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Jesus Christians
Hi,
I was wondering what everyone thought of this group. I am seriously considering joining them. You can read up on them on wikipedia.
Peace
Stream.
I was wondering what everyone thought of this group. I am seriously considering joining them. You can read up on them on wikipedia.
Peace
Stream.
0
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
What attracts you to them?
It was my disenfranchaisation (sp) with Christianity that attracted me to Buddhism. Here are some people living the true teaching of Christ. No second gueses, no compromises. Their also living alot of Buddhist principles too. Even the Buddhist monasteries I have visited have revolved around money. And don't talk to me about it being "OK", the Buddha wouldn't have approved of money I am sure, the whole concept of it is wrong.
I have never been to a Theravadin Buddhist monastery where the monks themselves handle money. This is one of the monastic rules that they cannot handle money. Only the lay people build the monasteries for them and deal with the worldly money aspects.
Sadly this is the world we live in, especially in the west, where money is needed.
I read that members give all their worldy possessions to the organisation. This reminds me of a particular buddhist group that encourages it's members to claim unemployment benifits and give it to the organisation. This seems good until you see how the money is used. Then, of course, what happens when you decide, after a few years in the organisation, that it's not right for you?
I have heard the phrase "god will provide" so many times and it's usually by the people who already have what they need. Sadly, life is not like that. So many devout christians live in povety and die of hunger.
I'm afraid I have no faith in god.
This organisation seems to have good intentions. But I can't help feel skeptical.
Is there a way you can test the waters without commiting?
(Added) Also, the original sangha (in Buddhas lifetime) consisted of monks, nuns (beggers) and lay men and lay women. The lay devotees would work and care for the monastics by giving them food, clothing and shelter. The lay devotees where very much a part of secular society. The monastics and lay people had an important relationship. In a way, the monastics depended on the lay people, just as the lay people depend on the monastics.
Some monasteries (especially in the east) still operate like this. There are some in the west that still do this, but because of the lack of support by lay devotees, there aren't many.
This is more for me than you.
Being young and idealistic I joined a Christian communal type cult and stayed for three years 1984-87. Left, became an NS Buddhist and was so screwed up by the experience(the Christian one) I went back to it for three months in '88.
This is not about slamming Christianity, it could have been any religion.
I know nothing about this Jesus Christian group. Went to their site read a little, and know even less. It sounds good. They all do.
Know this, if you join. Someone is going to be in control and not you. You will be required to follow their teachings or fall out of favour. It is best not to question. The Jesus Christians say they are similar to the early Quakers so this means you can be shunned. You will have little or no privacy. There will be people watching, spying.
They have to generate money somehow. It will be by you. If you are a member of their forum ask them about their financial structure. They show a picture burning money. It can't be. It is an illusion.
I have yet to see any organization that did not have a certain degree of politics.
It is about power and control.
They have to, to hold it together.
In the beginning you will be shown a lot of attention, caring and love. This is the bait. Later you will have to perform this for other would-be recruits.
More than likely you will have someone appointed directly over you, a 'friend', discipleship partner, a contact, etc. That person will be your spiritual advisor and that person will report to his and his his and so on. (Or hers) . Unfortuantely, that person may have less spiritual insight and maturity than you.
The leaders you will be expected to hold in awe, as you would Moses. For they are there to lead you to the promised land.
Jesus taught if you are to be a leader you have to be the servant of all. If you are serving them only then something is wrong.
Once you are in, it is difficult to get out. In some perverted way you become emotionally attached.
If you leave you are dead. I was told that I was Satan. I thought I was Satan, but the NS Buddhists helped me.
My sister and I joined at the same time. She stayed. I have seen her once since then.
It has been many years since then. Rarely do I recollect this time. I can still feel the pain. Especially the rejection of the people I loved and who I thought loved me. But it's ok.
Like I said I know nothing of this group. This is only one pilgrims experience.
Take care.
If this is true, I think that's unconscionable and nothing short of theft.
I agree with Lincoln. "No second guesses...no compromises..." No questioning?
As George Carlin would say, "Spooky language!"
As for your claim about the Buddha, you tell me. Was money not around during his time? I was under the impression that he came from a well-to-do-family. They must have had an abundance in some sort of currency, be it land, gold, or animals. Surely he made some commentary on it.
Thats a good point. There must be something he said about money somewhere. Considering his denial of worldly things I would expect he didn't veiw it as something that great, just my opinion, perhaps its not right but it what I think. I certaintly don't appreciate the insinuation I am "wrong" or "looney" that one poster made, especially seeing as he dosn't know any different.
Anyway, perhaps a good thing to research on. Buddha's teaching on money, if there is one.
Since you are contemplating joining a Christian commune it would seem you might be also concerned with the teachings of their Bible.
Jesus taught that you cannot serve both God and mammon(money).
Jesus taught to 'render unto Caesar what is Caesars' This had to do with paying taxes.
Many of Jesus' parables are centered around money.
In the Pauline epistles it is taught that LOVE of money is the root of all evil. 1 Timothy 6:10
I do not see any conflict with these teachings and the spirit of Buddhism.
Money is neither evil or good. It is just a tool. A thing. It is the uncontrolled desire for it that creates the problem, the desire to hoard(greed), steal, cheat, lie and kill for it.
The same could be said for anything man perceives to be valuable, such as, gold, silver, land, livestock, agriculture and oil. It is just another means of barter.
Can you give me some of the sources you're using in your research?
Thanks.
Just because someone does something in Jesus' name does not mean they are doing the right thing. Tread with extreme caution, or find a group that does not make you give all your money to "the cause" and cut off all ties with your family
- Raven
ETA - try reading http://www.apologeticsindex.org/j13.html and http://www.exfamily.org/art/cults/jesus_christians.shtml to balance up your research a bit.
My main reason for wanting to join this group was to hurt my family I think (long story). Now I see why I was so stupid. These guys are clearly wacko.
I was seduced by the images of burning money and screwing over society and brotherhood. Looking into things more deeply its not a route I want to take any more. I think I will just arrange a week long stay at my local Buddhist monastery and hope that improves some of my issues.
Seriously though, very glad to hear it. A Buddhist monastery sounds much, much better. That's where you're most likely to find the right help and guidance imho.
I'm sending all my wishes to you for great peace and joy, Stream. Hang in there. I'm cheering for you from my little corner of the universe.
they initially came accross as tree hugging hippy christian types living in a way not that differant to the way us hare krishnas do in temples.. lots of similar ideas about green and simple living..
but when i told them id converted out of christianity and had no intention of going back they turned on the pressure pretty quickly... they were all smiles but it was quite sinister - and the more they smiled the more uneasy i felt ... in the end i took a book from them but only because i didnt want to cause a scene..
i googled them when i got home - and it confirmed what i thought - that they are a fringe group on the edge of christianity - with ideas that would be considered extreme and out there by even the hardest of hardcore evangelical types...
they seem to be a very closed group that go out only to recruit new members... id stay well away from them...
LOL, thanks Brigid thats nice. As I said I'm not sure what I was thinking, I have a habit of thinking impulsivly, but I'm glad I raised the issue here.
This is a wonderful resource and a great place to bounce ideas off other people. We can keep each other on the right path. After all, that's what a sangha is for.
Love & Peace
Joe
"beware of false prophets, for they come to you in sheeps clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves." -Matthew 7:15
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/yoke
"You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes? Or Figs from thistles? Even so, every good tree bears good friut and every bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bea good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cutdown and thrown into the fire. Therefore, by your fruits you shall know them." -Matthew 7:16-20
This also makes Jesus' accused "cult" vonerable. Cult leaders tend to have sex with their disciples or manipulate them for money. So a man that had devious intentions surely would have ommitted that. Seeing as how he's teaching them to judge their spiritual leaders by the fruits they bear.
Jesus said: "No teacher is greater than his disciple".
Given our newpapers have been replete with Christian sexual scandals and abuse over the last few years, it appears Jesus had many short comings as a teacher, in relation to his doctrine and how he established his religion.
Most falls back on the doctrine of salvation by faith rather than by actions and promises of some paradise after death.
You are an insane liar!!!!
He said the Exact opposite!
"No servant is greater than his master.'"
He also said:
"But you know that he appeared so that he might take away our sins. And in him is no sin. No one who lives in him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen him or known him. Dear children, do not let anyone lead you astray. He who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous."
He also said:
"But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart." -Matthew 5:28
You are a liar, and no truth is in you. May God have mercy on your soul!
You said people have free will so how can they have sin?
Mmmm...I doubt Jesus said this. I would suggest maybe Paul or John said it.
Please show me this God?
Also, it seems by your appraisal, you are a liar too.
In fact a bigger liar. I have not read the Bible in 15 years but you probably read it often and still misquote it.
No mercy needed here friend.
What is your opinion on it?
Do you think superstitious beliefs about an afterlife based on faith have lead to men & women becoming priests, nuns and TV evangelists for the wrong reasons?
:smilec:
Although these "Christians" cannot be saved, you think you can save Budddhists?
Is this because Buddhists generally have better moral discipline than Christians, thus the Buddha gives you a little head start?
if any one can convince me otherwise, of course.....