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"Karma, Continuation and the Noble Eightfold Path"

onewiththirstonewiththirst
edited May 2010 in Buddhism Basics
I'm reading this article by Thich Nhat Hahn and am starting this thread to discuss what I learn. I'm just learning about Buddhism - if you asked me what I believed right now, I wouldn't have an answer other than I am trying to figure that out.

Right Thinking

I sometimes have thoughts enter my conscious mind without consciously summoning them. Sometimes these thoughts are not right thoughts. What I do , upon being aware of the not right thoughts, is to think / say to myself, "No, I will not continue thinking this." Sometimes this works better than others. When it isn't working well and I need to make a decision / take action related to the not right thoughts, I will, whenever possible, delay the decision in an effort for the decision to not be tainted by the not right thoughts.

Should I be going deeper than this? Should I try to figure out why I am having these not right thoughts? Then I could decide whether I am able to / will make adjustments at the source of the not right thoughts.

Comments

  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    edited May 2010
    I don't agree with it as I experience things. But that could just be my experience. I agree a little but I don't believe I have control in 'right thoughts'

    For me its all about 'just thoughts'. So when I do have wrong thoughts I can breath a sigh of relief that they are 'just thoughts' and I don't have to do anything with them. They are impermanent and I can just do nothing.
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited May 2010
    onewiththirst wrote: »
    hi

    The Dvedhavitakka Sutta about Two Sorts of Thinking may be helpful here.

    Kind regards

    :)
  • MarmaladeMarmalade
    edited May 2010
    Your heart beats without you telling it to
    Your lungs breathe without you telling them to
    What makes you think thoughts happen because you tell them to?

    You can try to control these things to a certain extent, but in the end, they'll do what the want.
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited May 2010
    Wisdom. Understanding.

    :)
  • DisneyDisney
    edited May 2010
    I wouldn't have an answer other than I am trying to figure that out.
    This is a very sincere heading of "doubt" in your search of nature in Buddhism. It will fruition in time to come depending on yr capacity. Always indulge in exploring in this kind of open "doubt' (just dun attached over it) will increase yr capacity and shorten the period of fruition.
    From my understanding of all patriarch approach in Buddhism.
  • JavelinJavelin
    edited May 2010
    Wrong thoughts occur because of trends in the mind. In applying right effort to abandon the wrong thoughts, you are supplanting the ignorance that leads to those thoughts with wisdom of how they are unskillful/unwholesome in nature. That is your karma. That is part of changing the trends of your mind, to 'clean' your mind and develop higher morality (sila) that is a part of the path, and leads to a more tranquil mind that is able to maintain greater mindfulness, achieve greater concentration and perceive the true nature of reality through meditative insight.

    Keep practicing.
  • TransmetaphysicalTransmetaphysical Veteran
    edited May 2010
    Thanks for the article! I myself was having a problem with non-self and rebirth, but Thich Nhat Hanh, as usual, clarifies the confusion!



    .
  • onewiththirstonewiththirst
    edited May 2010
    When the son sees the father as a different person, as someone who has caused a lot of suffering and difficulty for him, he wants to punish his father with his words and actions. He doesn’t know that to make his dad suffer is to make himself suffer at the same time. You need to understand that you and your dad share the same reality. You are the continuation of your dad. If your dad suffers, you will also suffer, and if you can help your dad not to suffer, then your happiness will be possible. With the insight of non-self we can avoid many mistakes, because non-self translates into right view.

    Right now, my take home lesson from this is that by choosing to act with anger to cause pain to my father, I am causing myself suffering due to the discord I am choosing to embrace. If, instead, I can manage to just keep my mouth shut in times of anger; to not lash out, then, I can avoid wrong actions and wrong words. Maybe, just maybe, the anger may pass sooner by not acting on it.

    A related example of impermanence is that my father was a less than pleasant individual when I was a child, but maybe he is more pleasant now. Likewise, I do not have to continue to be the child with lesser power than him now - I can be an equal as adults.
  • DisneyDisney
    edited May 2010
    You need to understand that you and your dad share the same reality.
    This "Same reality" seem very interesting???
    Probably "Karma, Continuation and the Same reality"
  • onewiththirstonewiththirst
    edited May 2010
    What I hear reading "same reality" is that I was taught to perceive life as my father does. I think there's more meaning to "same reality" but I'm not there yet.
  • dontknowdontknow
    edited May 2010
    Subhuti, one of buddha's great disciples, had the mentality that thoughts were something that should be repressed. He brought this view to the buddha to check his practice. The buddha "hit" him because of his attachment to the teaching. (When I say "hit" I am referring to hitting his thinking mind.) Do not attach to the teaching of right thought. Also, the secret to right thought is to not attach to your thinking period. All thinking, like was mentioned earlier, is impermanent, not real, and something your mind creates. A thought about anger can come into your mind and two minutes later a thought about love can come into your mind. Which one is the ultimate real thought? So, when a thought enters your mind, observe it, become aware of it, but do not attach to it. Do not fuel it, do not judge it, do not make it important. Only let it go. Put it down. If you can put all thoughts down, then you are free from your conceptual mind.
  • dontknowdontknow
    edited May 2010
    Also, to add to my previous comment:

    Right thought is not anything special. Right thought is, "What are you doing in this moment? Then only do it! If thinking is required for the task then think. If not then ok, no need." Also, don't create something out of nothing. Creating castles out of clouds is a fun pastime for both children and your mind. Your mind likes to create problems and situations, comparisons and contrasts. Put all those creations down. They do not exist in reality. Your likes and dislikes are nowhere to be found but in a passing thought. Your beliefs about right and wrong are the same. Put those things down.
  • onewiththirstonewiththirst
    edited May 2010
    dontknow wrote: »
    Subhuti, one of buddha's great disciples, had the mentality that thoughts were something that should be repressed. He brought this view to the buddha to check his practice. The buddha "hit" him because of his attachment to the teaching. (When I say "hit" I am referring to hitting his thinking mind.) Do not attach to the teaching of right thought. Also, the secret to right thought is to not attach to your thinking period. All thinking, like was mentioned earlier, is impermanent, not real, and something your mind creates. A thought about anger can come into your mind and two minutes later a thought about love can come into your mind. Which one is the ultimate real thought? So, when a thought enters your mind, observe it, become aware of it, but do not attach to it. Do not fuel it, do not judge it, do not make it important. Only let it go. Put it down. If you can put all thoughts down, then you are free from your conceptual mind.
    dontknow wrote: »
    Also, to add to my previous comment:

    Right thought is not anything special. Right thought is, "What are you doing in this moment? Then only do it! If thinking is required for the task then think. If not then ok, no need." Also, don't create something out of nothing. Creating castles out of clouds is a fun pastime for both children and your mind. Your mind likes to create problems and situations, comparisons and contrasts. Put all those creations down. They do not exist in reality. Your likes and dislikes are nowhere to be found but in a passing thought. Your beliefs about right and wrong are the same. Put those things down.

    Thank you. This helps me understand.
  • thickpaperthickpaper Veteran
    edited May 2010
    dontknow wrote: »
    Right thought is not anything special. Right thought is, "What are you doing in this moment? Then only do it! If thinking is required for the task then think. If not then ok, no need."

    What you describe, mindfulness of the moment, is more to do with right view and right concentration, isn't it?

    Isn't right thought more to do with the will to confront the defilements. Ie the intention to understand and extinguish greed, aversion and dishonesty?


    And a large part of that intention is carried out by right view (the path before right thought) and a large part of the intention is carried out by the precepts/paths that follow, composing the moral aspect of the path.


    In a very real sense right thought is what holds the path togther.

    it is very special!:)

    namaste
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