Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Examples: Monday, today, last week, Mar 26, 3/26/04
Welcome home! Please contact lincoln@icrontic.com if you have any difficulty logging in or using the site. New registrations must be manually approved which may take several days. Can't log in? Try clearing your browser's cookies.

Thousands visit Deekshabhoomi in Nagpur

edited December 2006 in Buddhism Today
Thousands visit Deekshabhoomi in Nagpur
http://www.thehindu.com/2006/12/07/stories/2006120708281200.htm
Arunkumar Bhatt

NAGPUR: Thousands of followers of B.R. Ambedkar, Buddhists and neo-Buddhists thronged the Deekshabhoomi here on Wednesday to pay homage to the social reformer and Dalit leader on his 50th death anniversary, popularly known as Mahaparinirvana Din.

Ambedkar had embraced Buddhism with thousands of his Dalit followers at the Deekshabhoomi to epitomise his philosophy of social equality. The place now has the central memorial built like a Buddhist `stupa.'

This year has an added importance because both the events completed half a century.

Besides, it came close on the heels of the gruesome Khairlanji killings.

The police deployed in strength around the shrine heaved a sigh of relief as the annual pilgrimage passed off peacefully.

The authorities had refused permission to hold a large protest rally here last Monday, fearing that it could rouse passions.

"This is a three-day-long programme that would continue till Thursday," said Anand Gaikwad, a volunteer of the Samata Dal. He said people were coming from far and near.

Several groups were led by Buddhist monks.

Devotees did not indulge in elaborate rituals. They offered flowers and prayed with folded hands at the idol of the Buddha and the statue of Ambedkar.

The approach road to the Deekshabhoomi was lined with stalls selling Ambedkar and Buddhist literature, busts of Buddha and Ambedkar.

Chief Minister Vilasrao Deshmukh visited the Deekshabhoomi in the morning and paid homage to Ambedkar. He made a special mention in the Assembly of Ambedkar's services to the country and the community.

Comments

  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited December 2006
    I googled "Khairlanji". Here is the horrible story.

    Khairlanji killings
  • edited December 2006
    Horrible is right, Simon. Wow, that's all so sad. Thank you for posting this. I will be thinking about all of them.
  • edited December 2006
    OMG, this story is sooooo sad. Words can't even describe........
  • edited December 2006
    Wow, I hadn't read anything about the previous incident that Simon linked to. Seriously, what is wrong with our world? I don't understand how people can do this.
  • edited December 2006
    LFA - I don't understand it either. What makes people do these sorts of things? I am sure that is a question that will never be answered.
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    It's really not so hard to understand, YM - it's because we're all natural born killers. We don't like to think about it, but humans evolved and prospered because our intelligence gave us the ability to kill so much better than any other predator. We're able to kill anybody and anything, no matter how small and weak we might be physically, because we're smarter than anything out there. It's in our genes to kill - and to enjoy doing it. William Golding's Lord of the Flies wasn't really fiction; it was a brilliant revelation of our true nature as killer apes. Once that thin veneer of civilization wears through, that's what lies underneath. That's why it's so very, very hard for us to learn compassion or even how to be kind to one another. Our instinct is to go for the throat because of the if-we-don't-get-them-they'll-get-us mentality. It takes lifetimes of training the mind to get beyond that, to even get the idea that that might be a good thing.

    That's why such stories don't surprise me. What is astounding is when a human being, such as Mother Theresa or the Dalai Lama, comes along who actually practices compassion and loving kindness. That's the real miracle!

    Sorry, didn't mean to be a downer!

    Palzang
  • edited December 2006
    Palzang,
    Do you really feel that way? I want to believe that we are born good. And this killer instinct is learned. Which means it can be unlearned. I do agree that it is a miracle when ppl like MT and DL come along. They are special.

    Is this a naive way to think?
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Palzang,
    Do you really feel that way? I want to believe that we are born good. And this killer instinct is learned. Which means it can be unlearned. I do agree that it is a miracle when ppl like MT and DL come along. They are special.

    Is this a naive way to think?


    I'm not sure if the 'killer instinct' is innate or learned. What I am sure of is that human beings have the capacity to make choices and, to me, the fact that we can make skillful ones points towards an underlying goodness.
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Palzang,
    Do you really feel that way? I want to believe that we are born good. And this killer instinct is learned. Which means it can be unlearned. I do agree that it is a miracle when ppl like MT and DL come along. They are special.

    Is this a naive way to think?


    I do feel that way. It's a romantic notion to fantasize about the "noble savage" and that they were naturally pure and peaceful. History and biology teach us otherwise. All you have to do is look around at the world today (and yesterday, and all throughout history). What do we spend trillions of dollars on? Defense (i.e. new and better ways to kill our fellow man). How much do we spend on helping our fellow man? A pittance in comparison - and only because "it's the Christian thing to do". Not because we want to, but because we feel we should. When "terrorists" strike the US, what is the reaction? Go wherever they are and kill every one of them. And I disagree that this is learned behavior. Have you ever watched little kids play? They can be perfectly civil until they want something the other doesn't want to give them, then it's King Kong Bundy time.

    Now, that said, the buddhanature, which is our true nature, is not like that. It is naturally peaceful and nonviolent. However, we are all born into this life with the karma of being human, which means we inherit the sins of our fathers, so to speak. And remember, even the fiercest tiger has the very same buddhanature.

    Palzang
  • BrigidBrigid Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Palzang,

    I see what you're saying.

    I think of us as having two natures; our true buddhanature and our samsara conditioned nature. Sometimes our true nature shines through our samsara conditioned nature and sometimes it can't get through all the crap piled up by our conditioned nature. But no matter what, our true nature is good.
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Palzang-la,

    You have quoted Lord of the Flies before. I wonder if you have also read The Inheritors by Golding?

    My opinion is that we cannot simply read Lord of the Flies as an allegory of human beastliness. We have to understand what we are reading about: these are children, all pre-pubescent or just pubescent, the orphans of a war that happens in the background. They are, also, children abandoned by their parents in a boarding school. The ending of the book brings the adult, organised, rule-protected world back to them. You completely ignore the role of Ralph who tries to show them all that there is a more constructive way to co-operate.

    LotF was published a year before The Inheritors but, if we read the two together, we begin to understand the confrontation that Golding sets up each time in his books between goodness and brutality. In addition, The Inheritors tells the story of the karma that the whole human race inherits from its genocide of the 'Neanderthal' which they excuse by demonising the gentle hominids, just as the children use demonisation and superstition to excuse their own brutality.

    This brutal, animal nature is, in Golding's work, the nature of childhood which will be tempered and restrained by adult law and custom. Certainly, he sees it as instinctual but he poses a vital question: what is it that makes humans different from other instinct-driven animals. Writing in the 1950s, Golding is not yet infected with the mawkish 'angelisation' of children. He has seen them in the war, scavenging and looting in the ruins of London, and England, in the early '50s, was a pretty bleak place. Despite this, he is able to grasp that, beneath or beyond the animal instinct that turns a group of schoolboys into a savage, superstitious, dictator-driven mob, there is the possibility of civilisation and salvation.

    In the European context, we were still trying to understand how our sister, civilised nations, Germany and Austria, had been turned into killing fields. We had begun to see how the war reparations had reduced the German nation to starvation and anarchy. Out of them arose a desire for order, jobs and a good square meal. The National Socialist Party promised both and, at first, delivered them. The terror that had accompanied the fall of the Weimar Republic left people open to the blandishments of potential tyrants.

    If LotF is an allegory of anything, it is of what the trauma of war will bring in its wake. It is a sad fact that we go on proving him right again and again.

    Despite that, the fundamental and more mysterious question remains: where does goodness come from if 'nature' ("red in tooth and claw" as Tennyson saw it) is destructive?

    My own answer is that it is more fundamental than red teeth and claws. It is Original Blessing rather than Original Sin. Goethe says, somewhere (Fofoo may give me a reference) that the eye can see because it has the nature of light. How strange that and organ which is formed entirely in the darkness of the womb can see the sun. In the same way, I believe (and it is a belief, not a proven fact) that human beings are good in essence, which explains why we are capable of making the choice. If we were not, we would be as powerless as plants and as instinctual as a insect.

  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Simon,

    I did read The Inheritors, but it was a long time ago. I disagree that Lotf is just about the effects of war. He's writing about universal themes here, which is the instinctual nature of man and how it comes out when the artificial trappings of civilization are removed, which is sort of what you said actually.

    Brigid,

    Yes, our true nature is stainless and completely without fault. The trick is to get rid of all the conditioning and karmic baggage that covers it up. Buddhist practice could be thought of as the practice of removing all that crap a bit at a time (and hopefully not adding to it meanwhile) until that nature shines through. In other words, it's not about "getting" anything but rather uncovering what's already there.

    Palzang
  • edited December 2006
    The Dalai Lama says in one of his books that we are all born good. I still totally agree with that. I still believe that bad behavor etc... is a learned behavior.

    Palzang, In an earlier post you said to watch children at play. I have done this. Not only in raising 2 sons of my own but by being a licensed day care provider for 12 years. Children who do not have siblings to watch and learn from are not as aggressive as ones who do. If an only child is hit, bitten or hair pulled in a day care setting then that child learns to hit or bite or pull hair etc....
    I do agree that some may come to it quicker than others once learned. But then I think at that point ones personality and Karma come into play.

    Simon, I agree that humans have choices. As children learn mean behavior then they learn that they have a choice to use that behavior or not. And they learn for every action there is a reaction.......whether it's good or bad.
  • edited December 2006
    These are my husbands thoughts.......

    He believes that we are genetically the same and that we are born good. But because of trauma, environmental or health reasons etc... is when behavior changes.

    Example...if a mother is exposed to a toxin while carrying a child then the child could also be exposed while in utro. Then a child might be born mean do to chemical imbalance caused by the toxin.
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited December 2006
    It's all an attempt to understand human beastliness. Christians explain it through Original Sin, Buddhists through karma. Some people see it in our genes, others in environment. Neo-Darwinians see it in the struggle to survive.

    I remember hearing Golding asked why there were no girls on his island and he replied that they would have modified the behaviour too much. Make of that what you will.
  • edited December 2006
    Yes, different theories.
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Actually, if you really think about it, they're all the same thing.

    Palzang
  • BrigidBrigid Veteran
    edited December 2006
    I was just going to say that, Palzang. We're all taking about the same thing.
    Yes, our true nature is stainless and completely without fault. The trick is to get rid of all the conditioning and karmic baggage that covers it up. Buddhist practice could be thought of as the practice of removing all that crap a bit at a time (and hopefully not adding to it meanwhile) until that nature shines through. In other words, it's not about "getting" anything but rather uncovering what's already there.

    Palzang
    This is exactly the way I see it, too.
  • edited December 2006
    I agree with that statement as well, Palzang. It's all about discovering your "true self". Anyone know the true meaning of the word "namaste"? That's what it is all about. Recognizing the divine nature in ourselves and in each other and honoring that. So many of us have so much "crap" that needs to be removed, but if we would just recognize that we are all the same once that "crap" is removed, things would be so nice, wouldn't they?

    So, Namaste to all of my friends!
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    YogaMama wrote:
    I agree with that statement as well, Palzang. It's all about discovering your "true self". Anyone know the true meaning of the word "namaste"? That's what it is all about. Recognizing the divine nature in ourselves and in each other and honoring that. So many of us have so much "crap" that needs to be removed, but if we would just recognize that we are all the same once that "crap" is removed, things would be so nice, wouldn't they?

    So, Namaste to all of my friends!


    Actually we all have so much crap that needs to be removed. That's why we're all wandering around in samsara. As we used to say at the mental hospital, "We're all here because we're not all there!"

    Palzang
  • edited December 2006
    Good point....what I meant by that was, some of us have just a little bit more than others. But we all pretty much have a bunch of it!
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Maybe, but it really doesn't serve any useful purpose to compare yourself to others. You'll only end up feeling superior or inferior. That doesn't help you or them.

    Palzang
  • edited December 2006
    You are always teaching me a good lesson. :) Thank you.
  • BrigidBrigid Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Good point, Palzang. So I guess we're all the same with and without all the crap, really. It's just different crap. No more and no less than anyone else. And underneath it we are all pure buddhanature, too. So any differences are solely superficial and don't really mean much of anything.
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Yeah, your crap doesn't look like my crap (I hope!), but it's still just crap. Get rid of the crap, and we're all the same.

    Palzang
  • not1not2not1not2 Veteran
    edited December 2006
    My opinion is that we cannot simply read Lord of the Flies as an allegory of human beastliness. We have to understand what we are reading about: these are children, all pre-pubescent or just pubescent, the orphans of a war that happens in the background. They are, also, children abandoned by their parents in a boarding school. The ending of the book brings the adult, organised, rule-protected world back to them. You completely ignore the role of Ralph who tries to show them all that there is a more constructive way to co-operate.

    You do realize that at the end of the story the children were picked up by a warship. In my understanding this is his commentary on the bestial, savage nature which rises up in human society. I think it was most definitely an allegory & a huge anti-war statement. The rivalry between the protagonist & the antagonist leaders of the group of boys mirrors how the more constructive way to co-operate often loses out to the way which appeals to fear & our animalistic instincts.

    _/\_
    metta
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited December 2006
    Yeah, exactly. The veneer of civilization is thin indeed.

    Palzang
Sign In or Register to comment.