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Suicide
Hello everyone, hope your all well.
I know its a grim subject, so apologies for this.
In Buddhism killing is the worst thing you can do (as far as I understand), but if life feels so hopeless, the material world such a grim place, and life so unbearable, then can killing oneself be acceptable? A act of compassion, even?
Suicide has been something I have never quite had the courage to do, but am seeking something to help me finaly take this course of action, and stop being such a burden to my loved ones. I realise my death would cause them pain, but atleast it would be less pain than the prolonged pain my meaningless and painful existance would cause them.
If this life is merely a lodging for rent, and the room is moldy, grotty, falling apart and unhygenic and unbearable, surely we should seek another hotel?
I suppose you could say I am a weak person. And I apologise for talking on this grim subject here. If deemed unsuitable and deleted I would completly understand.
Much love,
Stream.
I know its a grim subject, so apologies for this.
In Buddhism killing is the worst thing you can do (as far as I understand), but if life feels so hopeless, the material world such a grim place, and life so unbearable, then can killing oneself be acceptable? A act of compassion, even?
Suicide has been something I have never quite had the courage to do, but am seeking something to help me finaly take this course of action, and stop being such a burden to my loved ones. I realise my death would cause them pain, but atleast it would be less pain than the prolonged pain my meaningless and painful existance would cause them.
If this life is merely a lodging for rent, and the room is moldy, grotty, falling apart and unhygenic and unbearable, surely we should seek another hotel?
I suppose you could say I am a weak person. And I apologise for talking on this grim subject here. If deemed unsuitable and deleted I would completly understand.
Much love,
Stream.
0
Comments
Even if you believe there is no rebirth after death I think your suicidal thoughts are symptoms stemming from some longing desires, such as to live to imposed (and self imposed) expectations. You say your life is "meaningless" but isn't it taught that everything "just is", that all things come and go and all that our actions really amount to is just playing in the sand? Whatever ideas you have imposed on yourself as to what you should be should be let go. More than likely these ideas have permeated into your psyche by those around you. Remember that all emotional states come and go and try not to own them. Also, the concept of status, success, and accomplishment are invented human ideas which are used to nourish and perpetuate the ego and a sense of self.
I wish you the best in weathering your demons and send you my love.
Committing suicide is a waste of a precious human birth. I would urge you to not entertain thoughts of throwing away something so rare, for you could suffer eons more being reborn in other realms without access to the Dharma.
There is a chance that another 'hotel' may come along, but will it be any better than here? I have read that the Deva realms are much more comfortable and luxurious than our human realm, but that this is actually a hindrance. Because the divine beings have such comfort, they have little incentive to practice the Dharma and free themselves from samsara. The human realm with it's balance of pleasure and pain is said to be an ideal place for practice of the Dharma.
I understand how difficult life can be but remeber all life is valuable and up until now you have had the courage to not end it. In the past when I felt grimm I deconstructed my feelings, saw what was causing me pain and changed it. Please seek some help.
The Urge to End It All
It's really quite unwise to even consider it, because aside from the tragedy, it's extremely selfish.
Stop to consider the devastation that those you love, will have to deal with every day of their lives...knowing that a person they loved actually committed suicide, and they were neither aware of the extent of the problem, nor that they felt that low.
It's an unbearable burden to carry, knowing you failed someone, even inadvertently.
It's the most awful personal stigma to live with.
"So, how's your son/daughter/brother/sister?
Oh, they committed suicide three days ago."
Do you really want to leave those who love you, in such a position?
Really?
The first precept clearly states "Do no harm".
That includes - principally - ourselves.
Do not self-harm,and share with us instead, if you have a mind to.
Go into members' Attic.
it's a thread invisible to unregistered visitors, so you can speak freely, as much as you feel you want.
Just 'sit' with us, and we'll do what we can to support you....
from a Buddhist perspective suicide is absolutely terrible and the next hotel would make the one you are in now look like the four seasons.
everyone feels this way at times-some more than others. You're not going to be judged for what you feel, and Buddhism doesn't teach you'll be condemned to hell for certain things.
The Buddha taught the cause of dukkha but also the cessation of it. He taught this is attainable here and now for everyone. Suicide was not the answer he found. Suicide isn't a solution but an escape.
Do you believe in rebirth? I'm trying to understand post.
When a person Is suicidal, they generally aren't thinking clearly. Your thoughts are completely tainted by spontaneous emotions. Certainly you don't think this way 24/7 and it's important to keep in mind the impermanence of all things including this.
I would strongly suggest finding a meditation centre and begin practicing. Find a therapist and talk to someone about your feelings.
It sounds like you are considering killing yourself because you believe you would cause your loved ones less pain that way. Have you asked them about it?
For what it's worth, it generally seems to be the case that grief over a suicide lasts a very long time.
I just want to give you a big hug my darling! Tonight i will send you all the loving and compassion I can!
As for suicide - been there, done that, and survived. I know what it is like to feel so unbeliveably alone, to hate opening your eyes in the morning, to feel that everything you do and touch turns to shit. I tried to OD, got stuck in mental institutions and so on. But now, I see it was all for something, because now I have a good life in western terms, and have been blessed to find the dharma. This time you are going through, this black cloud, is temporary, even though it is long and lonely and appears eternal. This time is your bad karma burning off so that you may find happiness and allow your good karma to ripem later on.
If it helps, think of your mind, and your life, as the sky. The sky is always blue underneath it all. Some days you will look up and the sun will shine through with no clouds, some days it will be overcast and cloudy, and some days it will be black and filled with heavy black thunder clouds and rain. But all these conditions are temporary and pass by quickly, and return again. And always, the sky is blue and pure underneath. Like the sky, your mind is clear and pure underneath all the empty events and problems which are your karma reaping.
Also, I think (not sure on this) that taking a sentient life is really bad for your karma. This is only one life - we have millions to go, and if you take your life you may run the risk of going through this over and over again. Now that would suck!
Sorry for the long post. I hope this has helped. Feel free to pm me.
Oceans of love.
Things sound pretty bleak for you right now. One of the problems with suicide is that it often is the gift that just keeps on giving. When people kill themselves, there are more close to them or in their family who also consider suicide as an alternative. So you may be leaving them with more than just the sadness over you, you are also possibly burdening your family with further sadness and turmoil. Perhaps for years to come. Perhaps for generations in your family you do not even know.
If you can let go of the belief that people would be better off without you, you may be able to actually think of things that help. No matter how bad things get, there are people who continue on. What a legacy they leave for their family. Courage in the face of adversity, standards to live by rather than a lemmings path of retreat and defeat.
I know there are many people who would truly love to be of assistance in helping you live on this site. PM anyone and I am sure you will discover just how much your life means to others. I count myself in that group. Many people here have had to deal with huge losses in their lives but they have found the way to make their lives, and the lives of people around them better. That is also inside of you. You have the potential to make the world a better place. You may save someone else one day. Dedicating yourself to that potentiality makes your life worthwhile. Chance it and make the world a better place. There is never a shortage of need.
Namaste
Suicide was never condoned by the Buddha, and is almost never considered blameless. I'm truly sorry that you're feeling this way, but killing yourself isn't a solution for suffering. I urge you to talk to someone about how you feel, whether it's a friend, relative or a professional counselor.
I'm not sure why they had the skeleton... to demonstrate the transience of life? As an object for death meditation?
Bless your heart! It's clear you're suffering terribly and my heart goes out to you, dear one. I'm glad you brought this to the forum. It's absolutely essential that you bring it up with as many trusted people as you possibly can. Call the suicide hot line and talk about it with them and especially talk about it with a therapist.
If you find you've come to a point where you feel completely alone and you're thinking about killing yourself imminently get to a hospital emergency room as quickly as you can. Go right up to the admitting desk and say, "I'm thinking about killing myself today."
In short, alert as many people as you can to what you're thinking and feeling in regards to committing suicide.
Why?
Because your thoughts are lying to you and can't be trusted when you're seriously thinking of committing suicide. Don't trust your thoughts. Consider such thinking to be what it really is; delusional. We're all deluded but some delusions are more dangerous than others. It's your thoughts that got you into this mess in the first place and they're still leading you down the wrong path and this path is permanent and affects others in ways you can't imagine unless you've had a close family member or friend commit suicide.
You think your life is burdensome? Your suicide would be a thousand times more so. If your thoughts could be trusted that's what they'd be telling you.
But they're not. They're not working properly. Luckily there are lots of ways to fix your thoughts and bring them back in line with reality and back to peace and happiness. In fact, there are people who devote their whole careers to preventing suicide.
But at the moment, and until you get good help from someone who knows what they're doing, these thoughts of killing yourself are your enemy and your habitual ways of thinking can't be trusted because they're lies and they're causing you to suffer unbearably. They are creating a sick, horrible fantasy world far from reality and forcing you to live in it. Your thoughts are lying to you and you can't do something as tragic and permanent as committing suicide based on lies, can you?
When your thinking becomes healthy again suicide will no longer be an option for you because you'll be able to see through the lie of it and you'll be amazed that you ever contemplated it. You'll also often have moments where you feel overwhelming relief that you never went through with it.
Suicide was my constant companion from the time I was about 9 until my mid 30s. I break into a cold sweat when I think about how close I came a few times. I took the option off the table for good one day when I had a clear moment of thought and the realization of how much pain, suffering, and permanent damage I'd be causing finally hit me.
My older sister killed herself two years ago and if you knew what I know you'd never consider it again.
Please listen to the advice of those who had gone through what you are feeling now. I know that the clouds are dark and there appears to be no light at the end of the tunnel. The Buddhist belief is that all things are impermanent and this includes happiness and sadness.
I can assure you that this feeling will pass but you need to get some medical/counselling help first.
With Metta
Palzang
Believe me, you can not only survive but even emerge transformed by the experience.
Had a quick Google and found this site -
http://www.westernbuddhistreview.com/vol4/suicide_as_a_response_to_suffering.html
Best of luck!
Namaste
If life just sucks in general because of finances, relationships, etc. and you commit suicide, its a sin because there were ways other options. Sure you may be an amazing person with awesome karma and reincarnate in a good place, but you will have a large debt to pay off in the future due to your sin.
EDIT: actually committing suicide in any case, or "putting people out of their suffering" in any case (including dying pets), may be a bad idea, who knows where they'll end up. They may be reborn in the hell realms for all we know.
I have known others who felt the same way, and it is sometimes helpful to turn the mind's attention to how one may help others, especially those who are possibly suffering more than ourselves. Feeling compassion for them and doing what we can sometimes help us move our mind away from negative states of mind.
I don't exclude the animals from this, by the way. Some find it easier to help suffering animals than deal with other humans.
If you are able to post here and explain your dilemma, then your life must have the potential to be positive and meaningful. Please try to shift that focus to what you are able to do rather than what obstacles are in your path.
I just want to add my vote to the "DOOOON'T DO IT!!!!" side.
The above posters have all given a bunch of really good reasons to support their vote.
But I just wanted to put it this way.
If you think your life is SO worthless and meaningless and pointless that you are considering intentionally renouncing living, then why not consider this:
renounce living. go ahead. forget about living your life. fuck it.
imagine holding a gun to your head with the finger on the trigger. before you pull that trigger, you have to ask yourself, "are you sure you are willing to ignore the fact that you could possibly experience all sorts of pleasures if you didn't kill yourself right now?" and if you say yes, then you can pull the trigger. well, stream, my suggestion is that you ask yourself this question, and if you can answer yes, then consider this:
you could kill yourself. but let's say you didn't. then what? does anything you do matter? i mean, you WERE considering killing yourself, so just think, your whole life is EXTRA. and you're going to die anyway. so, if you're willing to renounce all desires and expectations, you have the option of killing yourself now, in which case you would experience no more pleasure, or you could just wait a while longer and in the meantime, contribute here and there with compassion. just listen to everything buddha said. if you don't know what to do with the time you have left until your death, then dude, at least just dedicate your life to what buddha said, which is basically dedicate your life to awareness and renounce all non-virtuous action. don't worry, buddha won't steer you wrong.
keep the harp strings medium tight, not too loose and not too tight or it won't work. don't take anything too seriously, or too lightly. just take a calm, aware approach.
I hope my blabberings helped somewhat.
and also, man, you don't really need much to be happy.
let this guy inspire you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpF-xCMGBSg#movie_player
also this guy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnRqYMTpXHc
music is so inspiring. maybe you could spend your life practicing music to inspire others?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3e29DH52t0Q
shit, there's even good dark music
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkOiKy6sXfM
I haven't read the book myself and have been through my own period of 'falling to pieces'.
Here's some of the reviews:
http://www.amazon.com/Going-Pieces-without-Falling-Apart/product-reviews/0767902343/ref=cm_cr_pr_hist_5?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&filterBy=addFiveStar
Best of luck!
If we are to believe matter and energy are not created or destroyed, but merely converted into another form,
And also to believe time goes on forever,
Doesn't it also follow that, whether or not you believe in karma and set incarnations that you will come back, whether or not you want to?
Consider: 'Well, I would rather try my luck at another life.'
Mental reprogramming does not take an absurdly long amount of time. I think the biggest obstacle is laziness (when boiled down is just a survival instinct - conservation of energy and sticking with the safety of familiar surroundings). It sucks getting over that road block, but once you get into it, it's really not so bad. Noticeable results come on fast. Seeing as you're in a Buddhist forum, I'm going to assume you've had at least some experience with meditation and guiding intention. What kind of pitfalls did you run into that still leave you wanting to commit suicide? How much effort have you put into this kind of stuff already?
There is absolutely no reason to feel guilty about seeking help. If you tell a sob story then choose to continue to either kill yourself or live in misery and spread misery to those around you when you have the means to become happier and make others happy, you are a selfish person - not a weak one. You have taken the first step. There are many more steps. Resist the temptation to get discouraged and go back into the old depressive way of thinking - those kinds of thoughts you harbor are your true enemies, not the world.
It has been mentioned to seek a therapist. This is often not an option to people - both because of financial/geographic reasons (no free therapist in the area) or mental barricades. If you feel blocked from seeking a therapist, I would advise you to seek out relationships on this sight with people who you feel can help (PM or use this forum). Talk about specific examples you are struggling with.
Suicide does not releave a burden from your family. It creates a bigger one. They may spend the rest of their live wondering what they did too push you over the edge, or why they didn't see it coming.
Please don't do it, there is no justification for it. If you feel you are a burden then find a way to become less of one. Donate to charity, help out your family in little ways. Never ever give up.
EDIT: Also, someone else mentioned posting any problems you have on the forums. I think that's a brilliant idea. I'd be willing to try to help you overcome what ever is going wrong right now.
Is your suffering really and truly that great? So incredibly unbearable that you would give up the hug of a friend? The sight of a blue sky? The sound of a wonderful song or nature? The sight of a loved one or the happiness you CAN bring to the lives of those around you? Sadness at the loss of something truly beautiful that you were able to experience and remember?
I think suicide is a thought of the moment. There is nothing to be gained and it is foolish to throw away something that billions and trillions and trillions of potential lives will NEVER get to experience.
Come over and spend some time with me. I'll whip yer ass into shape. If nothing else, you'll want to stay alive long enough just to get away from a moron like me
-bf
Because of the stigma (negative label and scariness) of mental illness people often don't realize that suicidal ideation (thinking about suicide) is a symptom like chest pains that means you need to see a health care professional. Try to find a kind one who you like, it takes time.
Many people who have tried to commit suicide and fail later change their minds and lead happy lives.