Great Western Vehicle?

Dhamma

Have you guys heard about this sangha, I dont know anything about these guys but they have some pretty interesting stuff on their site...are they legit?

http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/index.htm

shadowleaver

I thought you were talking about a BMW or a Ford

NamelessRiver

We are not interested in Buddhism as a religion, but as a philosophy and practice strategy (dhamma/dharma) that any one can follow to enlightenment [...] Thus the GWV does not expect nor require conversion to Buddhism.

We are Mahayanist because we are ecumenical

We view ethics as not only avoiding the 7 deadly sins(...)

Thus, we accept the literature of the enlightened ones and mystics from every culture, and we will make every effort to include that literature into our canon. Examples of traditions that reflect enlightenment are: Christian mysticism, Kabbalah, the Gnostics, Sufism, the Yogas, Buddhism, Advaita Vedanta, Taoism, Dzogchen, Mahamudra and Shamanism.

since Western thought is founded upon Babylonian, Egyptian, Greek, Hebrew, Roman and Islamic literary sources, such as is found in Greek Philosophy, the Gnostics, Kabbalah and Sufism, then we embrace those literary traditions into our canon.

Sotapanna (stream winner) Jhanananda (Jeffrey S. Brooks) is the founder of the Great Western Vehicle. He is a self-ordained Western Buddhist monk, who has maintained a daily contemplative life that has born the fruit (phala) of meditative absorption (jhana/samadhi) and has become saturated and suffused with the phenomena of meditative absorption (jhana-nimitta).

No, they aren't legit. Also, calling yourself a stream winner? self-ordained monk? el oh el...

Nini

Ill have a look to see if there's something beneficial to my practice. Thanks

fivebells

I think it's very hard to say from that website. The real question is the effect they have on their members.

aaki

fivebells wrote: »

I think it's very hard to say from that website.

"He has become saturation in the bliss, joy and ecstasy of meditative absorption (jhana, samadhi)" ... "he is thus a Sotapanna". "I have read a wide range of dogma, concepts and beliefs regarding the Buddha's idea behind Stream-Entry (Sotapanna)" ... "I can say the Buddha considered anyone who actually lived the Noble Eightfold Path had in fact entered the stream". A small group of kids distorting buddhism in their own particular way.

jinzang

I've seen the site before and I don't think it's a trustworthy source of information.

Dhamma

NamelessRiver wrote: »

No, they aren't legit. Also, calling yourself a stream winner? self-ordained monk? el oh el...

Yeah, this really made me start questioning the stuff I was reading.

allanstevns

http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/Self-Ordination.htm

I somehow cant help thinking about the story where Devadatta broke away from the buddha, with a number of monks.
I think there will always be someone who will try and break away, to make their own tradition with them selves in the lead - but one of the morales in the story of Devadatta is, that even though such groups may florish in the beginning, they usually die down again quite quikly.

Brigid

Finally, since I found all three vehicles of Buddhism rejected the meditative absorption states (jhanas) and other fruits (phala) of the contemplative life for various reasons it seemed inappropriate for me to ordain in any of these traditions of Buddhism, thus I concluded with no preceptor knowledgeable in the meditative absorption states (jhanas) and other fruits (phala) of the contemplative life, and no tradition of Buddhism supportive of the meditative absorption states (jhanas), then I must start my own tradition of Buddhism.

This is from the website, a link to the founder's explanation of why he 'self-ordained'.

He found that every established Buddhist tradition disagreed with his version of 'truth' so instead of going back to the beginning to find out where he went wrong, he simply and arrogantly assumed all the established Buddhist traditions were wrong.

He also believes his meditative attainments are higher than any other Buddhist monastic he has come across and to him that means there is no one worthy of ordaining him, only he himself has the right to do this.

Hmmm....

Hanzze

allanstevns wrote: »

http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/Self-Ordination.htm

I somehow cant help thinking about the story where Devadatta broke away from the buddha, with a number of monks.
I think there will always be someone who will try and break away, to make their own tradition with them selves in the lead - but one of the morales in the story of Devadatta is, that even though such groups may florish in the beginning, they usually die down again quite quikly.

Maybe you are just following Devadatta :-) and its a recall of the "real" Sangha.
Good? Or is it the bad one?

Maybe just an other misinterpretation of the Buddhadhamma, but as Gautama told, no problem with other Religions as long as they walking the 8ful Path.

TheJourney

I like the idea. I'm not sure whether it's specifically legit or not, but I like the idea of buddhist philosophy for all cultures and religions.

pietersa

Sotapanna (stream winner) Jhanananda (Jeffrey S. Brooks) writings that explain Buddha's teachings from an experiential point of view versus a dogma is very much like (not different) the type of writings of Bubba Free John regarding religion and spiritual experience, which eventually became Adi Da , but in relation to Vedanta and Tantric Buddhism with his Dawn Horse Press . Jhanananda is not breaking away from Buddha as suggested in earlier posts, rather he is explaining Buddha's teachings from an experience that is different from what has sprung up from others over the years. For example, fundamentally, many eastern and most western presentations of Buddhist practices (traditions) tell you to ignore and avoid the experience of radiance in and around the body that emerges from practice and leads to an impacting of the individual unit of consciousness with the all-pervasive being consciousness, while Jhanananda explains that this aspect of Buddha's intended meaning of practice, the practice of radiance, which he quotes out of the Canon, is fundamental to gaining the experience of Self as single and all-pervasive, a practice and experience he points out is also prevalent in other religions.

federica

I wish I'd understood any of that.

Anyone else make any sense of it, please....? :scratch:

andyrobyn

I like the idea. I'm not sure whether it's specifically legit or not, but I like the idea of buddhist philosophy for all cultures and religions.

Human beings are complex social creatures and I can see how the core teachings from Lord Buddha do apply for all, irrespective of culture and religion.

Sabre

Sotapanna (stream winner) Jhanananda (Jeffrey S. Brooks)

Stream winning is sooo 2011. :cool:

Cinorjer

I wish I'd understood any of that.

Anyone else make any sense of it, please....? :scratch:

After popping over briefly to the website, I'd say this Jeffrey Brooks is a very intelligent man who has made the mistake of being honest about how he did it on his own. If he'd bothered to join one of the many established guru camps for a while or even claimed he spent a year in a secret temple in the Himalayans or stumbled upon some unknown Native American Shaman, he could claim a lineage and probably have many followers today. But his paranoia is showing. It's not the authorities that are working against him; it's his own words and the rather long list of accomplishments he claims.

He seems to stress the escatic or satori event as the goal to realize the usual "we are all one" state. He's a Universalist, certainly. So how do you determine if the Jeffrey Brooks of the world are authentic or is he just lost in his own mind? Well, you can't. What he needs is marketing skills to go along with his meditation skills. The founder of Falun Gong also came out of left field in just the same way and also preached the same message about having stripped Buddhism of its cultural baggage. In that case, there really was an authority out to get them. The difference is, he knew how to market himself and organize people.

Does it seem cynical to say that religion needs marketing and organization? Shouldn't the message be enough? Well, the Buddha didn't just preach the Dharma. He also created the Sangha, the religious organization to teach and cherish the Dharma, and that took most of his life. Without that frustrating, thankless task, Buddhism would have died along with its founder.

caz

When you hear groups talking about how every religion is in essence the same and they try to include literature from them into their own practice its probably better to seek teachers with an actual dedicated lineage so as there is no conflict in understanding Dharma correctly without other influences.

WallyB

"fundamental to gaining the experience of Self as single and all-pervasive" = Hinduism

caz

"fundamental to gaining the experience of Self as single and all-pervasive" = Hinduism

yup.

KarunaDharmakaya

whenever you start claiming attainments people start tyo question it hardcore.
although we must rememeber the Buddha was a SELF PROCLAIMED MONK.and leader of a sect also,the Buddha claimed to have attainments.

I wonder what people said about him in his day and time,they probley called him a fake also and even made fun of him.
just saying

(anyway im a Tathagatagarbha Buddhist so the gwv doesnt pretain to me anyways)

just my 2cents