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I use to be a person of god

I grew up in church I use to be able to quote scripture but I never felt right there when I got out on my own I started doing my own study of world religion. When I found Budhism I fell in love with it. It was like all my thoughts and ideas had been written down by someone 2500 years ago. I fell into it with more passion than I had ever had for anything else. I am putting my whole heart into it and want to learn everything I can. But when I hear of munks and lamas taking advantage of girls I'm very upset by this. This people I want to learn from seem no better than the hipicrits I went to church with. I know we are all human but I would just expect more from them.

Comments

  • zenffzenff Veteran
    edited January 2011
    "I know we are all human but I would just expect more from them"

    Don't expect more from them.

    In some Buddhist groups people treat their teacher as if he was some higher life form. He is not. Sooner or later they experience great disappointment.
  • I grew up in church I use to be able to quote scripture but I never felt right there when I got out on my own I started doing my own study of world religion. When I found Budhism I fell in love with it. It was like all my thoughts and ideas had been written down by someone 2500 years ago. I fell into it with more passion than I had ever had for anything else. I am putting my whole heart into it and want to learn everything I can. But when I hear of munks and lamas taking advantage of girls I'm very upset by this. This people I want to learn from seem no better than the hipicrits I went to church with. I know we are all human but I would just expect more from them.
    Dear friend

    If we go by the standards of others, I feel, we will almost always fail. Buddhism is a practice of the heart, of life, of vision, of breath. It is not for the weak minded although we all have that within us. As someone or other said, it is not what others do or do not do that is my concern, it is what I do or do not do that is my concern.

    The teachings of Lord Buddha are not false, nor are they full of trickery. But it does not mean that we can all put it to use the same way. The question for you in my own mind is: what does it mean to you and what/how will you make use of it in your life ie this life - for all of us. Take heart in the truth - and potential - of those teachings.

    With thanks for your efforts and your concerns.
    Abu
  • @Beautiful_Chaotic, Religion is religion. Truth is truth. "Incidents" happen because people are flawed, in Buddhism as well as Catholicism (which is where most people hear of "misconduct" by holy persons). Do not be disparaged by what you hear so-and-so did with a student; these are by far the minority of conditions. The majority of conditions are wholesome, with teachers who do not take advantage of their students because they are not themselves bogged down by mental defilements that would lead to such acts. No truly enlightened master would do such a thing, and so we must concede such teachers who have to be unenlightened and accept their flaws as no different from our flaws.
  • We would like to imagine that "no truly enlightened master [SP: how sexists!] would do such a thing" but I am less and less sure. "Born of woman, we are born to trouble" says the scripture, more or less, and much of that trouble is our own fault: the first two Holy Truths.

    So long as we are focused on what others are "doing wrong" (according to our own limited lights) we have no energy left for our own actions, thoughts and intentions. Those, and those alone, are the subject of our judgment and critical appraisal. The rest of the world is there for us to care for and tend, not as a way to avoid noticing ourselves. Motes and beams! Motes and beams!
  • The teacher is a human being.
    He or she is not a specimen of some higher life form. In the Zen tradition sometimes the teacher has a similar status though; he is supposed to be a living Buddha in a lineage of living Buddha’s which goes back to Sakkyamuni. That can bring people to servile behavior and to cherishing unrealistic expectations about the person of the teacher. It gets unhealthy if pleasing the Zen teacher (in a servile, sucking up manner) is rewarded. You don’t want to be in a Zen group in which the way to move up in the hierarchy, is to suck up harder than the rest.
    Also remember not to isolate yourself and your Buddhist group.
    If a group is directed inward; if it has no firm connections to other groups or to its environment; it may lose direction.


  • CinorjerCinorjer Veteran
    edited January 2011
    I grew up in church I use to be able to quote scripture but I never felt right there when I got out on my own I started doing my own study of world religion. When I found Budhism I fell in love with it. It was like all my thoughts and ideas had been written down by someone 2500 years ago. I fell into it with more passion than I had ever had for anything else. I am putting my whole heart into it and want to learn everything I can. But when I hear of munks and lamas taking advantage of girls I'm very upset by this. This people I want to learn from seem no better than the hipicrits I went to church with. I know we are all human but I would just expect more from them.
    You should expect more. The good news is, the great majority of Teachers-no matter what title they hold-are as earnest to live the Dharma as they are to teach it. But, Buddhists are just people, and prone to the same faults. Hero worship. Blind faith. The group dynamics of jockying for position and circling the wagons against criticism. Blaming the victim rather than hold authority accountable. And authority succumbing to the justification of selfish actions as their ego gets stroked by all that adoration.

    It's all out there if you look for it hard enough. In fact, it kinda stands out when you know the signs. Tribal dynamics are intuitive, behavior people tend to fall into no matter what the tribe may be. Politics, religion, social class, family, whatever. But, the real deal is also out there. Teachers who have penetrated the Dharma and dedicate their lives to helping others do the same. Temples and monks and lay Buddhists who take the teachings seriously and strive to live up to the standards set by the Buddha.

    If you walk into an AA meeting, you'll see people struggling to escape the addictions in their life and sometimes failing. If you walk into a Buddhist meditation hall, you'll see people struggling to escape the selfish desires in their life and sometimes failing. The important thing is to keep up the effort and remember your neighbor on the cushion is struggling just as hard as you are.



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