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Lifelong Atheist

edited August 2005 in Faith & Religion
I have always been an atheist, I have never believed in any god, devil deity or anything that any religion worships. I have been seeking something through my life, and I am of 2 people in my mind and stuck in a mass confusion in my body and soul. I have seen Buddhism before but was always told it was a strict religion not for outsiders and now know that is not true. The more I read and and learn of buddhism, the more i am drawn to it. The spirituality, the enlightenment, the control and strength of mind and body working together. Not for a deity or god, but for yourself, inside. That is what I am seeking in my life. I have so much tragedy, pain and problems that i am spinning out of control. I need guidance, and help in my life, and the only one who can do that is me. This quiet yet powerful essence (that is the only word i can think to describe it for myself) is something that is too beautiful to describe. I do know Buddhists, and they are wonderful people, the best I have met, as Christians, Catholics, Jewish and all religions condemn me as they learn of what I am. Buddhists just smile and talk with me about life and things. I can never believe in a god, diety or anything omnipotent, but i can believe in myself and I feel that is why buddhism will help me and be a true guidance, fullfillment for me. Any information and guidance will be welcomed.

Angyl

Comments

  • ajani_mgoajani_mgo Veteran
    edited August 2005
    I'm sure you will pick up more thingz and realize the Truth in the end still, maybe earlier than some of us, with your open attitude. Welcome to the Real World!

    OK first to solve your problem... This material I need to know what is it you are worrying about?
  • buddhafootbuddhafoot Veteran
    edited August 2005
    Angyl,

    I think you're farther along than some people. Some people on this site are dealing with (when it comes to "seeking" - not to minimalize what you're saying :) ) throwing away things that have been engrained in them since they were children.

    There is a good book I've been reading called Buddhism Without Beliefs by Stephen Batchelor. He is a man who was a former monk in both the Tibetan and Zen ways of Buddhism.

    He makes some very, very good points and thought about life and dealing with things.

    -bf
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited August 2005
    This book contains all of the teachings that the Buddha himself said formed the heart of his message. It is written by Thanissaro Bhikkhu: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/thanissaro/wings/index.html

    * A note on the author: Thanissaro Bhikkhu (Geoffrey DeGraff) is an American Buddhist monk of the Thai forest kammathana tradition. After graduating from Oberlin College in 1971 with a degree in European Intellectual History, he traveled to Thailand, where he studied meditation under Ajaan Fuang Jotiko, himself a student of the late Ajaan Lee. He ordained in 1976 and lived at Wat Dhammasathit, where he remained following his teacher's death in 1986. In 1991 he traveled to the hills of San Diego County, USA, where he helped Ajaan Suwat Suwaco establish Wat Mettavanaram ("Metta Forest Monastery"). He was made abbot of the monastery in 1993. His long list of publications includes translations from Thai of Ajaan Lee's meditation manuals; Handful of Leaves, a four-volume anthology of sutta translations; The Buddhist Monastic Code, a two-volume reference handbook for monks; Wings to Awakening; and (as co-author) the college-level textbook Buddhist Religions: A Historical Introduction.
  • ajani_mgoajani_mgo Veteran
    edited August 2005
    I have here a quote from spaceman, from the thread "Help My Friend, Brothers and Sisters!":

    "Ask your friend to look around at everything that is red, tell her to spend 15 seconds looking around at all the red things she can see and to remember them. Then ask her close her eyes, she’ll be expecting you to ask her to remember all the red items, but while her eyes are still closed ask her how many blue things she remembers seeing and ask her to name them individually. I bet she won’t get many if any!

    This is an experiment to show that we only notice what we focus on. This is very true and it is true with all things in life, whatever we focus on becomes our reality."

    Make the you yourself, then maybe you will find a new meaning in life.
  • edited August 2005
    Are to many to list, so many negative things in life that surround me, I am trying to climb out of it. Allot of my problems are very personal and wont post here. Some may be triggers for others with same problems. But I suffer from extreme depression, PTSD, and migrianes. They are still looking for a definition for the rest of my problems lol. The mnigraines are heriditary and will have them forever, but PTSD is a result froma violent act to harm me that I survived and permantly disabled. I Have found that Buddhism is very comforting to me. It isnt a crutch or a bandage but it is actually a comfort to my body, mind and my soul. I want serenity and peace within my body and mind, and here I seem to find it. I have studied allot of religions, (not becoming a part of it but a study to understand it) and found all have one thing in commen. They have a need to believe in omnipotent beings. Not so much as a belief into themself, and of thier own abilities. they place restrictions upon themselves in the rules of thier religion. I dont begrudge them that it is thier right to choose thier belief, but for me, spirituality comes from within, not from someone that I cannot see or that is all powerful. The most powerful thing is the belief in yourself, and your abilities. When you can achieve that, i believe that is when you find true spirituality, and peace.

    Angyl
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited August 2005
    Angyl,

    It is so good to hear that you, too, find some comfort in Buddhism. There is nothing wrong and much that is right in wanting to be comforted. After all, we are social creatures.

    For me, taking refuge in the Sangha means realising that I am part of the companionship of all beings. I am not alone even though that may be my delusion.

    It is a joy to take refuge in the Dharma because it actually teaches the truth of freedom, having first acknowledged my bondage.

    And, what can I say about refuge in the Buddha? How to describe the sense of the reality of buddhahood? And the growing awareness that it is, not simply as potential but, 'within', here and now.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited August 2005
    hello Angyl,
    You sound like a wonderdful person to get to know.... I am reminded of something my Shiatsu teacher once said to me, which I'm sure Simon would agree with.
    "We as teachers" (I'm quoting him now) "often set out to impart our knowledge to others in order to increase the pool we inhabit. So many times, we come out of the lesson having learnt more from those we are purpotedly teaching, than they have learnt from us."

    Life is a continuous exchange of knowledge. Never ever forget, dearest Angyl, that if you are coming into this site to receive information and guidance, your imput will almost certainly be immeasurably valuable to others here. We all need each other, and it is thus, that we all benefit from the information and guidance.
    Bless you. Stick with it. Whatever ails you, know that ultimately, you are stronger.
  • ajani_mgoajani_mgo Veteran
    edited August 2005
    Problems can't be solved in a flash. If not, all of us would be hightly enlightened saints. You need to feel them gone, think them gone and behave them gone. You simply need more time I guess. Meanwhile, keep your Buddhist attitude up.

    All I have to say is that, don't go feeling too bad about it.
  • edited August 2005
    Angyl wrote:
    I have always been an atheist, I have never believed in any god, devil deity or anything that any religion worships.

    I think it's interesting that you've always been an atheist. I wasn't atheist until I was about 19 or 20 (and I'm still only 22). Before then I was an uber-devout Christian - the last person you'd think would lose faith. But the more I read, the less sense it made. Sometimes I still feel a pull towards those old beliefs, though. Some people might believe that is a "sign", and sometimes I do wonder if there's something out there, but mostly I think it is because that was just how I was raised and it will always hold me at least a little bit. Of course, it's not something I like to admit to many Christians because, well, it gives some of them renewed hope that they can convert me and personally, I'm just kind of sick of hearing the same arguments again and again and again.

    Just curious, what was it like to grow up atheist? Do you ever fear that there really is a deity or deities out there that you might be offending?
  • buddhafootbuddhafoot Veteran
    edited August 2005
    Sometimes I still feel a pull towards those old beliefs, though. Some people might believe that is a "sign", and sometimes I do wonder if there's something out there, but mostly I think it is because that was just how I was raised and it will always hold me at least a little bit. Of course, it's not something I like to admit to many Christians because, well, it gives some of them renewed hope that they can convert me and personally, I'm just kind of sick of hearing the same arguments again and again and again.

    I was just thinking after reading this that you seem much more open than your Christian friends.

    What is wrong if you sometimes feel old pulls. I don't think that there is anything in the basic teachings of Buddha that disagree with the teachings of Christ. I could be wrong here - and if I am - I'm sure someone will point it out :)

    If you believe in a Christian god - especially after reading the New Testament - do you think a god of compassion and love would be upset with someone questioning what other "people" tell you you have to do or not do? Do you think a Christian god would be upset with a person trying to remove those elements which Buddha taught us causes suffering? Which of the elements that Buddha taught us causes suffering (craving and such) were ever stated in Christianity as being "something we need to do to follow Christ"?

    I know this is just my opinion - but I think you are much more open minded than your "converting obsessed" friends. I don't mean to say that your friends are bad people - I just have never believed in enforcing my opinions on my friends - or keep bringing my opinions up that make the time when I'm with my friends "uncomfortable". So, I don't like it when other people do it.

    -bf
  • SimonthepilgrimSimonthepilgrim Veteran
    edited August 2005
    DharmaKitten,

    You ask about being brought up as an atheist. That was my experience and I am extremely grateful for it!
  • edited August 2005
    It was Hard being an atheist as a child. My mother Desperately wanted me to be religious, sent me to sunday schools, the extra activities, the events at church. My own mother realized that I would not be a religious person I doubted everything and questioned and fought them about the beliefs and the bible. Mt grandfather was a preacher, but that had nothing to do with my way of life. After a while I did start to hate chistianity because I was constantly being forced to pray and ask for this that forgiveness. What does a child need forgiveness for? Innocence and the right to ask and/or want reasons? I was constantly being forced to ask for forgiveness for my doubting and everything. But soon i realised it wasnt the religion I hated, because it was just that a religion, it was the people twisting it, and forcing it upon me that i truly hated. Christianity is interesting read, but full of contradictions. But today i was with my therapist, I had not told him as yet of my growing interest in Buddhism or that I was Atheist. He started suggesting that I sgtart doing relaxation techniques and he said dont close your mind, even if think its wonky but give it a try, he started telling me about buddhism medditation. I couldnt help myself I started laughing, he said oh no... I said no isnt what you think, I had not told you but then that when i explainedc what i have been doing. He showed me the techniques, and they were relaxing it take some time to be able to control it, but still it wqas very comforting. It just struck me as maybe I am on the right path now, cause fate has now given me someone to help me along the path of buddhism. Finally for the first time I had a flow of relief through me. He said that I was one of the spiritually and emotionally strongest people he knew to be able to find a way to make my life positive from what i am dealing with. And now for the first time in a long long time... I am starting to feel that my life has meaning agian. Sorry for the tangent but my happiness is so great with this I wanted to share.


    Angyl
  • edited August 2005
    buddhafoot wrote:
    I was just thinking after reading this that you seem much more open than your Christian friends.

    What is wrong if you sometimes feel old pulls. I don't think that there is anything in the basic teachings of Buddha that disagree with the teachings of Christ. I could be wrong here - and if I am - I'm sure someone will point it out :)

    If you believe in a Christian god - especially after reading the New Testament - do you think a god of compassion and love would be upset with someone questioning what other "people" tell you you have to do or not do? Do you think a Christian god would be upset with a person trying to remove those elements which Buddha taught us causes suffering? Which of the elements that Buddha taught us causes suffering (craving and such) were ever stated in Christianity as being "something we need to do to follow Christ"?

    I know this is just my opinion - but I think you are much more open minded than your "converting obsessed" friends. I don't mean to say that your friends are bad people - I just have never believed in enforcing my opinions on my friends - or keep bringing my opinions up that make the time when I'm with my friends "uncomfortable". So, I don't like it when other people do it.

    -bf

    I don't think that god would look down on me for most of my Buddhist beliefs, but if actually believing in that god is a requirement to avoid hell/get into heaven....well, I'm screwed. Oh well. Despite the occasional feeling that there might be some sort of deity out there, more often than not it sounds like a bunch of bologna to me. (No offense meant to the theists out there.) If anything, I find the Bible with all its contradictions and horrible stories, including in the NT, to be further proof that that god does not exist and if he did, the only reason I'd worship him would be from fear - and I really don't want to be that kind of person. Again, no offense. Just my personal thoughts over the past few years.
  • edited August 2005
    Buddhism has never spread by conquering armies or through fear, but because it bears a universal appeal that does not discriminate against the rich or the poor. Maybe that's why I like Buddhism so much. Not just because I want to be rebellious or because I am going through a phase, but because it really makes sense to me. I can have a healthy individual meditation practice and follow the 8-Fold path yet still be able to hold my own views and morals on our society and the world. In Christianity I feel like I have to believe this doctrine or else I am a heretic or something like that.

    I am told that it is good to have doubt but that I have to keep working really hard on my faith. Yet the more I try to understand and grasp Christianity, I only become more confused and distance myself from it. I guess I am an agnostic buddhist now. I am trying out Buddhism right now to see if it is right for me. I think it is because I have become so much stronger in the mind and body.
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