Welcome home! Please contact lincoln@icrontic.com if you have any difficulty logging in or using the site. New registrations must be manually approved which may take several days. Can't log in? Try clearing your browser's cookies.
Non-violent solutions to bullying?
ShiftPlusOne
Veteran
I am sure some of you would've seen the clip going around the internet right now.
I'd love to hear some alternatives to violence in situations like that. Keep it to a primary school level, 'cause high school and workplace bullying are completely different issues.
From personal experience, all the generic advice people give like "walk away" or "talk to the teachers" doesn't work. Violence and humiliation on the other hand work just fine.
If the kid didn't stand up for himself, he'd probably go home with a bloody nose. In the long term, there would be psychological damage as well. If he told a teacher, the teacher would 'have a word' with the bully or just give some useless advice. Basically, nothing would change. However, he stood up for himself and got suspended for it. How is that fair?
Generally, most people would agree that violence is appropriate in that situation, but I am wondering what Buddhists think.
I'd love to hear some alternatives to violence in situations like that. Keep it to a primary school level, 'cause high school and workplace bullying are completely different issues.
From personal experience, all the generic advice people give like "walk away" or "talk to the teachers" doesn't work. Violence and humiliation on the other hand work just fine.
If the kid didn't stand up for himself, he'd probably go home with a bloody nose. In the long term, there would be psychological damage as well. If he told a teacher, the teacher would 'have a word' with the bully or just give some useless advice. Basically, nothing would change. However, he stood up for himself and got suspended for it. How is that fair?
Generally, most people would agree that violence is appropriate in that situation, but I am wondering what Buddhists think.
0
Comments
This boy finally fought back after being repeatedly punched in the face and stomach by the bully (who, I might add was a good 10" shorter and a great deal lighter than this boy.) But patently, he'd been doing it for a while, and had even asked a friend to video him bullying this kid.
Well, the victim had obviously had enough and reached breaking point.
He picked the bully up, and slam-dunked him onto the floor.
The Bully's right foot caught a low wall, and frankly, it obviously really hurt him.
Another boy then confronted the larger boy, but someone intervened, and the bigger boy then just walked away.
In the UK, that is using reasonable force in self-defence.
I think he did the right thing. After years of torment, one blow did it.
I bet the bully will think twice from now on.....
There's aikido and there are other forms of martial arts that do no harm and get a bully's attention.
Now that I think about it a bit more, taking the bully and his parents to court sounds like a good idea to me.
(And I don't have the connection speed to watch the video.)
Dakini, it didn't when I was in primary school. I think the principal was a decent enough guy and really did try, but there's only so much they can do.
SherabDorje, I don't think a school would see a difference between non-harmful self-defence and violence. At the end of the day, it would be seen as a fight and the policy is to punish everyone involved. As for restraining orders and court, that's interesting. It could work if there are only a few bullies and if it's not dismissed with "boys will be boys" or something like that. Also, being the kid who had to get a restraining order wouldn't be too good for the self esteem, I'd imagine.
Thanks for the responses.
Anyway after that he and I were in the principal's office, and the principal was going to suspend him for punching me, which he didn't do. The principal didn't believe me because some teacher said they saw him punch me, and I basically yelled at the principal and got really pissed that she didn't believe he didn't punch me. I stuck up for him because he was innocent. After that we were on friendly terms (we were never personally on any other terms, different circles).
Not sure if that's worth anything to anyone, but it showed me that circumstances can change, we only have to make the right choices.
Metta,
Guy
Finally, I told my son what to do: Ask the bully to meet him after school, out in the woods where no teachers would be around to interfere. I told my son to tell the kid that my son would bring boxing gloves -- "so no one will get hurt." The meeting was set, according to my son ... and the bully never showed up.
Serious Buddhist practice doesn't favor survival, it favors release, it induces an attitude which is completely equanimous about dying at the hands of the attackers, and it leads to the insight that you're already dead. The result of this is clear in the simile of the saw (Obviously, I'm not there yet.
From the perspective of Buddhist practice, responding to this kind of threat is an expression of power, a capacity to remain present in the acceleration which results from such situations. When you know you're already dead, you respond to the threat a bit differently. When that's happened for me, I've usually laughed at the assailant, completely spontaneously, more out of the shock that they would do something so outrageous than anything else. It's very effective.
I attended a retreat about the expression of power in Buddhist practice a couple of years ago. The recordings from the Dharma talks are here.
It will basically harden them and make them less of a wimp. Often the bullies pick on people who seem like easy prey, and like they won't fight back. A good martial arts teacher will strengthen and toughen up your character so that these bullies learn that you're not easy prey. Something in them just realizes it, and they tend to leave you alone after you've achieved this type of confidence that has to do with ones ability to defend themselves.
Funny, there was a similar incident in Australia only a few weeks ago, but the bully got a knife in the neck. I don't see anyone applauding that.
Do I feel good about what I did? hell no. Did it feel good to fight back at the time? yes. It felt better than anything. After that, I was never pushed around again. And all I had to do was look at someone cross-ways if they were bothering someone, and that person was left alone.
Violence can be useful, you know... You just need to exercise self-control and where exactly to apply your force. Thinking back on what I did though, I should not have swung at their heads with the pipe, I probably would have been fine with body shots.
As a kid I did Judo-class and I don’t remember I was ever tempted to use Judo outside the mat.
Why not?
I suppose there is a non-verbal signal going out saying; I’m relaxed, I can defend myself.
The kids that need to let their aggression out on a safe victim, read the signal and move on.
In an enviromnet where the grown ups know how to get respect from the kids this kind of thing can be avoided.
I always have advocated physical self defence to kids in the same situation. But last year my mom talked one of the bullies of one of her pupils out of it and got him to protect the younger boy from others bullies as well!
I have also seen a situation in the local square late at night where a group of youths were ganging up on an old man. I stayed close in case they would get physical but before anything happened another of the youths approached the group and shouted.
"What the hell are you doing? The man is old! Show some respect!". And the others moved away a little shamefully. I was pretty stunned.
So obviously the social glue of the soceiety is important in avoiding conflict and bulliying. Unfortunateley bulliying is sometimes part of the social glue. That is the enigma.
You have to have the respect of the kids otherwise things like that will not work.
Another thing that works is threatening with talking to their parents. What ever kid it is they have healty respect for their parents.
/Victor
I'm a martial artist (Taekwon-do) under the teaching of Master Florin Fratean, and I'd feel it's necessary to add that martial arts isn't (or shouldn't) be about violent resolutions of violent situations.
Far too many marital arts schools ultimately teach to fight - which is wrong.
Taught properly, martial arts gives the individual the confidence that may very well not put them in a situation where they would be bullied in the first place.
However, it also puts them in a skilled position to defend themselves if or when necessary.
There are boundaries.
I realize kids being bullied in school is not the same as adults being bullied - let's say in the workplace - but the concept's the same; intimidation.
I know I myself would never resort to violence. I'd talk my way out first, walk away second, and possibly even run away third. However, should someone actual touch me or strike me I would have no hesitation in laying them out cold.
These are boundaries that need to be taught, and in my experiences as a father (one of my children has special needs), far too many schools talk the talk but don't walk the walk when it comes to bullying.
Use of terror, intimidation, and bullying is an underlying core problem in our society and the genesis of many of humanity's miseries. It needs to be correctly identifed, acknowledged, and addressed.
I had just such a situation in middle school. This one kid in my grade decided to target me to attempt to bully. At first it was simply verbal harassment, which I was fine with ignoring. Then he became physical, walking up randomly and shoving me and such. I attempted to inform school officials, but since it was my word against his they refused to do anything. After a few days of this I had had enough. After he shoved me that first time on the playground that day I turned around and began to shove back (knowing that this would not stop and would only get worse if I allowed it to continue). He backed up and I kept walking towards him. After a few minutes I had him backed up against a tree crying. Ironically one of the teachers saw this and I was the one accuse of bullying then. :rolleyes:
While it's not something that I'm necessarily proud of, I feel no shame in it ether. I was never bothered after that point ether. Fortunately I was able to nip the problem in the bud before things got too physical. As an added bonus that kid, to my knowledge, never attempted to bully anyone else ether, having been "shown up" in front of the whole school.