion and lifestyle and beliefs on other people generally doesn't have a good outcome. The word has been out about factory farming on a large level ever since Food Inc. came out, and more people every day are realizing the harmful nature of it. But not everyone is ready for it, and not everyone can afford the alternatives. I saw a meme on FB yesterday that said something like "Live as to set a good example so that those who want to see can find you and those who want to hear can hear your message." and I tend to agree with that. I'm not saying not to do anything, just that being forceful with the issue is unlikely to have the desired result.

Remember, as strongly as you feel about one thing, someone else feels just as strongly in the other direction for reasons they find just as valid as the reasons you present for your beliefs. People don't generally take kindly to being told what they think is a bunch of hooey. Things are changing though, slowly, and what it's going to take is for people to continue talking with and writing to those who make the decisions. Not to persuade other people to change their mind, but to let those with the power to make decisions, know how you feel.

Sabre

sukhita said:

Overpopulation is the culprit here - need factory farming to meet demand.

I think that's not really the essential problem. Factory farming is not invented because the old type of farming wasn't meeting demands, but because it was cheaper this way.

Also the demand is created, rather than inherent in people. Western people eat way more meat than before. It's also a cultural thing. Take for example America and Australia where people per capita eat at least 1,5 times as much meat compared to some rich western countries in Europe - where cultural differences between meat consumption are very clear when travelling among nations. But that's just meat. Of course the industry also creates eggs and dairy products, but I suspect the same trend is happening there.

So overpopulation really isn't the issue. Yes, it does contribute to the problem, but it isn't the issue itself. It's really greed that's the problem - and that's why I think Buddhism could contribute in a solution.

How is he moderate in eating? Herein a monk takes his food after wise consideration: not for the purpose of enjoyment, of pride, of beautifying the body or adorning it (with muscles); but only for the sake of maintaining and sustaining this body, to avoid harm and to support the holy life, thinking: "Thus I shall destroy the old painful feeling and shall not let a new one rise. Long life will be mine, blamelessness and well-being."

With metta,
Sabre

karasti

That's where you and I disagree. I understand what you are saying, but just like not everyone is Christian (and thus shouldn't have to abide by Christian rules) not everyone is Buddhist and should have to abide by something Buddhist's find necessary. I do think the majority of people, if they visited a factory farm would be horrified that this is where their meat comes from, and I do think most people don't "go there" because they don't want to know.

And, if you go back far enough people lives mainly on meat, and the reality is that if everyone suddenly switched to eating only organic meat and veggies/fruit, we would not have enough space to farm to feed everyone. Also, what would happen to all those animals on those factory farms if they all went out of business? not that they live wonderful lives, but they would die horrifying deaths, abandoned in those huge farms when they suddenly went out of business. I think the answer lies more in people demanding better care for the animals they consume rather than eliminating the entire idea of a factory farm. The truth is there are already laws in place to protect these animals, and they are not enforced.

OneLifeForm

Yes this has been an issue for a long time.

I choose to not consume animals. That helps.

For the individual such decisions are the way we can directly affect the whole in a positive way.

If the individual eats animals then they can make the change to all organic, free range meats. Tastes a hell of a lot better too.

It is more expensive but I found consuming animals to be a huge incovenience so it wasn't a big deal to me as I rarely purchased meats.



Overpopulation has nothing to do with this issue. There are much better ways to feed people than slaying animals.

karasti

But @OneLifeForm, a lot of the food that is available to feed people, isn't good for them either. More and more studies are showing evidence that GMO crops are causing huge problems in people's health. It's much of the reason for the high rate of current gluten intolerance in so many people, contributing not only to weight gain but type 2 diabetes, metabolic syndromes and many other things. Can we feed people things other than mass produced animals? Yes. But are those alternatives healthy for people? Largely, the evidence is starting to say no. The fact is, there is not enough land available on the planet to grow organic plants and animals to feed the whole planet. So that's the problem. We can feed people. But we cannot feed them well, which then just leads to them not dying of starvation but dying slower deaths over time due to all the health concerns and medical issues that they cannot afford to fix. Diseases that have existed a long time but are now growing by unexplainable numbers, is mostly traced back to diet. Everything you eat, changes your cellular structure (if you do some research on epigenetics it goes into this fairly well) and when you eat foods that have altered DNA, it affected your cells and how they are able to operate. They no longer do the job they are meant to do, and start going haywire.

sukhita

OneLifeForm said:

....... There are much better ways to feed people than slaying animals.

Yes... if the masses can be swayed to become vegans.

OneLifeForm

@karasti : All of those animals in CAFOs are being pumped full of nothing but GMOs along with copious amounts of drugs to try and keep them alive long enough to get them fat enough but it is never enough.

We most definitely can feed every single being on the planet with organic real food.

That we cannot, I view as propaganda.

It would require something that we as a whole have not had the willingness to even discuss; cooperation. We would all have to work together.

The solutions are always so simple.

One individual cannot make everybody else change, one individual must change their life style so that it fits with how they would want to see everybody else living as well.

-Be the change you want to see in the world.

-Do unto others as you would have done unto you.

Sabre

karasti said:

That's where you and I disagree. I understand what you are saying, but just like not everyone is Christian (and thus shouldn't have to abide by Christian rules) not everyone is Buddhist and should have to abide by something Buddhist's find necessary. I do think the majority of people, if they visited a factory farm would be horrified that this is where their meat comes from, and I do think most people don't "go there" because they don't want to know.

And, if you go back far enough people lives mainly on meat, and the reality is that if everyone suddenly switched to eating only organic meat and veggies/fruit, we would not have enough space to farm to feed everyone. Also, what would happen to all those animals on those factory farms if they all went out of business? not that they live wonderful lives, but they would die horrifying deaths, abandoned in those huge farms when they suddenly went out of business. I think the answer lies more in people demanding better care for the animals they consume rather than eliminating the entire idea of a factory farm. The truth is there are already laws in place to protect these animals, and they are not enforced.

Hi,

What exactly do you disagree on? What I stated were mainly facts that you can check. (I linked to some sources)

Of course we shouldn't force anyone, but at least perhaps in some ways we can raise awareness and be a good example - people can and will choose to follow it. And perhaps governments can be alerted to the issue. It'll be a gradual process, it's not like all farms will close within a year (sadly). So short term effects are not to be worried about. I think it's also a bit strange to say that if that would happen, that will lead to horrible death, if many of those animals are raised to be killed anyway... If we want better care of animals, we have to get beyond factory farming and go for organic food.

Meat is food on top of the food chain, so it is a very inefficient source of food. With all that is needed, it requires a lot more land in total. The thing is, iirc, 50% of all produced grains and 75% of soy is used to feed animals. All that land would be freed up to grow other stuff. I advise you to watch the documentaries I posted where such things are discussed.

edit, seems it is much higher percentages.

Raising animals for food is grossly inefficient, because while animals eat large quantities of grain, soybeans, oats, and corn, they only produce comparatively small amounts of meat, dairy products, or eggs in return. This is why more than 70 percent of the grain and cereals that we grow in this country are fed to farmed animals.

It takes up to 16 pounds of grain to produce just 1 pound of meat.
http://www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-food/meat-wastes-natural-resources.aspx


Percentage of corn grown in United States eaten by livestock: 80
Percentage of soy grown in United States eaten by livestock: 90
Percentage of oats grown in United States eaten by livestock: 95
Percentage of protein wasted by cycling grain through livestock: 90
Percentage of carbohydrate wasted by cycling grain through livestock: 99
..
Amount of total U.S. grain production consumed by livestock: 70%
http://whitt.ca/soapbox/vegetarian.html

But tbh I did not create this thread to discuss the problem - but rather what we can do about it, and is it an issue for Buddhists?

With kindness,
Sabre

zombiegirl

I feel like arguing that the world could not sustain 100% vegetarianism is kind of a moot point since it will NEVER happen. Surely, it is possible, but realistically? I highly doubt it. Even India is only estimated at 40% vegetarian on the high end.

Davetheseeker

As population grows and agricultural land is turned into 'urban areas' factory farms and GMO's are becoming more prevalent due to the need to produce more food on less land.
These things will continue on until there is somehow a balance.
I agree the treatment of animals isn't always the best, but this doesn't happen at all farms.

Just as a note, mad cow disease is a bacterial brain infection caused by chopped forage that didn't ferment properly. So it really isn't a disease.

Sabre

edit: nvm misunderstood

karasti

I meant that we disagree that as a group, we should do something. Is it an issue for me, as a Buddhist? Yes, but on a personal level. I don't think it's necessarily an issue Buddhists as a large group should take on. Then it gives reason for people to get upset, the same way people are upset at the Christian groups who are pushing for gay marriage bans, even though Christians truly believe it's the right and kind thing to do. We believe all beings are sentient and deserve to live, and the vast majority of people do not share that belief beyond their pet relationships.


@OneLifeForm Have you ever sustained an organic garden just for yourself or your family? If you have, then you have an idea of how much space, and how much food is required to feed a single person. It's quite a bit more than you'd imagine. Generally speaking, for those who are seeking to be fully self sufficient and feed themselves for a whole year (fresh, frozen and canned) it takes 600 sq feet PER person to have enough space to do so. (that comes from any # of homesteading books and other things that I've read) We have a small garden, about 48 square feet, and we're lucky to be able to have a garden at all, considering so many people just live like sardines. Anyhow, our small garden provides a few summer snacks (fresh cucumbers for example) and maybe a couple weeks worth of side dishes for the winter with beans, carrots, peas, and potatoes. I can pickles and tomatoes. It wouldn't be enough for our 5 person family to live on for 2 weeks much less an entire year if it's all we had to live on. Because of our climate, our growing season is only 3 months long. Last frost in June, first frost (we had ours last night) in early to mid September. It's not propoganda. Much of the world's land is too poisoned to sustain organic farming, and the areas that are not the soil is depleted and the plants only grow because of all of the special seeds Monsanto sells to allow plants to grow in such conditions.

Anyhow, I agree that it's not really worth arguing because the world is never going to go 100% organic vegan. It's just not. The best point I can think is to work to improve conditions on existing farms and requiring to follow the USDA existing laws and punish farms appropriately for not following the laws.

Davetheseeker

@Sabre,

but rather what we can do about it, and is it an issue for Buddhists?

as Buddhists all we can really do is show compassion and hope others will see our point of view. If somehow a 'movement' such as PETA or the Humane Society would be formed there would most likely be greed and self rightousness creeping in. Not Buddhist actions at all.
As in the two groups I mentioned above, less than 10% of monies gathered helps animals, the 90%+ goes to the 'organization'.

OneLifeForm

To answer the question: Yes.

It is an issue for Buddhists.

It is an issue for every being everywhere.

We all eat food, we should be mindful of what we are eating.

GMO's/factory farming is a huge negative impact on the planet.

It provides zero benefit.

They are not created because "That is just the way it is, our only option" it is because as was stated earlier; greed.


If you do the research you will find that organically grown produce and other natural methods of cultivation do not make fields uninhabitable by future crops.

It plants seeds for a healthy cycle to continue onward.

Organic farming makes the soil even better.




What can we do?

Buy quality food locally, support such business with your revenue.

Make every bite you eat a vote to have healthy food one day available for all.


Treat all beings with respect. Save a bug or an animal whenever you can.

I havent yet come across the button that one can press to eradicate all suffering everywhere so until then we must continue taking babysteps as individuals and connect with others as available in our locality.

A single drop affects the entire ocean.

Our choices do matter. That is what is important to realize.

zombiegirl

I do agree with you @karasti ...but just wanted to add one thing.

karasti said:

Much of the world's land is too poisoned to sustain organic farming, and the areas that are not the soil is depleted and the plants only grow because of all of the special seeds Monsanto sells to allow plants to grow in such conditions.

Since you mentioned Monsanto... the conditions are now such that once a farmer begins to buy Monsanto seeds, they must continue to purchase the GMO seeds from them or risk being sued (and they WILL). There are countless cases of Monsanto suing farmers who attempted to go back to purchasing other types of seeds. There are even cases of the company suing farmers downwind from other farms that purchased Monsanto seeds when their researchers found their patented GMO seeds in their crop, despite the fact that they never purchased from the company directly.

This is happening all over America and I don't doubt that this issue is making growing organic even more difficult.

OneLifeForm

karasti said:

@OneLifeForm Have you ever sustained an organic garden just for yourself or your family? If you have, then you have an idea of how much space, and how much food is required to feed a single person. It's quite a bit more than you'd imagine. Generally speaking, for those who are seeking to be fully self sufficient and feed themselves for a whole year (fresh, frozen and canned) it takes 600 sq feet PER person to have enough space to do so. (that comes from any # of homesteading books and other things that I've read) We have a small garden, about 48 square feet, and we're lucky to be able to have a garden at all, considering so many people just live like sardines. Anyhow, our small garden provides a few summer snacks (fresh cucumbers for example) and maybe a couple weeks worth of side dishes for the winter with beans, carrots, peas, and potatoes. I can pickles and tomatoes. It wouldn't be enough for our 5 person family to live on for 2 weeks much less an entire year if it's all we had to live on. Because of our climate, our growing season is only 3 months long. Last frost in June, first frost (we had ours last night) in early to mid September. It's not propoganda. Much of the world's land is too poisoned to sustain organic farming, and the areas that are not the soil is depleted and the plants only grow because of all of the special seeds Monsanto sells to allow plants to grow in such conditions.

I don't recall saying that we should all support ourselves with our own individual gardens.

The key word is Cooperation.

If we all worked together it wouldn't be a big deal, we could all make it through just fine eating real food.


The places where it is too messed up to grow, people would get together to build greenhouses and other types of farming equipment to help out, if not that then people would work to bring food into those areas.


If we all worked together, we would never once doubt that it is possible for everbody to live a satisfying life.

Sabre

karasti said:

I meant that we disagree that as a group, we should do something. Is it an issue for me, as a Buddhist? Yes, but on a personal level. I don't think it's necessarily an issue Buddhists as a large group should take on. Then it gives reason for people to get upset, the same way people are upset at the Christian groups who are pushing for gay marriage bans, even though Christians truly believe it's the right and kind thing to do. We believe all beings are sentient and deserve to live, and the vast majority of people do not share that belief beyond their pet relationships.

Well put. That's also one thing I can agree with somewhere and a bit of a reason why I opened this topic. We should perhaps not do such things under the banner of Buddhism. But we can perhaps create awareness through other means - as individuals. On the other hand, if Buddhists make sort of a stance, would it really be bad?

But also I don't often if ever hear about this in Buddhist circles.

tmottes

sukhita said:

Perhaps both ... but let's agree to disagree.

Fair enough. I am factoring in that greed includes not just gluttony, but also the profits to be made on food and control of food; and while I do think that it is a combination of both, I feel greed is more detrimental at this point in time. I suspect that at our current growth rate, overpopulation will become the most detrimental factor threatening our food supply. Either way they both need to be addressed.

Davetheseeker said:

Just as a note, mad cow disease is a bacterial brain infection caused by chopped forage that didn't ferment properly. So it really isn't a disease.

Actually, mad cow disease is caused by a prion (protein-infection). A protein that causes other proteins to take its shape (basically). This causes a sponge-like structure: ruining the normal function of the proteins with which it comes in contact. The term spongiform encephalitis refers to this process and is preceded by "bovine" for mad cow. It is transmitted from eating meat (especially brain) of an infected animal or human (as it is seen spread by a ritual funeral practice in Papua New Guinea). This is a particularly interesting infectious agent, as it can easily cross many mammalian borders, unlike viruses and bacteria (which can often require a complex set of intermediaries, think mosquitos transmitting Malaria).

A bit off topic, but important for people to not be misinformed.

vinlyn

Liberate brussel sprouts!

tmottes

vinlyn said:

Liberate brussel sprouts!

mmmm I want to generate me some bad karma eating those littles babies

seeker242

sukhita said:

Overpopulation is the culprit here - need factory farming to meet demand.

Says who?



As for the OP, factory farming is completely atrocious behavior. It is literally an animal holocaust, everyday...People who are engaged in the practice of factory farming will be reborn in hell realms because of it.

Howard Lyman is great! He comes here to speak at the local Earthsave International group sometimes. I had him come speak at my college once. He quite a nice guy! And he pretty much knows everything there is to know about animal agriculture with regards to cows.

A recent report just came out about this. Findings by leading water scientists at the Stockholm International Water Institute conclude that unless the world's population adopts a vegetarian diet over the next 40 years, we may face a global food shortage crisis nothing short of a catastrophe.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/global-development/2012/aug/26/food-shortages-world-vegetarianism

OneLifeForm

zombiegirl said:

I do agree with you @karasti ...but just wanted to add one thing.

karasti said:

Much of the world's land is too poisoned to sustain organic farming, and the areas that are not the soil is depleted and the plants only grow because of all of the special seeds Monsanto sells to allow plants to grow in such conditions.

Since you mentioned Monsanto... the conditions are now such that once a farmer begins to buy Monsanto seeds, they must continue to purchase the GMO seeds from them or risk being sued (and they WILL). There are countless cases of Monsanto suing farmers who attempted to go back to purchasing other types of seeds. There are even cases of the company suing farmers downwind from other farms that purchased Monsanto seeds when their researchers found their patented GMO seeds in their crop, despite the fact that they never purchased from the company directly.

This is happening all over America and I don't doubt that this issue is making growing organic even more difficult.

Many commit suicide everyday because of the cycle they are caught in with Monsanto and other bio tech giants.

The article I read at the time that spoke of such was speaking mainly about India at the time and how thousands upon thousands of Indian farmers were killing themselves over the situations they found themselves in.

Is that the wrong way to go about it; suicide?

I have no clue what I would have done in their shoes. I have been quite fortunate so far in this lifetime as to not have to deal with that kind of ordeal.

federica

tmottes said:

vinlyn said:

Liberate brussel sprouts!

mmmm I want to generate me some bad karma eating those littles babies

Some call it 'bad kamma'...others call it 'hot air'.....

zombiegirl

@OneLifeForm I stupidly thought the Monsanto problem was purely American. Sigh. Even sadder to hear it's spreading to other countries as well... So sad.

tmottes

federica said:

tmottes said:

vinlyn said:

Liberate brussel sprouts!

mmmm I want to generate me some bad karma eating those littles babies

Some call it 'bad kamma'...others call it 'hot air'.....

HAHAHA

If you are referring to what I think you are, then its probably more the latter for me. :eek:

tmottes

zombiegirl said:

@OneLifeForm I stupidly thought the Monsanto problem was purely American. Sigh. Even sadder to hear it's spreading to other countries as well... So sad.

Oh, Monsanto is a human problem. They are such an evil corporation (or so caught up in their greed) and most people in the world are relatively uneducated on them and how detrimental their greed is on our food supply: biologically (both of the plants and humans) and commercially.

OneLifeForm

zombiegirl said:

@OneLifeForm I stupidly thought the Monsanto problem was purely American. Sigh. Even sadder to hear it's spreading to other countries as well... So sad.

Monsantos disease among companies that are doing the same, are world wide.

Been that way for a long time now.

As @tmottes said, most people are uneducated about all of that jazz.

It is extremely disturbing no doubt.


What can we do?

I signed an online petition to make labelling of GMOs in California a law.
I'm sure if you google that petition then you can sign it if it hasn't already gone through.


Just because the entire EU has GMOs labelled doesn't mean they don't still have them there too.

They are still there, though now that the FrankenPhood is labelled for what it is not many people eat it.

karasti

I wish we could get it passed on a federal level here. It would be more cost effective for companies to have to do it country-wide than on a state by state basis. People have the right to know what they are eating, and sadly the last people they should trust to tell them what is ok to eat is the government. Our food supply and everything that goes into it is fascinating (in a seeing a train wreck sort of way). It's downright frightening to know what they are allowed to do to our food and we have no right to know. The Cargill/Monsanto (Cargill is HQ'd in my state, boooo) is quite the crazy entity. If I believed in the devil I'd say he signed that contract joining the 2. The sad thing is, Cargill is very vocal in the community they are in, donating money, helping out poor people, and that visibility is what people see and all they care about. So to them, Cargill is an ideal neighbor and employer. Nevermind that they and Monsanto might be very likely to blame for you having diabetes and your parents dying of cancer. It's sickening. And yes, the spread to other countries is sickening, too. It's so sad to see the problems we have with our health cropping up world wide as companies insist on spreading their bad products to everyone on the planet.

zombiegirl

Someday, I just want to have a yard and my own garden... What else is there to do? Lol.

I think it was in Food Inc. (someone correct me if I'm wrong) that they talk about Monsanto taking all of the different strains of soybeans on record and patenting them. Why did they let them do this? Nobody ever thought when that paperwork tried to go through, "Hey, this could really have some bad monopolizing ramifications somewhere down the line..." Really!?

OneLifeForm

It is all cycles created to fuel the disease @zombiegirl .. they know what they are doing.

The crap food costs money, big corporations dominate what is available to eat, they profit from crap food sales.

Crap food creates diseases/disorders, those in turn give profit to medical establishment.

Big pharma profits big time by producing all different kinds of "medications" and markets them to humans of all ages.

Those medications/crap foods are marketed big time through mass media.. Media profits through sales of ad space.

Media controls output of most information.

People watch TV.. see ads, buy crap food, other useless products, get prescribed pills..

so on and so forth.

They even have "phood" now or at least they were working on producing such revolting garbage.. ie: a goat thats milk vaccinates people.

All the negative cycles are inextricably attached, they are not separate and all work hand in hand to keep the money hand in hand.

It certainly isn't my hand that the money is coming into. Probably isn't yours either.
The rich get richer while the poor become more and more diseased in every way.

People talked about overpopulation briefly in this thread.. if you can understand what is typed in this post then you can see "population control" is already in effect.

Did you know that for people who eat GMOs, that they are not the ones most negatively impacted, it is the third generation from the GMO eater.

The third generation will be sterile, they won't be able to produce offspring. There are already 3rd generations out there in which their family has been continuously consuming genetically engineered foods.

So the ignoramus, they think, "Well hell, it isn't going to hurt me all that bad, why should I care?"

GMOs negatively affect anybody that consumes them so it isn't like the effects wait for the third generation. There is an overwhelming list of dangers associated with the consumption of such trash for this life right now, forget about any future lives, this one right now.


Some people clearly don't think so but losing control of our food is pretty much like having no control over anything.

They have us right where they want us.. almost.

Kangaroo

One of the main reasons that I moved to Hawai'i was to live in a climate where I could garden year round. I won't be able to stay out of the market 100% as my garden plot is not that large. But I have been able to grow a nice variety of vegetables. It's also nice to be able to pick mango, papaya, and banana from the wild.
What really bothers me about the markets here, just about everything is imported from the mainland or from South America and it is very expensive. Imagine living in the land of pineapples and you have to purchase one from Mexico. Most of the produce actually grown here is sold to the resorts and the resturants.
Even the fish which is caught locally is very expensive. If I were a meat eater it would be much more economical to buy a rod and tackle.

karasti

I would love to one day live in a place with a longer growing season. Ours is so short we're very limited in what we can plant, and our spring and fall are full of killing frost so even cool weather veggies don't survive. Even melon is very hit or miss, unless we get a lot of hot weather in the summer they don't grow well. Our prices aren't as much as HI or AK but because of our location transportation in cold trucks contributes to our costs a lot. Enough so that driving an hour or more to another city to shop, is more economical even considering gas costs, than shopping here. It's sad how much it costs just to eat, and how hard it is to be able to do it on your own without taking on considerable expense to be able to do it. Leaves a person feeling a bit trapped sometimes.

evolve

a psychic once told me everyone would be going towards 'community gardening' but i mean she was taking whiskey shots at 9am sooo hmmm also after thinking about it for a bit i realize that food is so weird and even though i'm so weirded out that we eat all these weird earth objects im so thankful for it cause it keeps me alive and its weird to just rely on the grocery store i think gardening is a good idea like the psychic said but hmm ultimately, food is weird

karasti

maybe we will all just become advanced mind masters and not need to eat nearly as much

tmottes

@karasti funny that you would say that. I have really kicked my meditation practice into gear lately and I have found I am naturally sleeping and eating less.

Davetheseeker

@tmottes thank you for pointing out the the mad cow info.

I see that many points are being brought up about growing food organically. That is great, but organic has nothing to do with GMO's.
Organic just means that there are not the same pesticides and herbicides used in the production. And that is changing day by day, as there are more products being allowed to be used in 'organic' production.

As to GMO's, unless the seeds planted are open pollenated or heirloom, they're a GMO.
There are a few seed companies left that sell these, but not very many.

karasti

We have a farm locally that sells a wide variety of heirloom starter plants every spring, so that is nice. Most of the seeds we use have come from many generations of garden planting. We started our garden with seeds from my grandma's garden, who has been using seeds from her garden to plant each year for the past 60 years.

It's kind of interesting that even people seeking to not buy GMO products, aren't sure what they are. I've overheard people at the garden center talking about "I hope these aren't GMO seeds. Wow, nice, they are drought resistant!" and they don't even realize that to be drought resistant they have to be GMO seeds. I just find it interesting that they want to avoid something that they aren't sure what is.

tmottes

karasti said:

We have a farm locally that sells a wide variety of heirloom starter plants every spring, so that is nice. Most of the seeds we use have come from many generations of garden planting. We started our garden with seeds from my grandma's garden, who has been using seeds from her garden to plant each year for the past 60 years.

It's kind of interesting that even people seeking to not buy GMO products, aren't sure what they are. I've overheard people at the garden center talking about "I hope these aren't GMO seeds. Wow, nice, they are drought resistant!" and they don't even realize that to be drought resistant they have to be GMO seeds. I just find it interesting that they want to avoid something that they aren't sure what is.

Right View and Right Understanding. Its a very fundamental part of Buddhism

OneLifeForm

Davetheseeker said:

Organic just means that there are not the same pesticides and herbicides used in the production. And that is changing day by day, as there are more products being allowed to be used in 'organic' production.

The USDA Organic label is supposed to mean that the product is also Non-GMO.

Now they have groups like "The Non-GMO Project" that put seals on various food stuffs to let the consumer know that it has been through even more testing.

The bold highlights the key word here.

zombiegirl

OneLifeForm said:

Davetheseeker said:

Organic just means that there are not the same pesticides and herbicides used in the production. And that is changing day by day, as there are more products being allowed to be used in 'organic' production.

The USDA Organic label is supposed to mean that the product is also Non-GMO.

Now they have groups like "The Non-GMO Project" that put seals on various food stuffs to let the consumer know that it has been through even more testing.

The bold highlights the key word here.

I want this to be a law. Seriously.