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What it means to be a Buddhist in modern America
bushinoki
Veteran
I joined this site because I associate myself with Buddhism in the small degree in which I'm able. I came hoping to learn more about Buddhism and what kind of people Buddhists are. In the short time I've been here, I've noticed that most of the people here are, in an American political sense, "liberals". I use quoatation marks because the beliefs of alot of "liberals" aren't that liberal in reality. I will say this, I believe in social equality and our civil rights, but I must ask this, does being an American Buddhist automatically mean being the antithesis of the "Religious Right" in America? Does being a Buddhist mean I can no longer believe in certain rights, such as the 2nd Amendment (rhetorical question, please dont' take it literally)?
This is a thread about OPINIONS, so please place yours respectfully here.
This is a thread about OPINIONS, so please place yours respectfully here.
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This discussion has been closed.
Comments
We have the Right of Free Speech - but is Free Speech always what is good and beneficial to all? I don't really see anything in the teaching of Buddha that would infringe upon the laws of most countries - except those like China that forbid many things Buddhist - illegal.
Is owning a gun bad? I don't believe so. It's not the gun that is bad, it's the Intention of the person behind the gun. A fist can be used to knead dough - or it can be used to kill a person as well.
I don't believe that being a Buddhist also means you are part of the "religious Right" in America. Even portions of Buddha's teachings can be taken to the extreme and become something that it was never intended to do.
It isn't Buddhism to just disagree with something else because of the other person that is saying it. A liar can say "the sky is blue" and just because they are a liar doesn't mean that this is not a true statement.
The teachings of the Eightfold Path should be what we use in interacting and dealing with others. By nurturing the Eightfold Path within us - it will become a stronger tool that we can use in dealing with people, statements, actions, responses, etc.
Just my $0.02 worth - hope it made sense.
-bf
I am sure that you will find right-wing Buddhists in the States. Mind you, most US political positions appear to us Europeans as either right-wing or extremely right-wing! Nevertheless, there is not, to my knowledge, a right-wing Buddhist movement similar to Engaged Budhism.
To me, being "Buddhist" doesn't really mean anything in that sense. Buddhism is not as concerned about "worldy" affairs as it is about the "internal" affairs of the mind. It isn't about being a "conservative", or a "liberal", or a "goat", or a "cheese monster". It is all about making skillful choices.
If a person follows the Buddha's Path because they see it as being a skillful means to peace and harmony with their fellow man, then they should think, speak, act, and vote accordingly. It doesn't mean that they have to do anything a certain way, or not do anything a certain way. It is about learning to use their own discernment.
As a "Buddhist", if you see that your actions will hurt people directly, or influnence people to be hurt indirectly, then you should not do those actions; if you see that your actions will not hurt people directly, or influence people to be hurt indirectly, then you should do those actions. The reason for this is that the Buddha's Path is about understanding suffering, the causes of suffering, and the cessation of suffering. It really all comes down to having Right Intentions.
The problem is that nobody will tell you what to do or think, it is all up to you. The Noble Eightfold Path just gives you the tools to make less harmful decisions, it doesn't tell you what those decisions should be. If you do something that is harmful, you simply learn, "This is harmful. I should do my best not to do it anymore." If you do something that isn't harmful, you simply learn, "This isn't harmful. I should do this more.". For example, I myself am not a Republican or Democrat. I have no "party" bias. I simply vote for what I think will cause the least amount of suffering for the majority of people, and what will cause the most amount for happiness to the majority of people. Sometimes I'm right, and sometimes I'm wrong - but I always have good intentions regardless.
It sounds so easy, so painfully simple, yet the defilements of greed, hatred, and delusion make it quite difficult. They make you attached to things, adverse to things, and deluded about things. They color a person's perceptions with their biases. Sometimes those biases are correct and help one to make good choices, however, many times they are not correct and merely deceive one into thinking they have made good choices when in reality they haven't.
Buddhism simply helps to remove these biases so that one can clearly see what is in the benefit and happiness for the many, not just for the 'self'. That is my opinion, and my personal reason for becoming one.
Jason
This is the problem with mixing religion and politics. People come to have a view of how they believe, and for someone else to be of the same belief system, they must believe the same way. But many of us live in a Democratic-Republican society, and are involved in the political process. So we have to vote based upon our view of the world.
In a political sense, I can tell that I see the world through a different lense, zenmonk. I look at the world around me, and I vote for politicians who I believe are strong enough to stand up to the majority of the other national heads, because most of the nations in this world are dictatorships. I don't like what many liberal politicians believe because they have a global view of government, and I feel that my rights as an individual would be compromised if these politicians passed the laws they want. In fact, historically, they have. From the fifties to the eighties, the US had a very liberal Supreme Court that overruled (and overstepped their authority on) many issues of individual and state rights. The reason that states rights are so important is because it allows most of the people to "vote with their feet", meaning they can live where the laws are how they like them. Which means I am for leaving California ASAP.
I don't like mixing religion and politics. That is what gave us 9/11. But I felt that this question needed to be asked, especially since those of us here follow the teachings of a man whose culture was far different from ours. It requires that we define what we believe as Americans, and recognize that we are not Asians and that Buddhism cannot work for alot of us the same way as it does for a completely different society.
-bf
May I ask, "Why define anything?"
Why must I be, for example, only an "American"? Why cannot I see all others as my equal? Why not just simply be a human being? Does it really matter so much where I was born, where I currently live, or where I will live in the future?
No matter what I look like, where I live, or what I am labeled as I can still make choices that benefit others, as well as myself. I do not need to define myself as an "American" for that. I simply need to have the wisdom, courage, and compassion to do what I believe is the right thing for the benefit of the many other living beings on this planet. All Buddhism does is to help give us the skillful means and criteria for making such a momentous decision, because in all reality each and every decision, no matter how small, truly is momentous.
By defintion, it is just these volitional actions of body, speech, and mind that are our "kamma" spoken of by the Buddha. The more skillful our kamma, the more wonderful their results.
Just something to think about.
Jason
Buddhism is a practice based on, and uncovering awareness and compassion. For those reasons, a Buddhist cannot vote for Bush, at least not when they have been practicing for a while. It would violate not only the ethical precepts of Buddhism but the very awareness and compassion that Buddhism embodies. Bush is a symptom, as much as a cause of greed, anger and ignorance - the three poisons as they are known, that Buddhist practice directly engages with. It is therefore no more possible to reach any degree of realization in Buddhist practice and still vote for Bush, as it is to be a soldier or an arms dealer. That said, we all start where we are right now and insight and compassion do not spring magically and fully blown into being overnight, even though they are innate.
Zenmonk, My main issue here is the politics involved. To say that a Buddhist can't vote for Bush, or support him is saying that we must ignore the larger picture. My personal opinion is that I don't like Bush the person. I do like Bush the politician. He hasn't made all the right choices, but he's made a plan of action and stuck by it, right or wrong. I agree with the idea that someone who puts profit ahead of compassion can't be a Buddhist (ie, the arms dealer), but who are you to limit buddhism to a few types of people. Are you forgetting that Zen Buddhism was the Samurai Buddhism? Why can't I be a soldier and a Buddhist? Why can't I have a conservative mindset regarding national and global politics? I am a social liberal. But I am a political and economical conservative. I do believe in acts of compassion being part of human decency, but I don't believe that it is our government's responsibility to spend excessive tax dollars on such, nor to create huge beauracracies to administer the funds. I believe it is the responsibilityof the people, and the religious/non-profit organizations they create to do these things. I am going to be a soldier. how does that preclude me from being a Buddhist? Are you saying that because I might get sent to war I can't be compassionate? Or is it solely because I would have to be ready to kill people? Does it even matter that these people I would have to kill would try to get into our nation and kill us?
I'm not saying that we need to be a hard people, and ignore the plight of third world nations, but there are hard choices to make. I've made several such choices already, and I'll have more to make in my life. You may use the title 'Reverend', which you've probably earned through education, but all that means to me is that I wouldn't consider taking part in any congregation you directed, even if you would let me in the front door. I will still call myself a Buddhist, and as the resources come available I will continue to study the writings regarding what I choose to believe.
I would have to respectfully disagree with Genryu about some things.
I believe that if a "Buddhist" honestly feels that Bush is the right choice for President, or that he is at least the best out of the two or three candidates, then one may certainly well vote for him. It may be more out of delusion that one does so, but it doesn't necessarily mean that they're "unBuddhist". I mean, Kerry was a soldier in war, he either directly killed people, or indirectly helped to kill people by being in the war. Whether he was drafted or not is also something to consider. So, if one were to vote for him, would it be "unBuddhist"?
The problem I have with Genryu's comment is that they are both poor choices. (Note: I am excluding any other Independent candidates since I do not really know anything about them.) Neither Bush nor Kerry fits the ideal "Buddhist" candidate. So if we don't vote at all, then what? It is still a problem is it not? The problem we are faced with then is which is the most skillful person to pick out of only two or three poorly limited choices. It can be even harder to decide when you don't know each person's character at all. Who is being truthful? Who is lying? Who can be trusted?
Such questions and dilemmas are important in everyday worldly affairs, but ultimately they can become burdens to any serious meditator. It can burden one when ones become obsessed over it, dwells over it, stresses over it, and simply is unaware of how to put these thoughts down. This is just another seed for dukkha to spring forth.
What really matters is that you take the time to be as educated as possible, and then decide what actions would most probably benefit all sentient beings (no pressure or anything
That is why the Buddha taught so much in the forty-five years after his Awakening. He tried to give us as many different tools, skills, and criteria for good decision making. If we take the time to study his words, and put them into practice, eventually we will begin to make better and better choices. That is all a person that calls themself a "Buddhist" can be asked to do.
That is my view anyway.
Jason
Mods, I respectfully request my thread be locked. I didn't even expect it to go downhill this fast.
*PERSONAL COMMENTS ARE NOT ENCOURAGED ON THIS FORUM. I HAVE THEREFORE REMOVED A PORTION OF YOUR POST, DUE TO ITS UNSUITABILITY. *
This thread is now locked, by request.
Fede.