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Hippie talks about the universe
shanyin
Novice YoginSault Ontario Veteran
Thoughts? Does this guy have it figured out?
Did the Buddha say the sky isn't blue? I've heard a zen monk say the sky never said it was blue. Did he say phenomena and observer are one?
What do you think the deep meaning is?
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The blueness is dependent upon all those conditions.
An oft quoted metaphor in the sutras is that of a person with jaundice or glaucoma: everything they see is either yellow or blurred.
I guess my point is that we don't have to keep up with the speed of light in order to perceive light.
Understand that language is faulty. It does some things very well and yet, regardless of one's persuasive locution, it does most other things with great vagueness and imprecision.
Everything we experience is the product of human invention. That's it. We're trapped. With death as the exception, there's no going outside human experience for us.
What's "behind" what we experience is HUUUUGE. One may be able grab a teeny bit of direct experience of this HUGE-OSITY but one will never be able to _communicate_ anything about it.
Borrowed references from modern day physics are very misleading when used to make a point like the "Hippie" above. The physics lay people hear about and can understand are simplifications and rough analogies that come from the implications of arcane mathematics.
Need proof?
When they talk of what will happen to you when you reach the event horizon of a black hole? It's ridiculous because no human being will ever ever be able to experience such a thing! It makes sense -mathematically- but when you put it in lay people's terms you have meaningless images like those which promise that great supernatural mystery is about to unfold. In fact such non-mathematical interpretations have about as much relevance as good fiction like _Alice in Wonderland_.
I'm still working on it. That's what I have so far. FWIW. :bowdown:
I think the point was that a lot of science takes form of equations, but for us to understand it, we need visuals and 'car analogies'.
Maybe I misunderstood. However, we can see the effects of a black hole! Look at our universe, and how it rotates around the central point. You can also see how other stars interact with a black hole.
OTOH, People ("hippies" especially hahaha! just kidding trying to be funny referring to guy in video above) like to get all amazed by them (and MANY other facts of modern physics). For instance they like to marvel "spaghettification," what will happen to you if you interact with a black hole, you will go into another dimension, time will stand still(?) etc etc.
That is all well and good except for the fact that no human being will EVER experience a black hole like that. They will be killed. Same thing with going the speed of light and not aging. How will the human body deal with it's near-infinite mass which it will gain when approaching c? It won't. These are impossible things so nothing supernatural will come from them. It's like becoming and angel and wondering if coca cola will still have that fizzy feeling as you drink it down.
IOW, modern physics implications stated in lay terms really is all sizzle and no steak. Therefore I was suggesting don't get mystified by implications expressed in these terms.
When I said everything is a human creation, I mean it. The universe is still an extremely marvelous place, but whatever __we__ experience will have zero supernatural content.
The closest to supernatural we can experience is a sensation of profound infinite "hugeness" and wonder and awe when deep in meditation. Of course trying to communicate that experience will be impossible. HUMAN attempts to interpret the "meaning" of that experience or speculating on it's significance WILL be possible. But except for the direct experience of the ineffable everything else is the something and the everything WE created as human beings. We as this teeny tiny little pinprick of mind which is stuck in this brain and body with sense organs for approx. 80 years.
Just my limited POV. I'm not totally sure of this. I just am wondering. I'm not saying other POVs are wrong.
My partner and mathematician friends used to like to collect books which tried to learn spiritual lessons from physics. They used to laugh at them and sometimes posted choice sections on the Cambridge University maths department notice board.
Many of my partner's friends have spiritual beliefs. They just don't base those beliefs on physics.
The correct Zen saying is, "First sky is blue and grass is green. Then sky is not blue and grass is not green. Finally, sky is blue and grass is green."
Sometimes mountains are mountains and trees are trees is substituted.
What does this mean? It is a riff on "emptiness is form, and form is emptiness" from the Heart Sutra. A very deep teaching. Sky does not have an inherent "blueness". Sky is not always blue, and in fact is not independent of the sun and atmosphere and position of the planets and even your eyesight. So sky is not blue. The concept of blue sky is empty of form. "Form is emptiness" seems to be the stage that the man is stuck at.
And stuck he is, as he goes on to riff about physics and duality and such. Because while there is no inherent, independent, permanent form, there is perceived, transient form. This morning, when I walked outside, sky was white, ground was white. It was snowing. So tomorrow, maybe clear sky and blue sky. Emptiness is also form. That is the second half of the statement.
So is the sky blue, or not? I would say to him, "Is the sky blue? Answer the question, "Yes" I will pick up a stick and hit you. If you say, "No" I will pick up a stick and hit you. Now, what do you say?
That is Zen.
Absolutely. :thumbsup:
It's a reminder perhaps for some people drawn to rely on Science (upper case 's') as a venue into "ultimate" Q&A activity.