Suffering vs. Destructive Emotions...?

MindGate

So, I wrote a little 2 page paper of the core concepts of Buddhism. My friend read it and thought it was interesting, but he did not agree with "attachment is the cause of all suffering."

Now, explain this to me:

Is it destructive emotions, like anger, lust, greed, etc, that causes suffering (which most people agree with) or is it attachment that causes it?

Or is attachment the root of all suffering and other destructive emotions?

How is attachment the root cause of anger (like if someone calls you a name)? Saying its the root cause because "you are attached to not being called a name" seems like you're stretching it.

Thanks.

Mountains

Attachment (my understanding) is what *causes* the anger, lust, greed, etc. In the end it really doesn't matter does it? The result is the same - suffering.

If someone calls you a name, it's your attachment to "me" that causes suffering. It's the "me" (ego) that is feeling attacked by the name-calling, and attachment to the ego gives it power, and that's the root of the suffering.

Or... maybe I'm all wet. I dunno.

SherabDorje

How is attachment the root cause of anger (like if someone calls you a name)? Saying its the root cause because "you are attached to not being called a name" seems like you're stretching it.

Actually that's precisely it. Otherwise, does anger just arise spontaneously? It really is attachment to not being called a name. Here's the process:

Someone calls me a name.

I react by "saying to myself" that I don't want to be called that name, meaning I'm attached to not being called that name.

I become angry.

If not for this process, anger would just arise by itself. The intermediate factor between my being called that name and becoming angry is my not wanting to, my attachment to, not being called that name.

Lust and greed perhaps are more subtle and more primary because they can arise by themselves. But attachment is an intermediate factor there too. I lust after a particular woman, which involves a self-statement "I want sex". If I am attached to sex to an unhealthy degree, I suffer from lust. In the same way, if I am attached to money to an unhealthy degree, I suffer from greed.

Anger, lust, and greed arise from attachment and are secondary to attachment.

SherabDorje

edit:oops.

SherabDorje

Destructive Emotions: A Scientific Dialogue with the Dalai Lama by Daniel Goleman (Mar 30, 2004)

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_20?url=search-alias=stripbooks&field-keywords=destructive+emotions&sprefix=destructive+emotions

DhammaDhatu

the buddha advised attachment is suffering. attachment is when the mind clings to a sense object & then starts cooking it up & obsessing over it in the mind

underlying attachment there will always be craving or defilement ('emotions'), in the form of greed, hatred &/or delusion

the craving or defilement provide the power, the urge or the energy to force the mind into attachment & mental proliferation

sexual craving is the best way to understand the power or energy of craving, given it is so strong. sexual craving no only has the power or energy to change the state of mind but it can even physically change the state of the physical body

craving may arise because the mind contains the tendency towards 'self' belief as part of its ignorance. for example, when you hear someone insult your name

or craving may arise unrelated to self-belief (such as the mind tastes delicious food). but craving here still occurs due to ignorance

the Buddha explained this process in the Dependent Origination, namely, ignorance > craving > attachment > becoming > birth of fixed personality > suffering

it is said suffering is attachment because all craving or defilement does not necessarily lead to craving

when the mind has developed mindfulness, clear-comprehension & concentration, defilement & craving (only the urge or energy, not thought) can still arise but mindfulness, clear-comprehension & concentration are sufficient to stop attachment

to end, to answer your question, not all 'emotion' results in suffering but all 'attachment' results in suffering

kind regards

Dependent on eye & forms, eye-consciousness arises. The meeting of the three is contact. With contact as a requisite condition, there is feeling. What one feels, one perceives (labels in the mind). What one perceives, one thinks about. What one thinks about, one objectifies. Based on what a person objectifies, the perceptions & categories of objectification assail him/her with regard to past, present, & future forms cognizable via the eye.

Madhupindika Sutta

There is the case where a person assumes form... feeling... perception... fabricating... consciousness to be the self. That assumption is a fabrication.

Now what is the cause, what is the origination, what is the birth, what is the coming-into-existence of that fabrication?

To an uninstructed, run-of-the-mill person, touched by that which is felt born of contact with ignorance, craving arises. That fabrication [of self] is born of that.

And that fabrication is inconstant, fabricated, dependently co-arisen. That craving... That feeling... That contact... That ignorance is inconstant, fabricated, dependently co-arisen.

Parileyyaka Sutta

The six classes of craving should be known.' Thus was it said. In reference to what was it said?

Dependent on the eye & forms there arises consciousness at the eye. The meeting of the three is contact. With contact as a requisite condition there is feeling. With feeling as a requisite condition there is craving.

Dependent on the ear & sounds there arises consciousness at the ear. The meeting of the three is contact. With contact as a requisite condition there is feeling. With feeling as a requisite condition there is craving.

Dependent on the nose & aromas there arises consciousness at the nose. The meeting of the three is contact. With contact as a requisite condition there is feeling. With feeling as a requisite condition there is craving.

Dependent on the tongue & flavors there arises consciousness at the tongue. The meeting of the three is contact. With contact as a requisite condition there is feeling. With feeling as a requisite condition there is craving.

Dependent on the body & tactile sensations there arises consciousness at the body. The meeting of the three is contact. With contact as a requisite condition there is feeling. With feeling as a requisite condition there is craving.

Dependent on the intellect & ideas there arises consciousness at the intellect. The meeting of the three is contact. With contact as a requisite condition there is feeling. With feeling as a requisite condition there is craving.

The six classes of craving should be known.' Thus was it said. And in reference to this was it said. This is the sixth sextet.

Chachakka Sutta

formermonkJohn

"attachment will always result in suffering" with no exceptions!!???? aren't there good and bad attachments? attachment to practise, attachment to loving, for example

Jeffrey

Yes John but there is a different Pali word for those I believe. DD can explain. I am ignorant of the whole deal but from the teachings I have received the difference is in spaciousness.

If you have a nice car. You love it you wash it. You put leather moisturizer on the seats. You show it off.

That is ok. Your enjoyment is a sign that it is not attachment, because you are not suffering.

Then it gets scratched or keyed. The degree of suffering shows you your attachment. Is it no big deal ahhh impermanence. Or are you angry and take it out on your family and coworkers. Boiling with inner frustration and an idea that the world is out to get you (which shows ignorance is root and not attachment).

DhammaDhatu

devotion or intention towards dhamma is called chanda (1st iddhipada) or samma sankhappa (2nd path factor)

attachment = upadana = to carry a heavy burden

DhammaDhatu

When I was new to Buddhism, I learned the book The ABCs of Buddhism

http://www.what-buddha-taught.net/Books6/Buddhadasa_Bhikkhu_ABC_of_Buddhism.pdf

[DeletedUser]

According to the heart sutra, all phenomena are created by one peace-loving heart, and every attachment on these creations is peace-loving

SherabDorje

According to the heart sutra, all phenomena are created by one peace-loving heart, and every attachment on these creations is peace-loving

Would you expand on that? I have never seen the Heart Sutra quite that way.

Maybe as a new thread so as not to hijack this one?

MetaZenMan

"How is attachment the root cause of anger (like if someone calls you a name)? Saying its the root cause because "you are attached to not being called a name" seems like you're stretching it."

When someone calls you a name it is your attachment to the pride associated with social conduct which gives birth to the destructive emotions you mention. Within the self this manifests as an attachment to your own self-image which is born out of the mind's ability to imagine an additional perspecitive which it uses to generate an idea of how this (imaginary) other sees itself (you). Social conduct is the guiding force through which all materiel attachments (both human and non-human )are acquired, therefore our standing within the paramaters of social conduct matters to us all the way to down to our survival instinct which knows it to be the dictating force delegating our desires to us via punishment and reward systems (money). To further understand this, try to hold a job without paying any attention to the reactions (potential and actual) of those with whom you are dealing. You will find that you will be excommunicated (fired) pretty quickly, and left out in the cold by the people you are being forced to rely on in order to get your needs met. Also, try making (or keeping) friends paying no mind again to the paramaters of social (interpersonal) conduct. Again you will find that you are pissing people off exponentially as time goes on and loosing the people you once called your "friends". Therefore, though there are many layers at work creating experience, attachment remains the root cause of all negative emotions and reactions.

taiyaki

ignorance > anger >lust > greed > etc.

seeing clearly into what is > wisdom > compassion > peace> patience > equanimity

its all just energy. when we're fragmented and channeling energy in negative states, only negative states will perpetuate.

if we do the opposite positive states perpetuate. but the goal is to come into the middle neutral state, which allows for positive manifestation to occur.

math bro math