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Religon Vs Occupation

edited January 2010 in Buddhism Basics
I have for sometime been training in the art of Shaolin Kung fu, and have enjoyed the teachings of the shaolin/Buddist ways that my sifu has taught me. I am very interested in converting to buddism, but would not want to disgrace, or contradict it any way. The reason im saying that Is because I have, and for a while now, had my dreams set on being a law enforcement officer. I see how the two can contradict each other, but is there exceptions when it comes to defending the innocent, and using power for the greater good? I am very lost, and would appreciate some guidance.

- Dazed

Comments

  • fivebellsfivebells Veteran
    edited January 2010
    I haven't read it, but Thich Nhat Hanh's book Keeping the Peace: Mindfulness and Public Service is probably highly relevant to your questions.

    But don't worry about disgracing or contradicting Buddhism. It is not possible to disgrace it, and it has a gentle way with contradiction.
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited January 2010
    Dazed wrote: »
    I am very interested in converting to buddism, but would not want to disgrace, or contradict it any way. The reason im saying that Is because I have, and for a while now, had my dreams set on being a law enforcement officer.
    Friend

    There is no contradiction here. Buddhism encourages ethics & integrity. The world needs law enforcement officers with such qualities.

    Kind regards

    :)
  • edited January 2010
    i've always wondered though, if i were a police officer and when my morals and the law contradict each other, what would i do? the only example i can think of is drug-related, enforcing arbitrary drug laws, but i'm shure there're more, but doesn't being a dedicated buddhist and being a police officer tear one's allegiance in two at times? then what do you do?
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited January 2010
    Good question....
    A person always asks the "what if" question, but never answers it....

    So Pietro, if you were a police officer, and a Buddhist as well, what would you do to implement Buddhism in as Skilful and Mindful a way as possible, without compromising your duties?

    Think.
    Consider your own question, and reply.
    There's YOUR answer.


    And as ever, each Buddhist must find his own answer, skilfully, Mindfully and using what they know for themselves, in Buddhist wisdom.

    :)
  • edited January 2010
    ah yes, it's a buddhist's duty to subvert the system which is no more than the contrivance of the collective ego
  • NamelessRiverNamelessRiver Veteran
    edited January 2010
    The reason im saying that Is because I have, and for a while now, had my dreams set on being a law enforcement officer. I see how the two can contradict each other
    I see no contradiction.
    if i were a police officer and when my morals and the law contradict each other, what would i do?
    You should follow the law or get another job. That is how public service works: the State gives you a degree of "power" the normal citizen doesn't have, but it does not do it for you to use at your own whim. You have to follow the rules, because the limit of your power is what the law states it is. If you bend the law, you are acting with excess of power, outside your sphere of influence, so to speak, so anything that you do crossing the line is not valid, and in the case of civil liberties will probably be a crime too.

    It goes both ways: if you do something when you shouldn't, or when you don't do something when you should you are working outside the boundaries.
  • ecoeco
    edited January 2010
    As a law enforcement officer/forensic investigator I can tell you that it's not easy. If you decide to pursue this career you must remember that you are expected to use force, possibly deadly force, when it is necessary. Unfortunately the decision to use deadly force usually has to be made in a split second...there is no time to debate the pros and cons of breaking a precept. If you are uncomfortable with the idea of possibly taking a life I would recommend a different path. I'm not trying to sound harsh but I've seen far too many officers that just assume that they will never be put in that position when the sad reality is that it can happen at any time. Just something to think about...
  • edited January 2010
    "Speaking of Faith with Krista Tippett" on National Public Radio did a program within the past year or so in which a female police officer who also happened to be Buddhist was interviewed and the issue was discussed. I think this was in the context of Thich Nhat Hanh's approach, if I remember correctly. But of course if you were to look for that particular podcast on the Speaking of Faith page of the NPR website you could quite probably download it.

    I think it better that we have mindful law-enforcement officers, but of course the important thing is whether or not you can reconcile it with your own spiritual path.

    Blessings.

    Actually, I think I found it... there is a transcript of the program and an apparent opportunity to download the podcast here-


    http://speakingoffaith.publicradio.org/programs/2009/thichnhathanh/transcript.shtml
  • BrigidBrigid Veteran
    edited January 2010
    Oh, how I wish more police officers were Buddhist.

    Yes, it certainly would be a tightrope walk at times, wouldn't it? But if one had an equal calling to both and was willing to walk the tightrope I think they would be an exceptional peace officer.
  • edited January 2010
    I am in law enforcement and I am Buddhist. Believe it or not, it is easier than you think. Much of it has to do with your sociological paradigm. Unlike many in this field I do not see the job as means to control, etc.

    If you approach it for what it is: A chance to generate good karma by helping others, it can be very skillful.
  • ecoeco
    edited January 2010
    Mike wrote: »
    I am in law enforcement and I am Buddhist. Believe it or not, it is easier than you think. Much of it has to do with your sociological paradigm. Unlike many in this field I do not see the job as means to control, etc.

    If you approach it for what it is: A chance to generate good karma by helping others, it can be very skillful.

    If you don't mind my asking...where do you work Mike?
  • edited January 2010
    Rather not say.
  • ecoeco
    edited January 2010
    Mike wrote: »
    Rather not say.

    :)
  • edited January 2010
    :):)
  • edited January 2010
    Aikido mike?
  • edited January 2010
    I thank you all for your responses, they have helped me come to a final decision. I am going to peruse both Buddhism, and Law Enforcement. I am deeply humbled that so many of you came to my aid. I am extremely sorry for not responding sooner, but I have been out of town (I brought my laptop, but not the charger >_<).

    Thank you all,

    Dazed
  • I am a new Buddhist and I have found this article interesting and helpful.
    I think being a Buddhist and a Peace Officer would work fine together and here's why:

    * To many people think police are to violent.
    * Police should treat people with respect until they are threatened, so many of them treat everyone as potential criminals.
    * Being a police officer is ultimately about protecting society and helping society.

    From what I understand searching around is that the general consensus about the precept 1 about abstaining from killing is that it can be taken as meaning "the intentional killing of", if you happen to kill in self defense it can go one of two ways.

    1> You get mad at the other person whom you are defending your self and others against and mindfully attempt to take his/her life on purpose.
    2> You shoot in self defense without the purpose of killing the person but they die as a result.

    I would classify the first as a breach of the precept but the second one was not intended killing and thus is not a breach of the first precept.

    I would put it in the same category as you are driving along in a car and some one suddenly walks out in front of you, you slam on the breaks or you never even saw them, the person dies as a result, you had no way of avoiding it, it's part of life and it was non-intentional, that would not be in violation of the first precept.

    So to sum things up, I think that being a Police Officer and Buddhism are a nice match. However, I do not agree with Buddhism and the Military being an ideal match due to the fact you are trying to kill others (and it is your purpose to do so), it would thus be a direct violation of the first precept. Though however just because you join the military doesn't mean you are going to be on the front line, in today's military you have options of what you wish to do when you go in to service, you could be a field medic or an electrician. But I'd say generally speaking I'd stay away from military service.
  • All parties suffers mentally and physically, is the degree of suffering because of karmic interdependent orgination. Buddha Sakyamuni suffered in ultimate grace from strong physical torture to dead of the ruler before he attained buddhahood. It vows to liberate the ruler upon his attainment. He did not bear a slightest emotional against the ruler.
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