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Karma Vulnerability

Believing in Karma can make you vulnerable to being preyed upon by malicious manipulative abusers.

Example. Now, this is one that Hare Krsna's have used on me a number of times.

A Hare Krsna asks you if he can borrow some money.
You lend him some money.
The Hare Krnsa never repays the money.

The reasoning behind his actions are as follows:

I am a Brahman Devotee of Krsna, I am spiritually superior to everyone as I am one of the few people spiritually evolved enough to see the real truth and be a devotee to Sri Krsna.

It is my Karma as a devotee to Sri Krsna to be given money as Krsna rewards me for being a good devotee.

It is the lenders Karma to give the money to a holy man such as myself and he is fortunate to help one who is his spiritual superior and will be rewarded in another life by learning more about Sri Krsna so that he too can eventually become as spiritually evolved as me in his worship of Sri Krsna.
Therefore, I am doing him a favor and he does not require repayment.

This is typical of the karmic theory that many Hare Krsna's use (in my experience).
And they are not the worst exploiters of Karma belief abuse.
Many people are more malicous.

In my opinion, one must be open, full of compassion but must also protect oneself from charlatans and con men of all types.

Comments

  • edited October 2010
    Simple answer, don't lend money................
  • edited October 2010
    Engyo wrote: »
    Simple answer, don't lend money................
    Sure, this is just an example of the thought process behind the scam.
    People use similar manipulations in order to exploit and disown any blame for their actions.

    For example, a friend comes around to your house, and while you are in the toilet he steals your wallet.

    When you tell him you have lost your wallet, he does not own up and tells you that it must be your Karma to lose the wallet, you must have been a bad person in your last life...

    All you have done is be kind to someone and have not asked to be robbed in any way.

    I guess this is another reason why monks are celibate and own nothing as they have nothing left to take.
    This gives them the best position to study and attempt to attain enlightenment without problems caused by negative effects happening to their bellongings / relationships.
  • ShiftPlusOneShiftPlusOne Veteran
    edited October 2010
    I normally have no problem lending people money. If they don't pay back, I just don't lend it to that person again.

    As for what you're actually saying... I don't think it's a vulnerability of Karma, just self-righteousness of the individual. You see it everywhere, people use the "for the greater good" or "the ends justify the means" approach for getting what they want.
  • ChrysalidChrysalid Veteran
    edited October 2010
    I think you'd have to be pretty naive to fall for a scam like that. Either that, or have poor taste in friends.

    In a way I suppose it is karma. You have lent money to a person you barely know - stupidity. You have let a thief into your house - poor observation of character. In each scenario you have performed an unskilful action, and you reap the consequences.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    edited October 2010
    Believing in Karma can make you vulnerable to being preyed upon by malicious manipulative abusers.

    Example. Now, this is one that Hare Krsna's have used on me a number of times.
    Then not only are you gullible, you do not learn from your previous errors.
    A Hare Krsna asks you if he can borrow some money.
    You lend him some money.
    The Hare Krnsa never repays the money.
    Do you object to the fact that he borrows money - or that he is a Hara Krishna?
    The reasoning behind his actions are as follows:

    I am a Brahman Devotee of Krsna, I am spiritually superior to everyone as I am one of the few people spiritually evolved enough to see the real truth and be a devotee to Sri Krsna.

    It is my Karma as a devotee to Sri Krsna to be given money as Krsna rewards me for being a good devotee.

    It is the lenders Karma to give the money to a holy man such as myself and he is fortunate to help one who is his spiritual superior and will be rewarded in another life by learning more about Sri Krsna so that he too can eventually become as spiritually evolved as me in his worship of Sri Krsna.
    Therefore, I am doing him a favor and he does not require repayment.
    How long have you been able to read minds?
    is he not perhaps thinking "This man is kindly, reliable and charitable. I know that whatever I need, he will do his level best to help, because that is his nature. to be open and giving"
    This is typical of the karmic theory that many Hare Krsna's use (in my experience).
    I don't buy it, myself. You are even now perpetuating and creating more kamma for yourself by adhering to this thought process...
    And they are not the worst exploiters of Karma belief abuse.
    They have absolutely nothing to do with it.
    This is all your doing.

    Many people are more malicous.
    Undoubtedly. But how you respond is entirely up to you.
    In my opinion, one must be open, full of compassion but must also protect oneself from charlatans and con men of all types.
    This is the difference between Wise Compassion and Idiot Compassiion.

    I have spoken about this many times. It seems you have fallen victim to your own foolishness......:)
  • pineblossompineblossom Veteran
    edited October 2010
    In my opinion, one must be open, full of compassion but must also protect oneself from charlatans and con men of all types.

    Hmmmm .... thinking oneself superior is not beneficial to one's practice.

    Here is a chance for you to practice renunciation and compassion along with anger control.
  • ChrysalidChrysalid Veteran
    edited October 2010
    Hmmmm .... thinking oneself superior is not beneficial to one's practice.
    I don't think he mentioned anything about being superior, just that he should be wise enough to avoid being taken advantage of.
  • edited October 2010
    federica wrote: »
    This is the difference between Wise Compassion and Idiot Compassiion.

    I have spoken about this many times. It seems you have fallen victim to your own foolishness......:)

    Word, Fed. You're a real kick sometimes.:winkc:
  • edited October 2010
    Hmmmm .... thinking oneself superior is not beneficial to one's practice.

    Here is a chance for you to practice renunciation and compassion along with anger control.
    i have not said i am superior.
    I do not understand how you come to that conclusion. However, con men, charlatens etc. all do exist. and can fool even the wisest man.
    The Japanese invented a number of espionage arts hundreds of years a go, and Holy Men are one of the most popular guises for a sleeper agent. Hare Krsna and Buddhist priests are probably the easiest to portray as you do not always have a structured hierarchy to answer to.

    I hope that the Hare Krsna's all come to live at your house. Smoke their (or your) weed and tell you what you want to hear (your so saintly, i think you must be enlightened o spiritual master, i completely agree with everything you say) while they deliver you their own brand of spiritual half truths.
    Then you will learn their nature.
  • edited October 2010
    federica wrote: »
    Then not only are you gullible, you do not learn from your previous errors.


    Do you object to the fact that he borrows money - or that he is a Hara Krishna? Both. Not because I am a bigot, but because they are.
    I have spent over 20 years around Hare Krsna's and have learn't that the ones I have been around are in my opinion, are a gang of drug riddled liars.


    The Hare Krsna doctrine is condescending by nature.
    If you have read any Hare Krsna books or seen any Swami Prabhupada, you will know that the Hare Krsna's see themselves as the highest of all incarnation, the Brahmin, and there are some really twisted

    How long have you been able to read minds?
    is he not perhaps thinking.

    How long have you been able to read minds Freeda? These relentless attacks do not give me a good impression of your practice.

    I don't buy it, myself. You are even now perpetuating and creating more kamma for yourself by adhering to this thought process...

    How do you know this Freeda. Are you the all omnipotent, fully enlightened one. How do you know what my karma says.
    Now you read the mind of the Universe!

    They have absolutely nothing to do with it.
    This is all your doing?
    How would you know?

    Undoubtedly. But how you respond is entirely up to you.
    Acting kindly to people in need and trusting peoples words are not bad traits in my opinion. It is the criminals and thieves who ruin this world and not the kind honest people.

    This is the difference between Wise Compassion and Idiot Compassiion.
    Which scripture did you get that one from? This is tiring. Now, I wonder why this is the new buddhist forum? why did you leave the old one?

    I have spoken about this many times. It seems you have fallen victim to your own foolishness......:)
    Perhaps only by regarding this forum as a Buddhist forum. No wonder there are so many wars.
    I imagine you are not a monk.
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