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Revelations
A person can experience pain and not suffer it.
" " " have his ego embarrassed and not suffer it.
" " " lose his possessions and not suffer it.
" " " lose his family and not suffer it.
" " " get sick and not suffer it.
" " " die and not suffer it..
Is this Nirvana? All these can be accomplished by having intellectually deep enough understandings of them.
The mind can conquer the suffering of Pain, Ego, Attachments, and Fear.
I think my understandings are nearer to completion.
" " " have his ego embarrassed and not suffer it.
" " " lose his possessions and not suffer it.
" " " lose his family and not suffer it.
" " " get sick and not suffer it.
" " " die and not suffer it..
Is this Nirvana? All these can be accomplished by having intellectually deep enough understandings of them.
The mind can conquer the suffering of Pain, Ego, Attachments, and Fear.
I think my understandings are nearer to completion.
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Comments
The 'hard' part is 'Realising' it and practising.
Being that way, is completely different to knowing that it's the way to be.....
What do you mean by intellectually deep enough?
If you relate to it as conquest, you'll never get anywhere. What practice leads to is more like a surrender than a struggle. (But it isn't a surrender, either.) A thought comes up, you note it, you go back to your breath. There's no conquest there, just acknowledgement, a return to what is already there, and rest.
Surrendering might be the opposite to conquer.... it seems like losing the fight, or giving up the effort....
Good discussion....
But it's not about intellectual understanding, TF. Intellectual understanding is only the very beginning and will have little affect on a person's ability to survive hardship without suffering.
It's about experiential understanding, realization through experience, that develops a person's wisdom. That's when transformation can begin to take place.
Intellectual understanding is the finger pointing to the moon. Experiential understanding that leads to realization and wisdom IS the moon.
See?
I think this question should be "Be?"
With the deepest intellectual understanding ,
experiential understanding is useless..and limiting.
I imagine that the supreme understander, instantaneously develops wisdom by means of prediction, imagination. logic. heuristics..
With this godlike intelligence a person could live in a sensory deprivation tank his/her entire life and be unable to physically practice, but could simulate a thousand lifetimes of errors, learning , wisdom and practice....
So I guess I'm talking about some hypothetical super intelligence...that isn't really possible or relevant for OUR practices...
and 'conquering' is just another way of saying "overcoming gaps of understanding' , i don't mean it the normal way.
So why the heck waste your time - and ours - talking about something imponderable, unconjecturable, hypothetical, imagined and completely irrelevant?!
Why do you not spend your time focussing on examining what you have right in front of you, as opposed to the rambling wild imaginings of some garbled omnipresence?
Why don't you concentrate on absorbing everything you can, about then very basics of buddhism, instead of launching into nonsense?
Sorry, but really.....! :hrm:
One can receive insults and not suffer it. But here, one will not be embarrassed.
The rest are spot on.
One can have right intellectual understanding without realisation.
But to have true realisation without right intellectual understanding is impossible.
If you think TheFound was speaking of conquest in the same sense as the Buddha was victorious, then fine. It didn't seem that way to me, though.