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Mindfulness/Awareness

So I have established for my practice that in everday situations one needs to observe when feelings or thoughts arise, are they good or bad, what do they lead to and where do they come from. Or this is my perception of what should be done from my recent reading, and of course just reading is useless so I want to bring it from the text to my practice. Can anybody offer up their experiences with this side of Buddhism and any tips? Cheers.

Comments

  • So I have established for my practice that in everday situations one needs to observe when feelings or thoughts arise, are they good or bad
    Am I experiencing stress/agitation? Is my peace disturbed? [1st NT]
    where do they come from.
    I have found that they almost always happen when I claim ownership over things. My things, my family or friends, my viewpoints/beliefs etc. Both pleasant and unpleasant feelings result from taking things personally -eg. my football club winning or losing a game.

    What is the result if I don't claim ownership of those thing? [2nd, 3rd, 4th NT]
  • zombiegirlzombiegirl beating the drum of the lifeless in a dry wasteland Veteran
    I often have trouble when people ask me, "What exactly is the point of meditation? What does it DO for you?"

    But I've just realized... THIS. This is it. I've become more aware of my thoughts and instead of simply identifying with them, it's allowed me to take a step back and wonder, "Why am I feeling this way?" Thoughts and emotions can appear extremely flawed when you actually observe the reasoning behind them. But if you never look... you just go on exactly as you were before... possibly unacceptably angry or unreasonably entitled... at the mercy of the eight winds, as some might say.

    The eight winds are: gain and loss, fame and defame, praise and blame, pleasure and pain. They are based upon the eight worldly dharmas.
    The 8 worldly Dharmas are also known as 8 worldly concerns or 8 worldly concerns. Avoiding these 8 mental states is considered quite important in Buddhist practice. They describe the ceaseless activities we develop towards short-term pleasures, which often not even result in pleasure...
    The Eight Worldly Dharmas are being concerned with:

    Getting what you want, and avoiding getting what you do not want
    Wanting (instant) happiness, and not wanting unhappiness
    Wanting fame, and not wanting to be unknown
    Wanting praise, and not wanting blame.


    This is a very good subject for meditation; you can ask yourself for example:

    - Do I often give others happiness or unpleasant experiences?
    - Do I help others who are unhappy?
    - How often do I blame people instead of praising them?
    - What can I do with fame, what will it really bring me?
    - What will be useful when I am about to die?
    From: this website.
    ThailandTom
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    edited September 2012
    Pema Chodron said five things happen in meditation. http://www.soundstrue.com/shop/Pure-Meditation/923/Pure-Meditation/923.pd?gclid=CKSymuryxLICFcVFMgodrEoAXg


    1 being our friend to ourself
    2 seeing what is there
    3 sitting with difficulty
    4 ? (maybe to be in the present moment?)
    5 a sense of no big deal
  • So I have established for my practice that in everday situations one needs to observe when feelings or thoughts arise, are they good or bad, what do they lead to and where do they come from. Or this is my perception of what should be done from my recent reading, and of course just reading is useless so I want to bring it from the text to my practice. Can anybody offer up their experiences with this side of Buddhism and any tips? Cheers.

    Just reading is useless, but you still want our words?..

    Go practice, you!
    ThailandTom
  • Sabre said:

    So I have established for my practice that in everday situations one needs to observe when feelings or thoughts arise, are they good or bad, what do they lead to and where do they come from. Or this is my perception of what should be done from my recent reading, and of course just reading is useless so I want to bring it from the text to my practice. Can anybody offer up their experiences with this side of Buddhism and any tips? Cheers.

    Just reading is useless, but you still want our words?..

    Go practice, you!
    Useless unless acted upon or reflected on :p
    Sabre
  • PrairieGhostPrairieGhost Veteran
    edited September 2012
    Hi ThailandTom:
    one needs to observe when feelings or thoughts arise
    But when are feelings or thoughts not observed?

    Is it even possible not to observe them?

    So what is actually happening when we try to observe?
  • Hi ThailandTom:

    one needs to observe when feelings or thoughts arise
    But when are feelings or thoughts not observed?

    Most of the time.
    Is it even possible not to observe them?
    Definitely.
    So what is actually happening when we try to observe?
    We focus.

  • RebeccaS:
    We focus
    What would happen if you didn't focus at all?

  • RebeccaS:

    We focus
    What would happen if you didn't focus at all?



    Not much probably :lol:
  • PrairieGhostPrairieGhost Veteran
    edited September 2012
    RebeccaS:
    Not much
    That's plenty. So is trying to focus.

    If you want to understand anatta, not-self, it is helpful to see that no one is trying to focus in meditation, and that no one sees this.

    From our eyes to our thoughts, how could self or not-self ever be seen or understood?
  • That doesn't make any sense :lol:
  • See how aversion and attachment solidify the phenomena or self.

    And then see what happens when there is no aversion or attachment.

    And if there is aversion towards aversion then allow aversion with a loving mindfulness.

    And if there is attachment then allow that attachment with loving mindfulness.

    If you allow and rest the push, pull what happens to the thing? What happens to the solidity?

    And when there is push and pull is there a rise in solidity of phenomena?

    Throughly examine this in your experience.

    In what you consider the self and other phenomena as well.

    When you do this long enough then the Buddhadharma will make sense and you will see how suffering is constructed and how suffering is released.

    It is stupid simple and subtle.

    Best wishes my friend.
    ThailandTomFullCircle
  • RebeccaS:
    That doesn't make any sense
    There is sight, sound, smell, taste, thought and touch. What is paying attention?
  • RebeccaS:

    That doesn't make any sense
    There is sight, sound, smell, taste, thought and touch. What is paying attention?


    mind...
  • What is paying attention to mind?
  • What is paying attention to mind?

    Well there is the mind that acknowledges and the mind that knows. What is paying attention to either of those, nothing I guess...
  • You know that mind is paying attention, so you must be paying attention to mind, or you wouldn't know that. You must be watching mind, separate from all the other senses, as it attempts to pay attention.

    But this isn't the way things are, is it?
  • Mind is exactly sight, smell, touch, smell, taste, and thought.

    Awareness cannot be separated from the sense objects.

    In thinking just the thought, nothing else.

    In smelling just the smell, nothing else.

    In tasting just the taste, nothing else.

    All of these vivid arising. Appearing where they are and then gone.

    Sense of body is a grouping of sensations and color then imputation of body onto those to create a sense of wholeness/thingness.

    Examine how reality is constructed.

    See how color meets color to form shape. How light meets shape and forms form. And how the mind brings this all together and labels and distinctions are formed.

    See how the thingness arises together with the name.

    See how clinging (aversion/attachment) solidify that which is assumed to have thingness. And see how assuming thingness automatically creates clinging.

    See how relationships between self and phenomena can only occur if there is an assumption of an independently existent thing.

    If there is no relationship, there is no thing.

    See how perception arises directly with experience. See how if you change perception then experience changes.

    See how if there is no perception then there is no experience of thingness.

    Just vivid, shimmering appearances. Utterly empty, no substance. Just sound, gone. Just thought, gone. All magical, apparent, clear, yet totally made up of no "thing".

    ThailandTom
  • You know that mind is paying attention, so you must be paying attention to mind, or you wouldn't know that. You must be watching mind, separate from all the other senses, as it attempts to pay attention.

    But this isn't the way things are, is it?

    To be totally honest with you it is 7am and I have not slept due to insomnia, so this question has really pickled my brain at this moment in time :buck:
  • No problem :) . Hot malt drink?
  • The thing I used to boil things in and cook rice in broke a few hours ago, so no green tea, no warm milk, nothing. It is a coincidence I was talking about the broken glass yesterday, you know the Buddha taught to see the glass as already being broken.
  • Thank you @taiyaki I will read it again when I have had some sleep and thank you PGhost, for pickling my brain :p:lol:
  • RebeccaSRebeccaS Veteran
    edited September 2012

    What is paying attention to mind?

    Consciousness.
  • Again, what is paying attention to consciousness?

    Consciousness can't pay attention to itself, can it?
  • I don't have any assertions to make. I only want you to see that what seem to be common observations about self or mind or consciousness have no foundation, i.e. what is reported has not been observed.
  • Aaah, but who is reporting? :p

    I appreciate you taking the time to help me out, but I'm still faaaar from sold on the "no self" idea.
  • RebeccaS said:

    Aaah, but who is reporting? :p

    I appreciate you taking the time to help me out, but I'm still faaaar from sold on the "no self" idea.

    I am kind of on this wavelength. I understand that a person is just a combination of the 4 elements that has come together due to factors that have arisen, it is ever changing and will it is only this. But I still have this idea there is consciousness, mind. Of course there is, if there wasn't we would be dead... I guess we are still not getting it :lol: There still needs a lot of practice to be done obviously!
  • PrairieGhostPrairieGhost Veteran
    edited September 2012
    Not-self doesn't mean that what does exist doesn't exist.

    It just means not adding to what does exist.
  • PrairieGhostPrairieGhost Veteran
    edited September 2012
    ThailandTom:
    But I still have this idea there is consciousness, mind. Of course there is, if there wasn't we would be dead... I guess we are still not getting it
    But where did you get the idea that there was an absence of consciousness i.e. death?

    As if consciousness was a light that could be extinguished, leaving darkness?

    You see, there's no absence of it, because it isn't a phenomenon like light, existing in a relative world, and it certainly isn't consciousness.
  • @PrairieGhost man you are almost like a cryptic TB teacher :lol: I am sure if my brain was fresher I would be able to get a better understanding of things at the moment, but that is not the case.

    So reality is there as it is, and our entire lives we have been adding things to it such names/labels and misconceptions etc?
  • Kinda.

    But the names and labels and misconceptions are it too.

    Goodnight :)
  • RebeccaSRebeccaS Veteran
    edited September 2012
    I think there is an absence of mind, not consciousness in enlightenment. Enlightened beings still walk and talk and teach... It was either Maharaj or Maharashi who smoked! There was still life there, just not mind.

    My pet theory is that no self means no ego self or no mind, not the actual end of existence or awareness.

    I say "my pet theory" but it's a pretty common one, I just don't know how or if it ties into Buddhist theory and it's the one I personally believe.
  • pegembarapegembara Veteran
    edited September 2012
    http://camerongilley.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/change.jpg
    taiyaki said:

    Mind is exactly sight, smell, touch, smell, taste, and thought.

    Just vivid, shimmering appearances. Utterly empty, no substance. Just sound, gone. Just thought, gone. All magical, apparent, clear, yet totally made up of no "thing".

    You should know that that which is arising and passing away is only the activity of mind. When something arises, it passes away and is followed by further arising and passing away. In the Way of Dhamma we call this arising and passing away ''birth and death''; and this is everything - this is all there is! When suffering has arisen, it passes away, and, when it has passed away, suffering arises again2. There's just suffering arising and passing away. When you see this much, you'll be able to know constantly this arising and passing away; and, when your knowing is constant, you'll see that this is really all there is. Everything is just birth and death. It's not as if there is anything which carries on. There's just this arising and passing away as it is - that's all.

    This kind of seeing will give rise to a tranquil feeling of dispassion towards the world. Such a feeling arises when we see that actually there is nothing worth wanting; there is only arising and passing away, a being born followed by a dying. This is when the mind arrives at ''letting go'', letting everything go according to its own nature. Things arise and pass away in our mind, and we know. When happiness arises, we know; when dissatisfaction arises, we know. And this ''knowing happiness'' means that we don't identify with it as being ours. And likewise with dissatisfaction and unhappiness, we don't identify with them as being ours. When we no longer identify with and cling to happiness and suffering, we are simply left with the natural way of things.

    http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Living_With_Cobra1.php
    "Whatever is subject to origination is all subject to cessation."

    taiyaki
  • "In the same way, friends, even though a noble disciple has abandoned the five lower fetters, he still has with regard to the five clinging-aggregates a lingering residual 'I am' conceit, an 'I am' desire, an 'I am' obsession. But at a later time he keeps focusing on the phenomena of arising & passing away with regard to the five clinging-aggregates: 'Such is form, such its origin, such its disappearance. Such is feeling... Such is perception... Such are fabrications... Such is consciousness, such its origin, such its disappearance.' As he keeps focusing on the arising & passing away of these five clinging-aggregates, the lingering residual 'I am' conceit, 'I am' desire, 'I am' obsession is fully obliterated."


    That is what Ven. Khemaka said. Gratified, the elder monks delighted in his words. And while this explanation was being given, the minds of sixty-some monks, through no clinging, were fully released from fermentations — as was Ven. Khemaka's.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn22/sn22.089.than.html
  • DairyLamaDairyLama Veteran Veteran

    Can anybody offer up their experiences with this side of Buddhism and any tips? Cheers.

    I'd recommend looking at the Satipatthana Sutta http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.010.nysa.html, which describes the 4 foundations of mindfulness, basically body, feeling, mind-state and mental objects. These are the 4 frames of reference for developing mindfulness.

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