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Vegetarian

BaileyDBaileyD Explorer
edited June 2009 in Buddhism Today
Aside from the karmic and dharmic reasons for being vegetarian. Is there any scientific data or studies that prove that it's better for humans?

Comments

  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited May 2009
    yes.
  • BaileyDBaileyD Explorer
    edited May 2009
    ummmm.....linky?:D
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited May 2009
    Don't push your luck kiddo... we're not so strict here as 'elsewhere'....!! :lol::lol:

    Just kidding!

    http://www.ext.colostate.edu/PUBS/foodnut/09324.html

    http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/diet/2001-12-07-vegetarian.htm
  • gracklegrackle Veteran
    edited May 2009
    BaileyD,
    Are you primarily interested in ovo-lacto vegetarianism or veganism?

    grackle
  • edited May 2009
    Just reading up on the USAToday topic of Vegetarian Diets. and this hit me well

    Vegetarians have a 40% less risk of cancer and much less risk of heart disease, diabetes, hypertension, kidney disease and other problems that are common among meat eaters," Barnard says. "Vegetarians also live several years longer and enjoy better health

    Well first off just being a Vegetarian is not all that good for you what they say it is. Fruit and Veg do not give out the amount of Protein your body needs about 2grams of protein per body kg a day I.E a 90kg man needs at lest 180grams of Protein, your body really needs 15g or Protein every 2 hours

    a Can of Tuna of 200g gives out 24.4g of Protein you also need 35grams of Fat in your diet. Which Vegetarian Diet can not give out so alot of Veg eaters feel hunger faster then people who eat meat and their for eat alot more junk food.

    why people who want to lose alot of weight turn to eat a high protein diet. As your body burns more Cals off just to break down the protein if you eat a 8oz steak it would take at lest 2hours to break down the protein burning at lest 50cals

    digesting your food peaks approximately one hour after eating. Spreading your daily caloric intake over 6 meals a day, eating every 2 to 3 hours, helps to take advantage of the increased metabolic rate that accompanies eating.
    In other words, the more often you eat, the higher your metabolic rate





    i study Sports & Nutrition in College, and hoping to get my PhD. in the next 3years in Nutrition and hoping to get a job in a Sports Club of any kind
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited May 2009
    You can get protein from sources other than meat such as beans, dairy products (milk, cheese, etc.), eggs, nuts, soy products (soy milk, tofu, etc.). The same goes for fat.
  • jinzangjinzang Veteran
    edited May 2009
    I believe that the best known report on the benefits of a vegetarian diet is the China Study.
  • edited May 2009
    eggs yes high in Protein but also high in cholesterol. Soy products i would not use, as it has high protein but rather toxic to the human body. It also can effect the human sexual organs both Male & Female with a long term effect. so any young people that are trying for a baby that are using Soy products and get seem to be able to have a baby cut out the Soy and go to your doctor and get a Count done to see did the Soy kill off you Sexual reproduction organ.

    The Truth is we can be here all day and saying Vegetarian diet is better then a Meat Diet. Meat Diet is better then a Veg diet. the truth is Veg and Meat diets do have its good and bad side but you should never think that a Veg deit alone is much health.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited May 2009
    You'd have to eat tons of soya and tofu for those effects to arise and be detrimental. With a balanced diet, soya is no more harmful to you than a t-bone steak.
    ;)
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited May 2009
    daveie,

    Two points. The first point is that meat is also high in cholesterol, especially red meat. According to one article on WebMD, "... vegetarians, those who eat a plant-based diet with no red meat or poultry, are often thinner and have lower cholesterol and triglyceride blood levels than people who eat a diet high in meat and poultry" (source).

    The second point is that while evidence has shown that soy-phytoestrogens may decrease testosterone levels as well as sperm count in men (Soy food and isoflavone intake in relation to semen quality parameters among men from an infertility clinic), depending upon the particular circumstances, soy-phytoestrogens may also help to protect against things such as benign prostatic hyperplasia, prostate cancer, etc. (Dietary soy-phytoestrogens decrease testosterone levels and prostate weight without altering LH, prostate 5alpha-reductase or testicular steroidogenic acute regulatory peptide levels in adult male Sprague-Dawley rats).

    Therefore, while I don't think that a diet high in soy is entirely healthy or unhealthy, there's certainly evidence which strongly suggests that diets high in soy have a noticable effect on male testosterone levels if nothing else. As for myself, I eat a lot of soy-based products; and, even though I take these studies seriously, I don't worry too much about the potentially adverse effects due to my personal feelings about the meat industry.

    Jason
  • edited May 2009
    I dont eat red meat my diet would manly to Chicken and Tuna

    Home Made Smoothie at 8am
    Brain Flakes at 10.30
    Can of Tuna 1pm
    Veg Soup at 4pm
    and Chicken with rice at 6pm

    I has that every day.

    feelings about the meat industry Well in America and the Middle East and Aisa is poor and sad on how they go about killing the Animal, haven seen how they do it in America as well i was shocked.. Were im from if any industry place done it that way they would be shut down right away their are Rules on that kind of thing in Ireland and in the EU. and their could be fines if they were seen doing it other ways


    And people being Fat. Well no wonder they eat all around them drive every where dont go out to walk to the dog or anything their whole diet is based on KFC Burger King or Mc D. you cant eat food and think you going to burn it off buy just watching Tv. Well it rains alot here but still i goes for my 45min walk with the dogs and then goes for my 3mile run
  • edited May 2009
    An uneducated vegetarian can be just as unhealthy as anyone else.

    It takes a lot of research to nurture your body properly, but I believe that is immensely beneficial to eliminate meat from your diet. If not for all the other reasons - you add much more fruits and veggies to your diet!! That alone is much healthier than the typical refined, blanched, and carbohydrate laden diet of many Westerners (US is not alone in this...though a big runner).<O:p
    I myself was a strict vegetarian until recently (now I do eat seafood)...and I did balloon up a bit because of the increased carbs. (I think my Northern European blood isn't used to such a diet). So it really does take a lot of research and planning of your meals.


    When it comes to soy, if you are weary of the supposed side effects - the simple combination of rice and beans forms a complete protein (and cheap!) which has been the basis of many societies for thousands of years!!! Low in fat, and high in fiber.<O:p></O:p>
  • edited May 2009
    Well Rice if you just want empty Carbs then you eat White rice but i would choice Whole Grain Rice. as the whole grain rice has every thing in it from Carbs to fiber how every rice dont have alot protein in it but whole grain would have higher protein then your white rice

    plus two much carb intake would make you alot sleepy. as high Carb intake results in insulin levels to go high which causes low blood sugar which inturn makes you want to sleep. So runner must have High In take of Carbs in days of Running as the Blood Sugar becomes low after eating Carbs so runners while running burn off more of the Carbs they ate for Dinner thats why for Sports people should eat 60% Carbs 40% Protein a 5% Glouse drinks.
  • edited May 2009
    daveie wrote: »
    Well Rice if you just want empty Carbs then you eat White rice but i would choice Whole Grain Rice. as the whole grain rice has every thing in it from Carbs to fiber how every rice dont have alot protein in it but whole grain would have higher protein then your white rice

    plus two much carb intake would make you alot sleepy. as high Carb intake results in insulin levels to go high which causes low blood sugar which inturn makes you want to sleep. So runner must have High In take of Carbs in days of Running as the Blood Sugar becomes low after eating Carbs so runners while running burn off more of the Carbs they ate for Dinner thats why for Sports people should eat 60% Carbs 40% Protein a 5% Glouse drinks.

    I agree that brown rice is a better choice. However look at most Asian cultures, whose staple diet consists of white rice. I realize they also eat a diet lower in fat, refined food, and higher in vegetables.

    But there's also a difference between being an athlete, being a vegetarian, and being a vegetarian athlete.

    Not everyone has to be an athlete to be healthy.

    Native American diets here in the Southwest of America constisted of mostly grain, beans and corn. Corn is denounced in many diets for it's ability to raise your bloodsugar. There are many cultures who have lived almost completely off of what would be called carbs, but the mixing of them with other things, ie. beans and rice forms a complete protein.
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited May 2009
    Do we really acknowledge the blessing that we have so much choice available? That we are not among the starving majority? Do we cultivate a grateful mind?
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited May 2009
    Hey, I want to get me some of them brain flakes!

    Palzang
  • edited May 2009
    Do we really acknowledge the blessing that we have so much choice available? That we are not among the starving majority? Do we cultivate a grateful mind?
    Wonderful point, and most of the time I do not think we do. I know this is certainly something I could be more mindfull of.
  • BrigidBrigid Veteran
    edited May 2009
    I just want to add that diets high in soy products can have problematic side effects for women, sometimes serious side effects. YogaMama can tell us about this better than I can but if you're a woman and you're considering a high soy protein diet you need to research it very carefully. And remember to be especially aware of the source of your information and what vested interests they may have in the information they're disseminating.
  • edited May 2009
    Here in Africa it is harder in rural areas for women to get enough vegetables to achieve a health varied balance. A new book by LIerre Keith called The Vegetarian Myth looks at the problems around an inadequate vegan diet for women in menopause and the harm done by vast monocropping of grains in destroying the local varied produce. Most women here in my area are hard manual workers in the fields and it is easier to obtain animal protein than roots or grains during drought. Manioc/cassava in certain more tropical areas of Africa is very labour-intensive to prepare (I once spent eight hours pounding the manioc) and rice is expensive.

    There are also no condiments like fermented fish products but in more fertile ares, plenty of pumpkin and wild spinach (moroq) as well as ground meal from maize. Monocropping of GM maize and rape seen is a problem. Ethical choices need wide consideration when choices are limited.

    Mary
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited May 2009
    Here in Africa it is harder in rural areas for women to get enough vegetables to achieve a health varied balance. A new book by LIerre Keith called The Vegetarian Myth looks at the problems around an inadequate vegan diet for women in menopause and the harm done by vast monocropping of grains in destroying the local varied produce. Most women here in my area are hard manual workers in the fields and it is easier to obtain animal protein than roots or grains during drought. Manioc/cassava in certain more tropical areas of Africa is very labour-intensive to prepare (I once spent eight hours pounding the manioc) and rice is expensive.

    There are also no condiments like fermented fish products but in more fertile ares, plenty of pumpkin and wild spinach (moroq) as well as ground meal from maize. Monocropping of GM maize and rape seen is a problem. Ethical choices need wide consideration when choices are limited.

    Mary


    Precisely, Mary. I have heard that the same is true in Tibet, where butchers were tolerated but seen as lower caste - a classic case of cultural hypocrisy.
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited May 2009
    Do we really acknowledge the blessing that we have so much choice available? That we are not among the starving majority? Do we cultivate a grateful mind?

    Sometimes, but not nearly enough. Thanks for the reminder, Simon.
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited May 2009


    Precisely, Mary. I have heard that the same is true in Tibet, where butchers were tolerated but seen as lower caste - a classic case of cultural hypocrisy.

    Actually butchers were traditionally Muslim in Tibet as they don't have the same attitude towards killing animals that Buddhists do. They weren't seen as a lower caste necessarily, just did a job that Buddhists normally shunned.

    Palzang
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited May 2009
    Palzang wrote: »
    Actually butchers were traditionally Muslim in Tibet as they don't have the same attitude towards killing animals that Buddhists do. They weren't seen as a lower caste necessarily, just did a job that Buddhists normally shunned.

    Palzang


    ...............and were quite prepared to eat the meat.
  • PalzangPalzang Veteran
    edited May 2009
    Yes, of course, Simon. Do you eat meat? If so, do you butcher it yourself?

    The Buddha's only comment on this whole discourse was that one (meaning a monk or nun) should not eat meat killed specifically for him or herself. That's it. He wasn't a vegetarian! Hmmm....

    But then there's the vow against killing, which prevents one (at least monks and nuns) from killing animals for food. How to reconcile the two? Well, my ignorant opinion is that the Buddha was just being pragmatic. One must eat to live, and whatever you eat, even fruit that falls from the trees, involves death to other sentient beings. So you do the best you can.

    Palzang
  • BaileyDBaileyD Explorer
    edited May 2009
    Day in, day out, we all kill things. We kill any and all forms of life no matter what we try to do. Death is a part of life. The best any of us can do is to limit our impact on the world in the most responsible way we can.
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited May 2009
    Having had a bit of a 'scare' a couple of days ago, a small cardio-vascular incident which passed in about 30 minutes - I have realised that death is truly to greatest delusion we have to dismiss, conjure (if you like), desacralise, demystify, de-taboo (if there is such a word). We behave as if death were something yet there is nothing quite so 'empty of self'.

    Our death is no more nor less important than any other evidence of impermanence, nor is any other.

    I get up in the morning and empty my bladder, aware that, in a short time, I shall be in here again for the same ritual. I get up in the morning and notice that I am still 'alive'. How strange?
  • yuriythebestyuriythebest Veteran
    edited May 2009
    Having had a bit of a 'scare' a couple of days ago, a small cardio-vascular incident which passed in about 30 minutes - I have realised that death is truly to greatest delusion we have to dismiss, conjure (if you like), descaralise, demystify, de-taboo (if there is such a word). We behave as if death were something yet there is nothing quite so 'empty of self'.

    Our death is no more nor less important than any other evidence of impermanence, nor is any other.

    I get up in the morning and empty my bladder, aware that, in a short time, I shall be in here again for the same ritual. I get up in the morning and notice that I am still 'alive'. How strange?


    yeah, I prefer to think of death as an unusually long dream period followed by a change in location and body. Either that or I will become nothingness but if that is the case I will hardly be able to care. Lucid dreaming helps me sorta get the gist of it.
  • edited June 2009
    .

    With regard to Buddhism and vegetarianism, here is a website with lots of information and resources:


    http://www.shabkar.org/


    Kind wishes,

    Dazzle
  • TravisMagoTravisMago Explorer
    edited June 2009
    useless pseudoscience imo. most studies and research are done to validate an already formed view.

    bodies are different and bodies adapt. meat is plenty healthy if you get it from a healthy source. veggies are plenty unhealthy if you get it from an unhealthy source.

    I don't buy meat because I know an animal died(and most likely suffered) for it.
  • edited June 2009
    Worry is a poisonous part of our diet. Worry about purity, nutritional value, who's making the food, what DNA is in the food, which nutrients are most important, which are least healthy...the list goes on...It is important to stay abreast of the issues, but a clear mind will discern the foolishness from the propaganda. Some will seek solace in conspiracy theories. Others will couch their beliefs in corporate or government or religious dogma. What's sometimes most important is to first trust the primary witness. Yourself. For me, I eat lacto-ovo vegetarian. I eat many eggs with lots of cholesterol. I eat a lot of cheese with the same. I eat soy with testosterone destroying isoflavones. I take all the studies with a grain of salt. Many cultures have eaten these foods without detriment for millions of years, far beyond recorded history. I don't like to eat sentient beings because it makes me have bad "sila" or a clouded conscience, if you prefer. I also have my preference to avoid antibiotic and hormone ingestion and the aesthetic nastiness of animal tissue in general. And yet, plants can be GMO or organic crops can be coated with hepatitis A containing feces or whatever. You can never be 100% sure. That is the most Buddhist thing about eating food. You just don't know anything for sure.
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