Welcome home! Please contact lincoln@icrontic.com if you have any difficulty logging in or using the site. New registrations must be manually approved which may take several days. Can't log in? Try clearing your browser's cookies.
Why live?
ravkes
Veteran
Does this word why even exist outside of your thoughts? Is our purpose not to question why but rather understand our bodies and react accordingly? Even if a little "i" doesn't exist, why should this big "i" exist? I am confused naturally, because my mind is a little confusion creator. Regardless, I want to know what Buddhism has to say about the meaning of life if it says anything at all. Oh and if you could tell me the reason why you live eat and drink and what not, and if you don't think a reason is important tell me why.. lol Thank you. I suppose I have the answer, this question is essentially what my brain pooped out. thanks for bearing with me
0
Comments
you know this how?
But basicly I think it if it came from the desire to close off from reality and escape to comfort it would just harden that ignorance for the next life.
Thank you for challenging me on that. It did sound as if I was speaking from personal authority. I have heard my teacher recommend to people that they not commit suicide.
Speculation isn't productive especially in this sort of discussion. As you said, rebirth is speculative to begin with and thus the kind of kamma you're discussing is speculative.
Not all acts that aren't conducive to attaining Nibbana are negative. Positive kamma is not conducive to attaining Nibbana, either.
Suicide isn't inherently "bad." Good and bad are subjective. The mindset of the person at the time and the reason for suicide is certainly important. It may be perceived as bad by certain people... does your future rebirth depend on how others perceive your action? This kind of kamma, is all speculative.
Yes, but this is true without the speculation.
Well, generally, yes, it's a good recommendation.
I think we can safely conclude that suicide is somehow going to harden at least wrong view. The alternative conclusion is to recommend suicide in certain cases. Someone might even give a teaching for the correct way to commit suicide.
I'm far too early in my understanding of Karma to worry about rebirth, and all of that.
Our purpose is to learn to live free from suffering. When that occurs, the questions about life & death will cease.
Then we will live simply because we are alive. Then, when it is time to die, we will simply die.
Kind regards
-Shakyamuni Buddha
(from the cards that came with a course I took)
Kamma is defined by the Buddha as "intent." Actions are not inherently "good kamma" or "bad kamma" and good and bad are subjective. A person's mindset is and intent is important in kamma. Neither what we call "good" or "bad" kamma, both of which are based in greed/aversion/delusion, aren't conducive to Nibbana, either way.
But my point is that, you openly stated that rebirth is speculative. Therefore, answering someone who asks "why live?" with reasoning that relies on a speculative view isn't particularly helpful. Reasoning should be based on what we know for certain. This is reminding me of the Kalama Sutta. Regardless of what happens after death, why live?
I just think it's an interesting topic.
Huh?
So why live, because life is good. Even if we knew for a certainity this life is all Quiet_witness gets and on a big enough time scale all the life on Earth will see its final day, knowing all that with a certainity, one might ask why live, and I would still answer that when we accept the truths of reality and are awake from our mind's deceptions, we see life is good.
:eek2:
(I know what you were referencing with the Mat comment, and I know you know it's a sutta, but I think you misunderstood why I mentioned the sutta in the first place.) LOL take care.
In fact speculation is probably a favored past time of mine
It's not that I've never speculated on life after death. I've held both opposing views actually. It's just that, it cannot be proven either way, and so arguments based on it are inherently flawed. It would not be good advice for a suicide hotline counsellor to take such an approach; it would end like this:
"But the "me" of the next life isn't the "me" of right now, so still my suffering would end! *hangs self*"
or "But that's only if rebirth is true... but it might not be so *hangs self*!"
etc. xD
See ya. :P
I thought about this and I might relate to you that some of my thoughts were from personal experience in a manner of speaking. I too have wondered if life was worth living. I know from personal experience that that may lead to a depression where one is contemplating suicide. I know that from personal experience. And I also know from personal experience that one of my reasons for continuing with life was to try and avoid negative karma. Because I believed that positive actions would eventually and inevitably lead to positive results. And negative actions would eventually and inevitably lead to negative results.
To a certain extent that is speculation (about karma). But it is also heart advice from a man who has also thought about and faced these thoughts.
Another way to put it is something I got from reading of a random buddhist teacher. He said there was no bottom to hell. It can always get worse.
I think two changes in myself were helpful. One I decided that I didn't like my negative thinking and I seek some way to get better. Two I came in contact with an awareness practice. The insight that helped me was to see that thinking such as "the world is not worth living" is just thinking. It gets very solid. Hell indeed. But it is just insubstantial thinking. And you can wake up from it.
Yeah. Thanks to all who have answered.
There is a fine line between wanting to not be or annihilation and accepting what is.
Bhikkhus, held by two kinds of views, some devas and
human beings hold back and some overreach; only those with
vision see.
And how, bhikkhus, do some hold back? Devas and humans enjoy
being, delight in being, are satisfied with being. When Dhamma is
taught to them for the cessation of being, their minds do not enter
into it or acquire confidence in it or settle upon it or become
resolved upon it. Thus, bhikkhus, do some hold back.
How, bhikkhus, do some overreach? Now some are troubled,
ashamed and disgusted by this very same being and they rejoice in
(the idea of) non-being, asserting: “In as much as this self, good sirs,
when the body perishes at death, is annihilated and
destroyed and does not exist after death – this is peaceful, this is
excellent, this is reality!” Thus, bhikkhus, do some overreach.
How, bhikkhus, do those with vision see? Herein a bhikkhu sees
what has come to be as having come to be. Having seen it thus, he
practises the course for turning away, for dispassion, for the
cessation of what has come to be. Thus, bhikkhus, do those with
vision see.
~ Iti 49
Dhamma Dhatu,
Thanks for posting this. As one who is struggling with major depression and at times suicidal thoughts (I AM NOT SUICIDAL GANG, DON'T WORRY!), I was going to quit reading this as it was just upsetting. I'm glad I read this and then stopped reading. I needed to hear that we can live just because we are alive and no other reason.
As usual, another great post. Thanks, DD.