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Right Speech Question
From http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sacca/sacca4/samma-vaca/index.html
"And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech."
I have had several college professors who commonly use the words 'fuck' and 'shit' as everyday language. They don't seem to give these words any "power" and are not necesarrily using them for "shock value." Do you follow me? They simply are using them as legitimate sentence enhancers. Two of them are English professors, actually.
Does this example still go against the third precept? I am torn because I use these words more when I am around them, and they almost encourage it in our classes. I respect these guys, as they are very intelligent and honest people whom I look up to quite a bit...
"And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech."
I have had several college professors who commonly use the words 'fuck' and 'shit' as everyday language. They don't seem to give these words any "power" and are not necesarrily using them for "shock value." Do you follow me? They simply are using them as legitimate sentence enhancers. Two of them are English professors, actually.
Does this example still go against the third precept? I am torn because I use these words more when I am around them, and they almost encourage it in our classes. I respect these guys, as they are very intelligent and honest people whom I look up to quite a bit...
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Comments
The Eightfold Path, whilst highlighting the different virtues or considerations, should be taken as a whole...
What about Right View? Right Intention? Right Effort? Right Livelihood?
When you consider that those words are bleeped out of programmes on television, someone, somewhere believes them to be 'Wrong Speech'.
Why?
Because they are classified as offensive. And they are 'intended' to be offensive.
There is a world of difference between "What are you looking at?" and What the Fuck are you looking at?"
They are surplus to requirement, really. they might be an emphasis of mood, but they're not strictly speaking necessary.
So what is the intention of using those words? Where is the effort in putting your point across, without causing raised eyebrows, or offence? Should a teacher use such language in his Livelihood?
Swearing - repeatedly swearing - at a Police Officer can constitute a breach of the peace, in the UK. If a person ignores warnings to refrain from using foul language, they can be arrested for provocative and offensive behaviour under Section 5 of the Public Order Act.
A bit of Mindfulness and forethought could help a person get their point across very effectively without resorting to foul language.
Gandhi Brought about the independence of India through peaceful means. I don't think in that time, the word 'Fuck' ever passed his lips.
That we who are growing older find our successors' language objectionable does not make it so.
Add to this that the English languages contain words which, in one place, are deemed unacceptable but normal elsewhere. The best example I have come across is the clash between the UK and US use of the word "fanny".
Remember that every situation gathering kamma has to be intentional.
If you intentionally use such language simply because you feel comfortable, as others in your group do so, is that not 'Wrong' Intention?
And the Buddha also advised us against consorting with 'fools'.... of course, that definition would be up to you......
They are examples of harsh speech arising from a heart with an absence of mindfulness.
When a human being is composed, collected and in touch with their heart-mind, these kinds of words are not uttered.
These words generally arise from habit rather than from mindfulness and self-awareness.
Remember that every situation gathering kamma has to be intentional.
If you intentionally use such language simply because you feel comfortable, as others in your group do so, is that not 'Wrong' Intention?
I can 100% guarantee it when in a room with my mates and no passers-by. What's wrong with the intention, if there is no intention of using it with any abusive, divisive, or offensive connotations whatsoever? In fact, without those intentions, do they not cease to be swear words at all, but instead just... words?
We also have to remember that often, we choose whether or not we are 'offended'. People must ask themselves, do they really have to be offended by such things? Is the offence in the words, or in themselves? Aren't there enough real problems in the world without choosing more? Of course if they insist on being offended, I won't do it around them. But it's just an interesting point to ponder.
That is not your choice. That is their choice. And if they choose to be offended by your words, then you must accept part of the responsibility.
The responsibility for your words and actions does not end the moment you have finished uttering or acting.
Your responsibility ends when your words and actions have been received, and the retort or re-action has arisen. This is where the kamma bears fruit....
If someone is offended by your words/actions, this does not absolve you from the responsibility of what you have said/done.
Prometheus, communication is a two-way street, and it cannot be otherwise.
The problem occurs when we come across someone who is not mindful or aware of this.
It's all very well using reasoning such as "the words are empty, they only have the meaning we ascribe to them", but if I were to call you a "fucking little shit", it might offend you in the sense that my intention in using the words would be derogatory.
I could also say you are a 'wondrous little Angel', and that would have the opposite effect.
Yet they are all still 'simply words'.
Intention is all....
And like it or not, the intention behind "fucking little shit" is wildly different to that of "wondrous little angel".
I can no more call you the former and sincerely wish you anything but good,
any more than I could call you the latter, and sincerely wish you anything but harm.
Please pardon my language, everyone....!!
Yes, go ahead.....
Why still use them at all when there's no bad intention, and no offence given or taken? Because they're emphasis enhancers. What I'm wondering is why you still object when there's no bad intention or offence, since you've been saying all along that it's intentions that are all-important, and I've agreed.
And, I wasn't the one who brought it up. I've only being posting in reply to other people on here.
And yes, you're right that it's their choice to be offended, not mine, and I won't do it around them if they make that choice (that's kinda what I was saying in the first place...)
The fact that someone uses a "naughty word" is really not an issue per se, as others have mentioned. Heck, if right speech were that easy, any of us could master it merely by eliminating cuss words from our verbal repertoire. Conversely, if adding a choice expletive were to gain your attention towards some incoming danger, then such profanity it just might be beneficial, timely, and skillful speech indeed!
- TxH
PS: Allow me this opportunity to use right speech by saying HELLO to my lovely dhamma sis, Brigid. Hi Boo. :-)
Palzang
Absolutely true friend! And yet, if I utter speech with ill-intent in my heart, I still generate kamma. Your ability to demonstrate "right concentration" does not remove me from my own responsibility for right speech! :smilec:
Palzang
The good news is that each and every present moment offers the chance to go beyond kamma and leave no wake behind; each and every moment is a new beginning. The training of mind is a lifetime of loving effort, but it unfolds only as now, now, now!
I take this into my morning and my day's journey, with loving kindness, gratitude, and mindful effort.
Palzang
1. Using swear words as "legitimate sentence enhancers" indicates a dearth of vocabulary, a lack of imagination, and an individual who is "self-expression challenged". When you consider that some of these people are English professors, it becomes downright scary! They do not sound worth of being emulated.
2. I have never heard even ONE single lama/monk/nun swear... ever. It seems to me that this is significant.
3. The practice of Buddhism involved mindFULness, not the mindLESSness of speaking without thinking. As someone who chooses Buddhism, is not to be your benefit to mimic the behaviors of those around you, especially those whose speech seems to be exhibit mindlessness. Rather, your actions should be mindful and generated from yourself rather than your environment.
4. Speaking purely from a practical standpoint, unless you are planning to become an English professor, it does not behoove you to develop the habit of swearing. I can't think of any white-collar employer who will tolerate it, (although swearing seems to be almost "mandatory" among the blue-collar workers in my company).
I have known several college professors like that. I find it pretty tactless when people gratuitously swear or just do it in normal conversation. "Sentence enhancers" reminds me of the Spongebob episode where he and Patrick start swearing at everyone in town.
I regard second-hand swearing as some may regard second-hand smoke. I don't want to be subject to other peoples' foul language in public.
I have nothing against swear words themselves. But you have to restrain their use for when you really mean it. It's difficult to convey frustration to people when you swear all the time anyway. A person has much more power in words when he only swears and curses during times of considerable emotion.
They are as you have pointed out just words, sounds that we wish to place meaning in. However, when one speaks one should be mindful of the effect that could be presented in another mind by such speech. Some could find it vulgar and offensive and it might stir anger in their mind. Our goal is to help set their minds free of such delusional thinking but first we must present ourselves in a manner that they could find acceptable and therefore find it within their selves to listen to Dharma from us. Impressions count for a lot in a world that is ran by delusion and a sense of self.