Welcome home! Please contact lincoln@icrontic.com if you have any difficulty logging in or using the site. New registrations must be manually approved which may take several days. Can't log in? Try clearing your browser's cookies.
in need of some advice
ThailandTom
Veteran
Greetings to all.
I really dislike boring people with my problems and rarely trouble people with my moaning or issues, but when I am truly desperate I hope that people on this forum can help in some way. The thing with buddhism and buddhists is that they tend to be very logical, clear minded and compassionate, so I ask if anybody can dump some advice onto me if you will and sorry if any one of you has heard any of this before...
As a lot of you may know I am far from being a good buddhist and have been attempting to practice the dharma for over a year and a half. More recently I have lost my way and have seen a change in my personalty and mood. I have hit rock bottom and it is time to pick myself up and change.
One of the main problems I have is with this person some of you may have heard me speak in the past, somebody who I have a great deal of attachment with and who had to move away with her family nearly 2 years int a relationship with me. After they moved away, it inevitably began to decay and break down and it finished, but we still have kept some sort of contact now and then, (something destructive to me). I am mindful that I should not fuel these thoughts and emotions connected to her but they are so powerful they almost rule my every day life. It comes in waves as for a few weeks I am fine and then I can feel it building up inside me until I give into these thoughts and just become depressed.
Anyway, she has always lived with her family be it in the UK or Italy, but next month she is moving to Germany with her language degree to study for 10 months. I said that I really do not wish to be privy to her going through this change and sadden myself even further, so a few days ago I broke contact all together and gave my reasons. i feel deeply somber because it feels like a part of me has died once more, I know how destructive it will be for me to have contact in such a period of ones life, but also without them it also hurts a great deal.
Now, Bearing all of this in mind, I am fully aware of attachments, aware that these things are out of my control. I am aware of non self but do not properly understand the concept, something I really want to be able to grasp but cannot seem to at the moment. I know I should not become intoxicated but recently have been drinking very often
I actually cried for the first time in probably over a year a couple of nights ago and I truly have just hit this wall of depression. Like I have said, the stupid thing is that I know how I should be conducting myself but I easily slip into this rut.
I also live in thailand and moved away from everyone and everything I had ever known about 7 months ago, apart from one friend who now lives an hour away due to occupation. I am normally totally fine with this, but recently have been feeling lonely.
What am I asking for exactly in this thread... Hmmm I think a good kick up the backside would be a good start. I realise it is down to me to change things but I would benefit from some guidance.
Can anybody suggest a plan of action if you will... or just any constructive criticism and or advice would be great. Thank you and sorry for the long read,
Tom
I really dislike boring people with my problems and rarely trouble people with my moaning or issues, but when I am truly desperate I hope that people on this forum can help in some way. The thing with buddhism and buddhists is that they tend to be very logical, clear minded and compassionate, so I ask if anybody can dump some advice onto me if you will and sorry if any one of you has heard any of this before...
As a lot of you may know I am far from being a good buddhist and have been attempting to practice the dharma for over a year and a half. More recently I have lost my way and have seen a change in my personalty and mood. I have hit rock bottom and it is time to pick myself up and change.
One of the main problems I have is with this person some of you may have heard me speak in the past, somebody who I have a great deal of attachment with and who had to move away with her family nearly 2 years int a relationship with me. After they moved away, it inevitably began to decay and break down and it finished, but we still have kept some sort of contact now and then, (something destructive to me). I am mindful that I should not fuel these thoughts and emotions connected to her but they are so powerful they almost rule my every day life. It comes in waves as for a few weeks I am fine and then I can feel it building up inside me until I give into these thoughts and just become depressed.
Anyway, she has always lived with her family be it in the UK or Italy, but next month she is moving to Germany with her language degree to study for 10 months. I said that I really do not wish to be privy to her going through this change and sadden myself even further, so a few days ago I broke contact all together and gave my reasons. i feel deeply somber because it feels like a part of me has died once more, I know how destructive it will be for me to have contact in such a period of ones life, but also without them it also hurts a great deal.
Now, Bearing all of this in mind, I am fully aware of attachments, aware that these things are out of my control. I am aware of non self but do not properly understand the concept, something I really want to be able to grasp but cannot seem to at the moment. I know I should not become intoxicated but recently have been drinking very often
I actually cried for the first time in probably over a year a couple of nights ago and I truly have just hit this wall of depression. Like I have said, the stupid thing is that I know how I should be conducting myself but I easily slip into this rut.I also live in thailand and moved away from everyone and everything I had ever known about 7 months ago, apart from one friend who now lives an hour away due to occupation. I am normally totally fine with this, but recently have been feeling lonely.
What am I asking for exactly in this thread... Hmmm I think a good kick up the backside would be a good start. I realise it is down to me to change things but I would benefit from some guidance.
Can anybody suggest a plan of action if you will... or just any constructive criticism and or advice would be great. Thank you and sorry for the long read,
Tom
0
Comments
This is how ego is fabricated. So you don't feel this negativity which you fear a whole ego is created. So it is your chance to notice exactly what you are doing. What adds to the misery? What makes it clear up a little? Its a chance to see the roots of suffering.
Notice that the thoughts about your girl are just thoughts. The sense of dread or a sense that the world is bad. Just thoughts. Know to yourself that these are just thoughts and that your heart can let them abide for awhile.
Welcome these thoughts but do not get caught up in them.
Yes, still with these feelings. I actually do think that they are not just hurt feelings over some girl, or hear break because I have had them for over a year lol... How silly.
But they are only thoughts as you have said, mere thoughts. Blah, I just want to sort my life out
Check out the section at the bottom on buddha torrents...
Something from a book I was reading, different thing for each 365 day..
By Trungpa Rinpoche..
" Problems as Opportunities
The attitude that results from the Buddhist orientation and practice is quite different from the "mistake mentality." One actually experiences mind as fundamentally pure that is, healthy and positive, and t"problems" as temporary and superficial defilements. Such a viewpoint does not quite mean getting rid of problems, but rather shifting one's focus. Problems are seen in a much broader context of health, one begins to let go of clinging to one's neuroses and to step beyond obsession and identification with them. The emphasis is no longer on the problems themselves but rather on the ground experience through realizing the nature of mind itself. When problems are seen in this way, then there is less panic and everything seems more workable. When problems arise, instead of being seen as purely threates, they become learning situations, opportunities to find out more about one's own mind, and to continue on one's journey."
I'm sorry you are having such difficulty right now, and hope you find some sense of direction soon. Letting go of loved ones is difficult for any reason.
I noticed you did a lot of invalidating of your own emotions and a lot of self-criticism, calling your difficulty "moaning" and possibly "boring people"... how you're "not a good buddhist" and how you need a "good kick".. etc. I would say at this point, looking at this self criticism is the best place to focus your attention, as it will easily prevent any authentic progress.
Almost everyone has problems. When we look at that simple fact, we usually take it in one of two ways. Either we use it to invalidate our own issues and feelings, such as "Everyone has problems, so I should suck it up and be happier because my problem is petty"; or we use it to unite us into a common family of human mistake and suffering, such as "Everyone has problems, so I will accept that it is natural and normal because my problem is common"
In my opinion, only the second approach has the potential for lasting interpersonal change. While you're grieving the loss of your close friend, consider looking at your pain... not as some stupid thing that might bore other people with your moaning, but as a real and sad loss that we can empathize with. Others want you to be happy, Tom, and allowing yourself to accept that your emotions and struggles are important will help you become more awake to the truth of who Tom really is. The more healthy and awake you become, the better off we will all be.
I think, apart from working to validate your feelings, you might want to start contemplating anicca when you are feeling somewhat stable and open. Consider Checking out dhammatube on youtube, and look at some of their instructions and wisdom on the topic. You seem to struggle with impermanence, as there seems to be a lot of a sense of permanence in your words today... both considering your mental states permanent, and lamenting that your other relationships are not.
With warmth,
Matt
http://www.shambhalasun.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=28&Itemid=105
I do realise everybody has problems and everything that comes into being soon passes, it is just I am really bad at dealing with certain problems.
I thought I had gotten rid of a lot of attachment to this person or had at least dealt with a lot of it, but I was ignoring it and it has built up to a point where I just cannot stop crying and being depressed.
But yea, thanks a bunch. I honestly do dislike asking for help especially when it is a similar topic each time and I seem to learn very little. Man, I have to sort it out lol
The normal response we tend to give when we lose someone's love is to question ourselves and our worth. We not only have to feel the rejection of this other person but we add to it by rejecting ourselves. We love ourselves less at times like this but the fact is, at this moment in time we need the love of ourselves more than ever.
Compassion for self can be difficult for many of us (particularly Christians) because of the type of upbringing we have had where self-love is considered sinful. If you can't love yourself when you are in the depths of your deepest and darkest moments, then when should you be giving yourself this love? When everything is going right? That is the typical response so there is little wonder people become deeply depressed.
Appreciate yourself, meditate on you and what is good about you, give yourself some loving kindness. If this woman is worthy of your suffering, then certainly you are worthy of some rejoicing and appreciation for who and what you are.
As you come to love yourself more, the suffering must fall away. Hatred cannot coexist with something so powerful as love.
Namaste
I think that you may be having difficulty with the actual truth of suffering. Though i don't want you to judge yourself , its important to see the situation through eyes of wisdom. It might be difficult for you to practice compassion toward yourself , and the self loathing is probably making it worse.
I can't really say what is going on with you , nor can anyone else for that matter. The buddha talked about the Four Noble Truths. He seen into every kind of suffering and was able to help us all understand that scenarios just like you described are inevitable and we all have to deal with the feelings of loss , pain, and grief. Maybe a story might help
A woman was very sad that her son died. One day she went to the town where people told her a holy man was able to help people very deeply. The woman heard of the miraculous powers of this man and that he reached enlightenment and wanted to see if he could help in any way. She went to the buddha and asked if he could bring back her dead son with all his powers. The buddha said, " I will bring back your son on the condition that you bring me mustard seed from a home where no person there has lost a relative or friend and that they have not lost a relative or friend to death". The woman was relieved at the task and set out to find this special seed. She went everywhere and finally not being able to find one single mustard seed from the family that buddha requested she went back to the buddha and told him that she couldn't find the seed. He said " just as you could not find any mustard seed from a family that hasn't lost a relative ,friend or son or daughter. So everyone must realize that none can escape death".
Loosing someone we care about is very similar to death my friend. Your loss is important time to see the reality of impermanence and know that your not alone.
Stop beating yourself up. You are going through a difficult time. Just look at all the changes you've gone through lately - you've lost a friend, moved to a new location (and likely feel disoriented and missing the place that you came from), and you haven't made any friends yet in your new location. Those are all valid reasons for feeling shitty.
A few weeks ago I was feeling really rotten - starting to get depressed and feel overwhelmed, so I asked myself why I was feeling depressed. So I made a list of everything that had happened to me in the previous six weeks - starting with my father's death and visiting with my frail and failing mother, added on a number of practical challenges I was dealing with on the home front, and I realized that I had a pretty substantial list. I thought I should go out and seek support, so I went to visit a friend and said - hey, I want to talk to you about why I'm feeling shitty. She was a great support - she understood and validated my feelings. Then I did something similar with another friend, who also validated my feelings. Then I spent a couple of hours meditating with my sangha and it was like a fresh breeze blowing through my head. All the shit started to drop away. The phrase "clinging mind" (from the sutras) came to me and I asked myself what I was clinging to. I realized that I was holding on to anger and resentment with respect to some people who I felt had let me down. This was another great realization that helped me get past the shit.
I strongly suggest that you make an effort to make friends in the place where you are living. Search the web to see if there is an ex pat group in your area, or join an interest group where you can find like minded people. Getting out and having a few laughs with some new friends will make a world of difference. Once you've developed trust with new friends you'll be able to share with them and have people for mutual support. And if you don't already have a sangha to practice with, it would be a good idea to find one.
This makes a lot of sense and have never viewed it in this way before. I basically have very little love for myself all of the time, it is something I am trying to work on however.
Thank you, but I know my problem is far less than many other people have or have had, for example all of those poor people grieving over a loss due to 9/11 .. But my problem is a problem none the less just like everyone of us has in our lives.
Today I am feeling slightly better, something maybe inevitable, but in the past this happens and then it builds up again over days/weeks. I need to get back into my practice properly, the truth of suffering is something I know about and am aware of, but maybe I should read over it again.
Thanks for all of the advice guys, it is an overwhelming response compared to what I maybe had expected, so thank you. I have to take charge and stop being laxidaisy about the matter
Barra I am truly sorry to hear of your fathers passing, although you appear to be coping well with your close friends and clear head. Of course it will still hurt but you really do appear to be coping very well.
This is basically my point, my problems are nothing of this nature yet I am wreck. I have made a few friends here but they have moved on, they were thai. I was moving around once every week or so but have settled in Hua Hin for the last few months. I would prefer to actually be friend thais than expats, but ding that is not easy for me right now as social anxiety has again swept into my life. I dislike even going out some days, depending on my mood and approval on myself, which is quite ridiculous. I have gotten use to not having much contact with people since moving away and for the majority prefer it that way. But I understand how going out and doing things does take your mind off of certain thoughts. I have only been a recluse if you will for the past 2 months or so, before then I was going out with my friend and meeting plenty of people, getting up to fun and sometimes crazy things, taking in the culture. But that was then..
If you want an obsession to stop torturing you, my best advice would be to investigate the mind-object in your mind and find the flawed judgement that is causing the clinging. This will involve letting go of how you wish things were, but it will result in freedom from burden. It will also involve confusion and discomfort, and I think it is possible to make things worse, in other words drive yourself insane. But be determined! Have faith! There has to be a solution, and you can find it.
I still do not understand my own ¨self¨ but I do recognize that all sentient beings have two aspects -- one can be called mind, sentient being, buddha nature; the other can be called animal, body, object, or personality. In other words, everyone has an inside and an outside. Say for some reason you´re obsessed with someone else´s outside. For you, that object is one of the cool things you´ve found in the world. The mind has evolved to look for cool objects (that´s why people like food, cars, fireworks, guns, reproductively favorable humans, dogs, etc.). I only know one mind, and that is mine. In my past I have come across the bodies of many sentient beings, including my own. Maybe I´m lucky because a few months ago I basically got fed up with sentient beings. I no longer wish to interact with them. Except my cousins´cat Jack, whom I´ve been living with the past couple weeks. He ignores me for some reason and I realized today that my mind is being delusional about him, I gotta let go, cats are simply not that awesome. Anyway, what I think I was trying to say is that not only do I not find my OWN SELF awesome and satisfying from the inside, nor the outside, but nothing in this world will bring me awesome satisfaction, and I can´t even see others, only their outside, which is a mess, and far from awesomely satisfying.
I am fighting a war, and it is difficult. Recently I´ve pretty much decided to be celibate my entire life, something I didn´t think I was capable of a year ago, and starting yesterday, triggered probably by some females on TV, I am having yet another battle with lust. Writing this post helped me help myself. I hope others find it of some help, or see flaws in my reasoning and can help me.
Absolute nonsense!
But I will try and look into this notion of clinging and what do I want from having her in my life.
Recently I have been feeling a lot better about the situation with thanks to these people on this thread and just general input from the buddhist society of western australia. I have been trying not to feed this thoughts I have and to acknowledge them and let them go. It does help to quite a considerable extent, but I also have been saying to myself that things are the way they are and there is no point in fighting them, we have little affect on most things in life so just roll with it lol. However, I am yet to get back into a decent meditation routine, something I really should do.
I am still striving to get this notion of non self, maybe this is my problem, I am striving, grasping at it. I don't know, it is a hard chestnut to crack for me.
I heard that you mentioned you are fed up with sentient beings? I am under the impression that we should have compassion and kindness for them in action and thought, this reflects back upon us and brings peace to our lives..
I know where you are coming from with the TV thing. I think Tv is really a very negative thing indeed. It has been described as the opium of the nation and it is. I do gawk at women sometimes if I watch TV, but I also feel bad about myself as TV is riddled with The idealic men and women, it is part of advertising and the modern world. We need to look a certain way etc, so I often feel bad about myself when I see these people. So I rarely watch TV, it is also a mind numbing action in my opinion, steers away from enhancing the mind.
But I am glad this thread has managed to help somebody
-- 37 Practices of a Bodhisattva
And I have to make an important clarification. I understand what you mean when you say that you valued her inside more than her outside. But I wasn´t clear. I didn´t mean that ''outside'' is beauty and ''inside'' is personality. I meant that ''inside'' is someone´s private experience of life, which is their mind. Minds are alone. One mind cannot know another mind. You will never know exactly what it´s like to be someone else, because you cannot see their mind. You can only see your mind. I think realizing this was part of what led to me losing interest in others. Consider your own ''personality''. Is that what you are? What is personality? I think a ''personality'' is only an observation of how a sentient being SEEMS from the outside. But things are not how they seem. Notice that in my definition, personality is only an observation. It´s a thought like ''oh, that thing is like THIS''. Just another mind-made concept.
I hope I clarified somewhat. Maybe these are concepts that are impossible to explain well because language doesn´t cover the area too well. Good luck, anyway.
Oh, and this is one of my favorite Dhamma readings.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/thai/chah/not_for_sure.html
Basically is this saying that we should look into the chaotic and troubled mind rather than ignoring it and thinking it will be all okay? I have been trying to do just this recently, there is a lot going on there like most people I am sure. It is a nice little quote though
I have social anxiety and know exactly why I have it, well to an extent I do. But I have been touching upon metta meditation briefly but am still a bit uncertain on it. Of course, progress comes with practice. I have been reciting to myself in meditation what I want for myself and those around me, how I want to be peaceful, content with who I am and healthy, also for friends family back home, strangers and people who have come to hurt me int he past. I understand you are suppose to not merely say the words, but really mean them and feel them. However, I am not sure I am doing this or not...
But yes, I can see that I will never truly know what it is like to be you or inside your head, or what it may be like to be a feline of yours, but why is that relevant? I am sorry if I am missing something... I feel maybe you are touching upon dependent origination there with regards to your definition on personality etc.
I used to tell myself I had social anxiety. when i discovered the term i was like, "oh that must be what´s wrong with me!" Now it´s funny to me that I thought that way. And I thought I had an extreme case of it too. I can even send you stuff I wrote about it. Anyway, then I started smoking marijuana and became very sociable, and now I´ve progressed to not even wanting to interact with others. Now my problem is that I want to avoid others, which I prefer over feeling like I want to interact with others but can´t, but I obviously still need to continue my progress and make things better. I´m planning on living as a hermit as a while, then maybe returning to society, but that decision will depend on the future.
lol I know what you mean about feeling like maybe you don´t mean it enough. I had that problem too, still do sometimes but less, but basically I decided it was ridiculous to try really hard to mean something. The solution must be something else, not "I gotta try harder!"
Okay so now I think I explained myself correctly, except for the relevance. What I am saying is that whenver you want something from "someone else," that "someone else" is only a worldy object. The only thing you can gain from a worldy object is temporary emotional value. The mind can form all sorts of thoughts, like "we have a deep connection" or "we love each other" or "we have something special", whatever, but that´s just thoughts; attractive concepts formed in the mind. Some really cool stuff can happen, like extremely pleasing emotions, caused either by the thoughts or some sensory quality in any of the senses. But wanting these temporary things to satisfy you in an awesome way (not temporarily, without any problems as a result) is just the mind catching you in it´s trap. Temptation will lead to behaviour similar to a drug addict, and that causes problems for the addict. To be problem free, the sword of wisdom must be used to cut the problem off at its ROOT. The root is not reacting to temptation in the first place. Since you´re dealing with the effects of past indulgence, I think the solution for you is to patiently endure the dukkha, while refraining from indulging anymore. I still catch myself fantasizing about a certain girl, but with time and the right path, I have noticed an improvement. Have faith! Good luck.
I see, very clear to me now indeed, thank you so much. It does make a lot of sense and I appreciate the time you have out into explaining yourself
I think I do have 'social anxiety' as I find it hard sometimes to go to the shop without feeling horrible lol. If there was nobody around it would be fine. The thing is, From the age of about 12 I had this hugely irrational fear that I was dying from either cancer, some sort of virus or god knows what, I even had symptoms often but rarely went to the doc as I was scared of finding out. This thing ruled my life and I had this up until the age of about 19, then when it went this social anxiety crept in. I realise that meditation and the dharma CAN help, but I have found it hard to make little progress. Although yesterday I had a reall nice meditation session, maybe one of the most productive ones. I know we should not strive to gain anything or attach to meditation, and I don't, but I had this weird sensation that my head was on top of a huge pole and wobbling slowly side to side lol.. But yea, it was good, I let go of many things and gained a very still mind indeed. When I moved onto meta meditation however, it was not so productive.
I smoked weed for 7 years and all of the other substances I experimented with, I am glad to be out of that haze now once and for all.
I am really not one to advise here but I think you should view people and beings in a slightly different manner. the buddha said it was important to have people and friends around you but to not be attached... If you live life alone constantly thinking of people in the way you do, how can you practice loving kindness and compassion properly? That is just my view though and am trying to give something back to you in a way of helping me :P
You know what's funny I thought I had cancer for a few years too and I was afraid to tell the doctor too! wtf
I think I'm done with drugs for good now. We'll see how that goes.
The shop? What kind of shop? I'm taking machining classes and I've found that the shop and its classroom is an especially stressful atmosphere. "If there was nobody around it would be fine." See, that's why I like to be alone so much! My plan right now is to get an education and then job (machining), then when i have a little money saved up go live as a hermit for a while to clear up my mind, then maybe re-integrate into society, but with more skill at dealing with stuff, including others.
It's a pleasure to help, I'm glad!
I am glad you have found out some stuff about yourself, the spiritual journey is also one of self realisation in my opinion. I am also happy to hear no more drugs because they do cause more problems and are just a mask for what problems already exist.
I live pretty much by myself as the only person from my old life in the UK who came to thailand lives over an hour away, so I rarely have deep conversations with people. But, I still practice loving kindness and compassion when I can. I understand where you are coming from though about being alone, yes it has advnatages but being totally alone always is not the best way to live. It is often a great way to achieve wisdom but you will never open yur heart up enough to be fully at peace. The most compassionate and warm people are the happiest, it is a major practice in buddhism and hope you can move towards it soon enough. Deal with what issues you have and I am sure you will come to it soon enough