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Can we control Karma?
Can we control karma? Is it possible to heal bad karma within ourselves? For instance, in the Christian sense, sins we committed out of ignorance before we came to know Jesus, are simply washed away by asking for forgiveness. Is it really that simple tho?
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Your question is can we control karma?
Yes, we can control karma to a certain extent.
Why I say certain extent is because, we aren't smart enough or equipped with the right data, to predict accurately what will come to pass by each of our actions.(past, present and future)
You don't know how one thing might affect another down the road.
If however we did know every factor (and i mean even quantum randomness), we could control karma completely, but if we were that good we'd probably eliminate karma all together and become Buddhas.
Your question probably has some personal root, maybe I could help more if I knew the specifics.
What you have to realize perhaps,
is that you are not the same person u were 5 minutes ago.
you are a forever changing entity. A stream, you have no soul, you have no solid self.
Now, if u have done something bad in the past, the only way to heal it in a sense, is to not repeat the same mistake.
We have many lessons to learn.
In my opinion the only way to fail or sin, is to ignore these lessons.
No, not even in Christianity. It is not as simple as asking for forgiveness. Forgiveness comes when you truly see your "sins" and choose to no longer commit them. I can ask forgiveness every night for stealing, but if I still choose a path as a thief, I am not ready for forgiveness. I don't think it's too far off in Buddhism, but I'm even more ignorant in that area than in Christianity.
No, not really.......
Yes. We can control kamma. This is the Buddhist path. The Buddha taught:
The Buddha also said:
Regarding Buddhism, naturally it teaches forgiveness.
Every evening, good Theravada Buddhists recite the following verses:
And of course, nothing is more renowned than the story of Angulimala:
There are techniques to purify karma, though you can never eliminate it totally. A tantric technique to purify karma is the practice of Vajrasattva. It is very powerful, but again, you can never fully eliminate karma.
Palzang
Palzang
What is done is done, and cannot be undone. But it can be remedied by increasing the good until it outweighs the bad.
Be careful regarding interpretation.
Thus is Wrong View transmitted......
With Metta,
Fede _/l\_
Prevention is prevention. Cessation is cessation. Prevention is not cessation and cessation is not prevention.
The Buddha advised there are four right efforts. The first right effort is for prevention and the fourth right effort is for the bringing of the Noble Eightfold Path to fulfilment.
The word cessation comes from the Pali 'nirodha'. Nirodha actually means 'quenching' and 'freedom' rather than 'cessation'. However, even as 'cessation', it means the ending and complete elimination of any karmic fruits or results. Karmic fruits and results are things such as craving, addiction, habit, remorse, regret, fear, grief over loss and so forth.
The term nirodha in the Pali is permanent cessation and not a temporary cessation. The word for temporary cessation is atungama. For example, when the Buddha taught about dukkha nirodha in the 3rd Noble Truth, this is the permanent cessation of or freedom from suffering, namely, Nibbana.
Thus, as I advised, the Eightfold Noble Path is the path that ends all karmic result or fruit by the purification & liberation of mind. The Buddha taught as such: The teaching of karma is not about actions per se but rather about their results (vipaka). An action without a result is neutral rather than 'karmic'. For example, a factor of the Noble Eightfold Path is right action. The actions are 'right' here according to Nibbana, because they have no result. The actions of the Noble Eightfold Path are not 'good' actions. They are pure actions and void actions. The English translation of 'cessation' comes from the word 'nirodha'. Nirodha is synonomous to the word 'Nibbana'. Nibbana is the cessation of all greed, hatred & delusion and asava. The asava are the outflows. Outflows include all manner of defilements & hindrances, such as remorse. Remorse is easily understood as a result of kamma. The Buddha advised about the ending of the hindrances (nirvarana) and outflows (asava) in many places:
Of a mind completely purified of results of kamma, the Buddha advised:
The Buddhist path is for the cessation of suffering & anything connected to suffering (such as remorse from past kamma). Buddha has advised us the Noble Eightfold Path is the kamma that ends kamma.
With metta
DDhatu
This sutta is very useful but it is mundane rather than supramundane. It ends by revealing an "opportunity" to end suffering. It makes known a way, method or path but not the end of that path. This sutta appears to comment on the view "what is done is done and cannot be undone". In other words, this sutta states for one holding such views, there is no living of the spiritual life, there is no opportunity for the right ending of suffering.
If we are interesting in the Buddha-Dhamma, it is essential we have right understanding that any manner of suffering, including remorse and regret from our past kamma, can be ended through right wisdom and right practise of the Noble Eightfold Path.
With much metta
DDhatu
For those beginners interested in developing understanding about bad karma, good karma and the cessation of karma, I recommend the following reading:
Good, Evil & Beyond: Kamma in the Buddha's Teaching by P A Payutto
Kamma in Buddhism by Bhikkhu Buddhadasa
With metta,
DDhatu
David Brazier may not know what 'nirodha' means but enlightened beings understand what it means. If no one really knew what "nirodha" means then no one has realised the Third Noble Truth.
How sad would that be? No one has realised freedom from suffering.
Edit: I see you added an etymological claim to the post above. Thanks. I will look into it if I have the time.
The Buddha taught the 'fires' of greed, hatred & delusion or craving (literally 'thirst') are the origination of suffering. When these 'fires' are extinguished or this 'thirst' is quenched, this is nirodha. What remains is coolness (Nibbana) & freedom (vimutti).
The following quote sums up the matter well. It does so because if one holds, for example with dependent origination, 'consciousness ceases' rather than is 'quenched & liberated', one's understanding of Buddha-Dhamma and Dependent Origination will take on a different perspective.
In the Third Noble Truth, the Buddha taught dukkha nirodha or the nirodha of suffering.
As the linguistics show, the meaning is 'freedom' from and the 'non-arising' of suffering & its causes.
Christianity offers 'New Life with Jesus Christ'.
How sad would it be if Buddhism did not offer such renewal but instead offerred to us to carry around our old stinking stale rotting baggage forever. What priestly tyranny!
On the highest level, Buddha taught the 'doer' of bad kamma is ignorance. Ignorance is a defilement or kilesa. Ignorance is not a person.
On a lower level, Buddha taught forgiveness & renewel.
When my sister says something that angers me I have control over how I react to it. I can give in to the knee jerk reaction and say something angry back to her or I can summon the understanding and wisdom I've thus far gained and react in a calm, positive manner. The choice is mine and I have time to make it. Therefore, I have control over my karma, my volitional actions. They are subject to my free will.
So, to answer the original question, yes, we can certainly control our karma. How skillfully we do so depends on how far we've come in our psycho/spiritual development. When we know better, we do better.
However, for basic renewal & forgiveness it is not necessary to go so deep.
Buddha taught all bad karma and all suffering & harm are ultimately created by ignorance rather than by some kind of 'personal volition'.
For example, imagine two young teenage lovers who fall apart resulting in all manner of heartbreak, pain & confusion. There is no need to blame anyone here as is often the case.
All harm & sufffering are due to ignorance. The minds of both people did not know what they were doing & did not understand the consquences of their actions.
If their minds did understand, they would not have creating the mess in the first place.
Everything we do in life is merely a lesson for learning. The Buddha-Dhamma is overflowing with forgiveness.
And yet, if I kill someone, I can't go back and un-kill them.
As for this particular sutta, I still think one of the things it implies is: past unskillful actions can't be undone, but their effects can be somewhat mitigated via present skillful actions.
I previously suggested an action is not 'karmic' when there are no results. This whole business of 'karma' is about the results of actions. For example, right action on the supramandane level does not accumulate karmic fruit.
Angulimala killed many beings but ate his alms food "free of indebtedness".
I advised previously, the sutta you quoted is merely mundane and offers an "opportunity". This opportunity is to be fully purified and renewed.
For what benefit or reason do you and others appear to wish for old karma to remain, like a rotten stinking corpse?
Why this obsession with old karma?
Do you let your fridge at home accumulate with stinking rotten food & leftovers or do you clean it out so it is sparkling, clean & smelling fresh?
Well, unless everyone you're preaching to is an arahant, I'd submit to you that "mundane" teachings are just as relevant as "supramundane" teachings as all of the Buddha's teachings are said to have one taste—the "taste of liberation" (Ud 5.5).
This has nothing to do with wishing for "old karma to remain, like a rotten stinking corpse," but understanding how kamma is presented in the suttas. For example, even arahants are shown to experience the results of their past actions (e.g., Angulimala, Maha Moggallana, etc.). The difference is that, with their minds released, only an arahant's body is affected, i.e., they no longer experience feelings of mental anguish (SN 36.6).
Unenlightened worldlings like myself, on the other hand, must experience both until such time as we no longer "accumulate karmic fruit." And as you say, this is an opportunity to be "fully purified and renewed," but doing so involves the mundane as well as the supramundane.
If I kill someone and I go to prison as my social punishment for that action, I can suffer both mentally and physically in prison as I serve my sentence. OR I can find peace and forgiveness even while I'm in prison. My body will still be punished by society, but my spirit cannot be once I have found forgiveness or "let go" if you will. In this way, I think you both can be correct.
Personally, I think the teachings on kamma are designed to illustrate the importance of personal responsibility — that actions have their consequences — but that, ultimately, actions only cause us suffering when they're done out of ignorance [of the four noble truths].
We can't control what we've already done, but we can control what we do with what we're presented with right now.
I'm not exactly sure I understand what you mean. In what sense do you mean 'there is no you'? I mean other than the facts that there is no 'me' separate from all other phenomena and no everlasting 'soul' or entity that is 'me'?
Practice can lead to more space and flexibility in situations like the one you described with your sister, but practicing for choice and control is setting up a new arena for conflict between the "you" that would control and the "you" that you would control.
Although my understanding isn't advanced enough to fully gasp the meaning in your answer I think I got enough of it to mull over in my head. It gives me a lot to think about.
I am assuming that you want to nullify the bad karma. You are looking for a control mechanism to undo it.
Going by laws of Karma
-1 It cannot be undone by us (in a direct way)
-2 However the effect of bad karma done in the past , can be minimised to an exten t
by doing some good karma
eg: Let's say you had hit some one (slapped very hard on someone's face) in a previous birth. ; and you also protected some one from physical abuse say in this birth.
-3 Going by laws of Karma ; both would result into some force of action
Most probably in future if someone hits you - you would be protected / saved by another person. The reason some one would try to hit you (slap you) is because you did a similar thing in the past . But you would be protected because you also saved some one from physical abuse (so you would get the good result of that action as well)
(This was an example of nullifying bad karma)
-4 I will give you another example of minimising the effect of bad karma ; which is quite similar to the Christian concept of seeking forgiveness from HOLY FATHER
When we seek forgiveness from HOLY FATHER we are asking HIM to reduce our karmic debt account (say from $10000 to $1000; but it cannot be made zero)
In Hinduism there is a similar concept of seeking forgiveness/ performing rituals - which is again another way of connecting to GOD and minimising bad karma
If a person did a heinous sin of injuring someone badly (call it 7.5/10 ) in some previous birth;
but that person over a period of time became saintly ; because of his good actions/seeking forgiveness , when he is about to be injured the impact would be less severe
(Quote : You may have heard of miraculous incidents - bullets passing as tanget though the shoulder of a soldier; So as you can see the soldier was subjected to the attcak of a deadly bullet but he was miraculously saved ; the bullet just passed through the shoulder - resulting in a less critical injury)
To me, the laws of karma are known in the heart.
One does not need to do good or the opposite action to undo bad kamma.
One merely needs to refrain & understand one's previous action.
For example, when I was young, I used to go fishing. This does not mean I have to start a fish sanctuary to undo my karma.
I second what DD has already said (see SN 42.8).
Although, I don't think there'd be any harm if DD did start a fish sanctuary.
Sounds lovely! You can come and build a small one in my back garden if you change your mind, DD!
_/\_