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Tough Teachers

edited April 2011 in Sanghas
Just wondering if anyone on here's had any experiences with tough teachers that really pushes you? Especially for the homeboys that practices zen/ch'an.

Comments

  • genkakugenkaku Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
    What qualifies as "tough?" Do you mean physically? Mentally? I never have met a teacher who wasn't trying to push his or her students off the cliff one way or another.
  • I never have met a teacher who wasn't trying to push his or her students off the cliff one way or another.
    Really? How so? What tradition do you follow? This sounds interesting.

  • I should really be grateful to have such a tough teacher. There is a constant push for your development. I guess it's kinda like those classic Shaolin movies.
  • aMattaMatt Veteran
    Just wondering if anyone on here's had any experiences with tough teachers that really pushes you? Especially for the homeboys that practices zen/ch'an.
    Yes, and it can be quite painful. Hold your head in one hand, sucking your thumb of the other, rocking back and forth in the bathtub... and even then their words hold fast. Like mental childbirth. :)
  • I thought that just happen in the movies.
  • Just wondering if anyone on here's had any experiences with tough teachers that really pushes you? Especially for the homeboys that practices zen/ch'an.
    Yes, and it can be quite painful. Hold your head in one hand, sucking your thumb of the other, rocking back and forth in the bathtub... and even then their words hold fast. Like mental childbirth. :)
    ha ha, sounds like you've been through it too homeboy! Teacher's words are pretty ruthless, but they call it "great compassion".
  • Floating_AbuFloating_Abu Veteran
    edited April 2011
    Just wondering if anyone on here's had any experiences with tough teachers that really pushes you? Especially for the homeboys that practices zen/ch'an.

    What do you mean by tough?
  • zenffzenff Veteran
    edited April 2011
    What is wrong with a kind teacher?
    Maybe you expect that from a tough teacher you will "get it" sooner?

    :)
  • genkakugenkaku Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
    I never have met a teacher who wasn't trying to push his or her students off the cliff one way or another.
    Really? How so? What tradition do you follow? This sounds interesting.

    CW -- My training has been in Zen, I guess. Outsiders sometimes see Zen as pretty tough, but the fact is that it is just so simple ... that's the ball-buster.

    But more generally, if a student hooks up with a teacher, the student's mind is probably primed for some kind of effort, an effort that finds energetic and profound meanings in the teacher's sometimes simple words. Perhaps we should say that it is the student is the tough one and the teacher is just along for the ride? :)
  • I'd stay clear from 'tough teachers'. Sometimes people tolerate abuse without being aware of it. The last 'tough tacher' type I met was actually an ex-convict threatening to kill people with a hammer (literally). Before it became this obvious, however, many people thought his abusive behavior was just fruit of his 'crazy wisdom'.
  • seeker242seeker242 Zen Florida, USA Veteran
    You will get up a 4 AM and do meditation until 10 PM! And you are not allowed to get up or leave! And you will do this for the next 30 days in a row!

    Talk about tough, hehe. :)
  • genkakugenkaku Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
    you are not allowed to get up or leave!
    ___________________

    Who says so?
  • seeker242seeker242 Zen Florida, USA Veteran
    you are not allowed to get up or leave!
    ___________________

    Who says so?
    Politeness for not wanting to disturb the other people.

    :)
  • Enh, it's just grist for the mills of their practices. :)
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    A weak student often benefits from a strong teacher.
    A strong teacher probably doesn't benefit that much from a strong teacher.
  • A strong teacher probably doesn't benefit that much from a strong teacher.
    It's the other way around in TB. You should see what Tilopa did to Marpa to get him to wake up.
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    Actually I mean a strong student probably doesn't benefit that much from a strong teacher.
  • A strong teacher probably doesn't benefit that much from a strong teacher.
    It's the other way around in TB. You should see what Tilopa did to Marpa to get him to wake up.
    You're getting mixed up with Naropa, 5bells.

    Tilopa was Naropa's teacher.... and Naropa was Marpa's teacher.
  • zenffzenff Veteran
    The toughest sesshin ever – for me – had four participants; three friendly ladies and me.
    We would have more than enough time to relax and read on our rooms. We would eat slowly, mindfully and a lot. We would go to bed early and do formal meditation for a couple of hours a day. Just a couple of hours!
    We would also walk in the woods; slowly, mindfully and a lot.

    It was so tough because there was no challenge in it at all, nothing. It was a peace of cake. It was even…nice! It was beautiful!

    I cried. It was a revelation.
    I didn’t need to prove myself. I didn’t need to prove anything. It isn't a competition.

    Finally I meditated.
  • Tilopa was Naropa's teacher.... and Naropa was Marpa's teacher.
    Thanks, Dazz.

  • Actually I mean a strong student probably doesn't benefit that much from a strong teacher.
    You know, I didn't even notice that. Just read it the way you meant it. Guess I was rushing. :)

  • Oh jeez, nothing so extreme guys! My teacher just tells me off when I am wrong, but I get mad when others dares to tell me I am wrong..... :p

    I am lucky though, if it's the Abbess of the temple telling me off, I'd probably end up hiding in a corner.
  • Alright homeboys! My Guiding venerable is onto my trail that I am wasting my time trolling with you homeboys on here! I will be going on a indefinite hiatus to further my cultivation without more pointless debates!

    I hope all you homeboys make achievement with your own cultivation soon as well and don't get distracted and side tracked with internet side shows know wat im sayin?!!!

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