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My Thoughts on Suicide
The topic about a perceived suicide epidemic made me want to write these thoughts out.
When I have stated my rather blunt opinion on the matter in different forums, I have almost always been met with heavy resistance, so here it is. I believe that suicide is not only the most selfish act a person can commit, it is also the most cowardly act a person can commit. Now, there are just a handful of exceptions to this rule. I would find it very difficult to chastise a dying person in absolute agony or an extremely, mentally unstable person for instance.
But aside from that, I believe it is a disgraceful action. People can say all they want about how I "could never understand the hardships" that all these suicidal folks felt, but I know that many of them just lack perspective.
I see where the mindset comes from. On a nearly daily basis, I hear [mostly] girls talk about just how terrible their lives are, how awful and ruthless their parents are. Not awful in the sense the teenager is sexually, mentally, or physically abused, but awful in the sense that..."They wouldn't let me go out this weekend...wah!"
Now I am a person that places quite a high premium on self-importance and just looking out for old #1. My friends joke that when I criticize someone else for being a little too full of themselves, then it is a serious matter indeed.
Reading the book "For Whom the Bell Tolls" only reinforced these ideas in me. Even though Robert knows he may very well die, he concludes that it is cowardly to commit suicide like his father, and that it would be far more honorable to persevere with grace than to escape a situation just because it's difficult. (I'm ignoring the fact that the author of this book committed suicide.
Just wanted to vent and get your thoughts.
When I have stated my rather blunt opinion on the matter in different forums, I have almost always been met with heavy resistance, so here it is. I believe that suicide is not only the most selfish act a person can commit, it is also the most cowardly act a person can commit. Now, there are just a handful of exceptions to this rule. I would find it very difficult to chastise a dying person in absolute agony or an extremely, mentally unstable person for instance.
But aside from that, I believe it is a disgraceful action. People can say all they want about how I "could never understand the hardships" that all these suicidal folks felt, but I know that many of them just lack perspective.
I see where the mindset comes from. On a nearly daily basis, I hear [mostly] girls talk about just how terrible their lives are, how awful and ruthless their parents are. Not awful in the sense the teenager is sexually, mentally, or physically abused, but awful in the sense that..."They wouldn't let me go out this weekend...wah!"
Now I am a person that places quite a high premium on self-importance and just looking out for old #1. My friends joke that when I criticize someone else for being a little too full of themselves, then it is a serious matter indeed.
Reading the book "For Whom the Bell Tolls" only reinforced these ideas in me. Even though Robert knows he may very well die, he concludes that it is cowardly to commit suicide like his father, and that it would be far more honorable to persevere with grace than to escape a situation just because it's difficult. (I'm ignoring the fact that the author of this book committed suicide.
Just wanted to vent and get your thoughts.
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Comments
Tell me one thing, if you make an exception for the mentally unstable or the dying person in agony, why is that?
It sounds simplistic, but I would probably want the same thing in a given situation. Soldiers dying in tormenting agony. Keep in mind that I'm not saying that I give the green light for mentally unstable people to kill themselves, but I certainly wouldn't hold it against them or chastise them if they were not fit in the head when they did so.
LOL
Yeah, yeah. I noticed that too.
I don't use the word 'sinful' too much, but I couldn't think of a better word in that place.
So if there was even more of a reason to detest suicide, that's it right there.
So if there was even more of a reason for me to detest suicide, that's it right there.
You can never know what goes on in the mind of one who either attempts, or succeeds in suicide....
But I would ask that you try, over time, to dispose completely of this judgemental attitude of considering them selfish.
At the lowest point of their despair, there is no selfishness... there is just a complete loss of hope and desire to go on.
They just want out, and feel the only way to end their utter desolation, is to quit living.
Believe me, selfishness is nowhere in there.
In fact, if you were to look into the face of a suicidal person, and suggest they stop being selfish, that would be the icing on the cake... on top of everything else, someone is adding yet another negative trait to everything they have to bear....
Please take the time to really research the emotions and despair that drives a person to taking their own life.
Ultimately, we as a general society, are responsible, because at one point or another, in some way or another, we have "led" that person to believe that we have turned our backs on them, and condemned them to isolation, abandonment and solitude.
If anything, it might be said that in our "I'm alright Jack" attitudes, it is WE who are the selfish ones.....
I am so sorry Brigid to hear about your loss.
I totally agree with Federica here. Suicide is not selfish, it is a complete loss of hope and that is such a crying shame.
Knight of Buddha, I don't you at all but I really do hope you delve deeper on this subject. We cannot put expectations upon others or judge others. We can only have compassion for such tortured and unhappy people.
I worked for a help line and sometimes, people think suicide is the only way out, it broke my heart listening to some of these people and they believed that suicide would end their suffering but more importantly, they believed they were a burden to others and their families would be happier without them which is the complete opposite of selfishness.
We are talking utter and complete despair here - please do not judge the actions of others'. That is not helpful to anyone really........
To begin with, I hope that my words do not offend or hurt anybody in any way; nevertheless, I would like to express my thoughts about this subject as well. I think that people should be free to express their opinions about things, and that even if we do not agree with those opinions, the person expressing them should still be free to do so, e.g., in this case, KoB is expresing his opinion that to him suicide seems like a selfish action. As painful as that opinion might be to other people, it is a valid point of view. It is certainly true that thoughts of suicide tend to arise from great emotional and physical distress, and the desire to end one's life can arise from not wishing to experience that pain anymore. Technically, that is a "selfish" motivation, i.e., arising from concern with one's own welfare or advantage in disregard of others. Nevertheless, thoughts of suicide can also arise from mental illness and unselfish motivations, e.g., desiring to end one's life out of compassion for loved ones that are burdened with their care, et cetera. In other words, while KoB's view is a valid one, in my opinion, the issue of suicide is not as cut and dry as he is making it out to be.
That being said, I do not think KoB stated his opinion to hurt or offend anyone, but merely to express his thoughts on the matter. Furthermore, in addition to being young and lacking as much experience in life as some of us who has been alive two or three times as long, there are many different types of people in the world with many different views that are conditioned by many different factors; therefore, it is understandable and shoud not be surprising that his perspective on suicide may differ from ours in some way, shape or form. In my case, for example, I not only viewed committing suicide as a terribly brave act because the person going through with it was able to overcome the innate fear of death and what lies beyond we have, but also for the fact that I could never find the courage to actually go through with it myself even though at the time I felt that I could not take my own emotional pain and suffering any longer. In the end, this is a very complex and emotional issue that should be approached cautiously, but we must also understand that clinging to our own views will cause suffering whenever anybody expresses an opposing viewpoint.
Sincerely,
Jason
I'd KILL myself!
_____________________
They merely feared dishonour more than death.
It was a lifestyle thing, I suppose.
There's also the question of being Mindful, practising right View, right Speech and Compassion.
Notwithstanding KoB's right to express himself and state his opinion, it has to be measured against whether in fact to do so, would be a skilful action.
Certainly people may take offense at what I say, but for me to restrain myself on issues that I feel passionate about simply because people may not like what I say is hardly a skillful either.
I assure you I did not intend to offend. This is just the way I feel. I believe it is selfish because a person who commits suicide has to believe that their own despair, their own suffering, and their own self-loathing trump the needs of everyone that loves them. I consider that to be selfish. If that is offensive, then I'm afraid I don't know what to say.
Had my friend succeeded in committing suicide, I would have been devastated and I don't know how I would have ever moved on from that. Or if I would have for that matter.
I had another friend back in grade school who missed almost an entire year of school because she was suffering from cancer. Through perseverence (and a little luck too), she managed to survive the ordeal and went on to be one of the smartest and most grateful people I ever knew.
I can't reconcile the notion that those who commit suicide are not acting selfishly when there are millions of people who would exchange places with them in a heartbeat.
This is where I seem to be differing with you all. I believe it is necessary to make moral judgments about certain actions. How else can we determine what is right and wrong otherwise?
I really don't know the statistics, so that may very well be the case. I just feel that if you make an explicit decision to kill yourself, and you are not dying or suffering from mental illness, then I find the action to be selfish.