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zidangus, I'm not saying milk itself is bad for you, (though the hormones, antibiotics, toxins and pesticides in it are bad for you) - I'm just saying that to me, milk seems unnecessary at best
Just remembered we have girl scout cookies! Creamy and chocolate. Thats why they add milk to chocolate making milk chocolate. But I actually like dark chocolate.
Well that I do agree with jenzay, a lot of people especially in asia live healthy live's without the need for milk in their diet. So I guess it's down to the grip the diary industry has on western culture. They have managed to convince western governments and the masses that we actually need milk in our diet, and the grip is so strong I honestly cannot see this changing for many years.
@zidangus I agree it won't change any time soon, but at least healthier alternatives are becoming more popular, like almond milk. So healthy and so yummy.
@Jeffrey Ya, that's possible. And do you really mean girl scouts come to your door selling cookies? That kind of thing I only see in movies
@zidangus are you from america. we have commercials about drinking milk eating beef eating pork eating chicken. You should see the guys on my brewing forum how much meat they eat on their smokers and grills.
@jenzay yeah they do but we bought these at a local hamburger place. yup american 2 cheeseburgers onion rings and a shake. Milk is the least of my worries
I don't believe that drinking mild leeches calcium from bones. If that were true, even young adults would have osteoporosis or osteopenia.
That would be a valid point, except that it IS on the rise among young adults and has been for the last decade. I've often heard my father talking about it and he's chief of medicine. I've also read some articles about it in the medical journals he has.
Then it must have other causes, because previous generations (including myself) didn't have this problem.
I never understood the whole milk and cookies thing! haha maybe it is an American thing?
The mild-and-cookies thing happens (with kids mainly, but adults may continue the habit) because cookies are so sweet, the body naturally craves some protein to balance the sugar with.
I will mention here, that allergists say that type O blood and people with Germanic heritage (this includes Brits) have a subtle allergy to milk, that may not be strong enough for noticeable symptoms, but it's clear when blood tests are done. Still, many of those people do fine eating dairy products, as some of our vegetarian members and one moderator have told me emphatically when I last posted about this.
Well that I do agree with jenzay, a lot of people especially in asia live healthy live's without the need for milk in their diet.
That's because some Asians can't digest milk. Lots of Asians can, however, and milk is an important part of their diet. Tibetans, Mongols, the many Turkic tribes throughout north Asia, reindeerherding tribes, and tribes in India that depend on cows for dairy products are all examples. Different bodies have different metabolisms and need different foods to be healthy. Their metabolisms have evolved differently. There's no one-size-fits-all diet.
I don't believe that drinking mild leeches calcium from bones. If that were true, even young adults would have osteoporosis or osteopenia.
That would be a valid point, except that it IS on the rise among young adults and has been for the last decade. I've often heard my father talking about it and he's chief of medicine. I've also read some articles about it in the medical journals he has.
Then it must have other causes, because previous generations (including myself) didn't have this problem.
I think the main cause is the ever growing emphasis on the media telling you to drink milk in order to be healthy. Regardless of whether or not milk is actually detrimental to one's health, it's true that nobody needs milk to live a healthy lifestyle, yet so much money is spent on advertising milk. They're certainly not advertising on the basis that it's healthy for you, otherwise they would do the same for acai berries, noni juice, etc, and make it widely commercially available as they have done with milk. They advertise because they make billions when people think they need something.
Okay Jenzay. We get it. You're anti milk. You've certainly convinced me. From this point forward, anyone on the forum caught drinking milk will go to Buddhist Hell...or Christian Hell, if you're so disposed.
I would bet milk started as survival. A replenishable way to eat grass in effect. And cheese in the winter won't rot.
That's exactly how it started for the tribes who later became the Indo-Europeans, Iranians, and Tocharians of the Central Asian desert. There was a post about that on page 1 of this thread.
Okay Jenzay. We get it. You're anti milk. You've certainly convinced me. From this point forward, anyone on the forum caught drinking milk will go to Buddhist Hell...or Christian Hell, if you're so disposed.
Next rant topic?
:rarr:
Why so defensive? Geez, I just thought it was something random and possibly interesting that hasn't been discussed, and something that I've found myself interested in for whatever reason. I started researching it from an objective point of view. All I've stated are some facts and then my own opinion which is not above yours. I'm new here and was just trying to contribute. Sorry.
Okay Jenzay. We get it. You're anti milk. You've certainly convinced me. From this point forward, anyone on the forum caught drinking milk will go to Buddhist Hell...or Christian Hell, if you're so disposed.
Next rant topic?
:rarr:
Why so defensive? Geez, I just thought it was something random and possibly interesting that hasn't been discussed, and something that I've found myself interested in for whatever reason. I started researching it from an objective point of view. All I've stated are some facts and then my own opinion which is not above yours. I'm new here and was just trying to contribute. Sorry.
You wrote about 140 line, I wrote 4. We got the gist of your rant very quickly.
It's not being defensive. We're all big boys and girls here. If we want to have our milk and cookies, so be it. If you want to eat apples, so be it.
It always interests me that when you tell somebody a random fact they are likely to go 'oh wow didn't know that' but if it has to do with their diet.. no chance! You practically need it to be written in holy scriptures for someone to believe it's true.
Okay Jenzay. We get it. You're anti milk. You've certainly convinced me. From this point forward, anyone on the forum caught drinking milk will go to Buddhist Hell...or Christian Hell, if you're so disposed.
Next rant topic?
:rarr:
Why so defensive? Geez, I just thought it was something random and possibly interesting that hasn't been discussed, and something that I've found myself interested in for whatever reason. I started researching it from an objective point of view. All I've stated are some facts and then my own opinion which is not above yours. I'm new here and was just trying to contribute. Sorry.
You wrote about 140 line, I wrote 4. We got the gist of your rant very quickly.
It's not being defensive. We're all big boys and girls here. If we want to have our milk and cookies, so be it. If you want to eat apples, so be it.
Where did I command anybody to stop drinking milk? You're implying that due to my opinion of milk I am trying to force everybody to stop drinking it. That's a pretty ridiculous assumption. Yes, what you said was very defensive. For some reason whatever I've said about milk seems to personally affect you and you cannot stand my 'rant'.
I simply thought it would be interesting.. and it has been!
Why so defensive? Geez, I just thought it was something random and possibly interesting that hasn't been discussed, and something that I've found myself interested in for whatever reason. I started researching it from an objective point of view. All I've stated are some facts and then my own opinion which is not above yours. I'm new here and was just trying to contribute. Sorry.
You wrote about 140 line, I wrote 4. We got the gist of your rant very quickly.
It's not being defensive. We're all big boys and girls here. If we want to have our milk and cookies, so be it. If you want to eat apples, so be it.
Where did I command anybody to stop drinking milk? You're implying that due to my opinion of milk I am trying to force everybody to stop drinking it. That's a pretty ridiculous assumption. Yes, what you said was very defensive. For some reason whatever I've said about milk seems to personally affect you and you cannot stand my 'rant'.
I simply thought it would be interesting.. and it has been!
You have strong feelings about this topic. That's fine. That's your right. And it's your right to express those feelings.
It's a public forum. I assume you expect people to respond in various ways. I think I have a right to express my reaction to your post, which is that you appear to be "over the top" on this one.
It's cool. Don't drink milk. No problem. Tell others your view. That's fine.
Most of what I said was not 'my view', but was factual. Just because the information might not be a very widespread doesn't mean it's over the top to put it out there. My only intention was to put here what I myself have gathered over the years. It's obviously up to everyone to take from it what they want and disregard it if they want.
No need to act as if I'm trying to create a global smear campaign for my own gain.
I understand. I posted this because it seems to do a decent job of presenting opposing views, with citations. I'm sure it doesn't tell the whole story on either side, but it appears to be a decent summary.
lol funny how something as trivial as milk can cause such an uproar. But seriously, that soymilk I drink is seriously good shit. Has plenty of goodness your body requires
Anyone tried rice milk ? I did not like the taste, tough it was unsweetened.
With Metta
Yes, I did. Didn't like it either. To be honest, you can drink other beverages, but none really substitutes for milk (has the same flavor, etc.). Other beverages do have other benefits, however.
I haven't tried rice milk but I tried this milk that wasn't soy, but made from vegetables.. it was in Hong Kong and my cantonese isn't very good so all I could make out was that it was from some sort of vegetables. It was really good.
Coconut milk is used in a lot in Asian cuisine as well, and there is oat milk which I have not tasted before, but was thinking about giving it a go to see what it does tastes like. Anyone tasted oat milk ?
haven't drank any rice milk, drank a lot of rice wine though in thailand. These guys just have too much rice so they star making wine out of it It is pretty horrid and cheap, siam sato, burns yoru stomach lining away.
So, has anybody drank human milk or had any food with it in?
Too much protein causes blood plasma to be acidic due to the excess of amino acids in the blood. It is the acidic nature which prevents the calcium ions to be deposited in the bones, causing leaching. The calcium ions then bond together and deposit in the kidneys, hence causing kidney stones and bladder stones.
I write "too much", meaning people who take in more than the 20% of their diet in protein.
amino acid is a zwitterion. Both an acid and a base. Dorje is correct though because the equilibria of the acid reaction is stronger than the base. However the blood has buffers and the blood will only be very slightly less than pH 7.4.
Actually in reality dorje is incorrect. Low levels of proteins make the blood more sensitive to acid overload. Because the proteins are natural buffers (fix the pH at a level). This would be at such a low protein level that someone is starving so its pretty meaningless.
The kidneys can regulate the acidity level other than carbonic. They react the acid with phosphate (fast) or ammonium (slower) and excrete in the urine. However the pH of the urine may not fall below 4.4. You would have to eat a hell of a lot of protein to have a blood acidity that would not be able to be regulated.
Also as alluded to by increasing the level of respiration the body will expel more carbon dioxide. This lowers the pH of the blood via lowering levels of carbonic acid.
For these reasons I dispute that protein lowers the pH of the blood enough to affect the bones. As a mechanism it is blown out of the water without studies significantly correlating higher protein content (all protein not just milk) to bone loss or diseases.
Finally consider the logic. Wouldn't a coca cola which (syrup) must be stored in Hazmatt environmental containers and can be used to protect exposed internal organs in an injury be 1000 times more dangerous than protein?
Finally we would conclude that exercise was not only good for health but also bad as lactic acid has a much lower pKa than protein.
Finally the kidney is unable to correct deficiency in too little acid. Therefore it is important to have proteins around. The kidney is able to correct too much acid.
Comments
So I guess it's down to the grip the diary industry has on western culture. They have managed to convince western governments and the masses that we actually need milk in our diet, and the grip is so strong I honestly cannot see this changing for many years.
With Metta
@Jeffrey Ya, that's possible. And do you really mean girl scouts come to your door selling cookies? That kind of thing I only see in movies
@jenzay yeah they do but we bought these at a local hamburger place. yup american 2 cheeseburgers onion rings and a shake. Milk is the least of my worries
With Metta
I will mention here, that allergists say that type O blood and people with Germanic heritage (this includes Brits) have a subtle allergy to milk, that may not be strong enough for noticeable symptoms, but it's clear when blood tests are done. Still, many of those people do fine eating dairy products, as some of our vegetarian members and one moderator have told me emphatically when I last posted about this.
Next rant topic?
:rarr:
Geez, I just thought it was something random and possibly interesting that hasn't been discussed, and something that I've found myself interested in for whatever reason. I started researching it from an objective point of view. All I've stated are some facts and then my own opinion which is not above yours. I'm new here and was just trying to contribute. Sorry.
It's not being defensive. We're all big boys and girls here. If we want to have our milk and cookies, so be it. If you want to eat apples, so be it.
http://www.google.co.th/imglanding?q=thai+soymilk&um=1&hl=th&client=firefox-a&sa=N&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&tbm=isch&tbnid=V8VuzF1s4DqFXM:&imgrefurl=http://www.149sullivanstreet.com/2008_07_01_archive.html&imgurl=http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_B4ooPRmvbOI/SHrmkO5maMI/AAAAAAAAANs/RvzN3J9WH9M/s400/soy-bottle.jpg&w=300&h=400&ei=vpGzTdeoCoiavAPGvrWOBw&zoom=1&iact=hc&page=1&tbnh=148&tbnw=91&start=0&ndsp=14&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0&biw=995&bih=624
I simply thought it would be interesting.. and it has been!
It's not being defensive. We're all big boys and girls here. If we want to have our milk and cookies, so be it. If you want to eat apples, so be it.
Where did I command anybody to stop drinking milk? You're implying that due to my opinion of milk I am trying to force everybody to stop drinking it. That's a pretty ridiculous assumption. Yes, what you said was very defensive. For some reason whatever I've said about milk seems to personally affect you and you cannot stand my 'rant'.
I simply thought it would be interesting.. and it has been!
You have strong feelings about this topic. That's fine. That's your right. And it's your right to express those feelings.
It's a public forum. I assume you expect people to respond in various ways. I think I have a right to express my reaction to your post, which is that you appear to be "over the top" on this one.
It's cool. Don't drink milk. No problem. Tell others your view. That's fine.
No need to act as if I'm trying to create a global smear campaign for my own gain.
Here's a balanced viewpoint both pro and con.
With Metta
Coconut milk is used in a lot in Asian cuisine as well, and there is oat milk which I have not tasted before, but was thinking about giving it a go to see what it does tastes like. Anyone tasted oat milk ?
With Metta
So, has anybody drank human milk or had any food with it in?
I write "too much", meaning people who take in more than the 20% of their diet in protein.
Actually in reality dorje is incorrect. Low levels of proteins make the blood more sensitive to acid overload. Because the proteins are natural buffers (fix the pH at a level). This would be at such a low protein level that someone is starving so its pretty meaningless.
The kidneys can regulate the acidity level other than carbonic. They react the acid with phosphate (fast) or ammonium (slower) and excrete in the urine. However the pH of the urine may not fall below 4.4. You would have to eat a hell of a lot of protein to have a blood acidity that would not be able to be regulated.
Also as alluded to by increasing the level of respiration the body will expel more carbon dioxide. This lowers the pH of the blood via lowering levels of carbonic acid.
For these reasons I dispute that protein lowers the pH of the blood enough to affect the bones. As a mechanism it is blown out of the water without studies significantly correlating higher protein content (all protein not just milk) to bone loss or diseases.
Jenzay's dad can correct me if I am wrong
Finally we would conclude that exercise was not only good for health but also bad as lactic acid has a much lower pKa than protein.
Whats your opinion on oat milk, should I try it ? is it healthy ? :scratch:
With Metta