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the 8FoldPath decribes 'right this,right that' but is there such thing as morally 'right and wrong'

edited June 2011 in Buddhism Today
Ok, of course i do believe and *try* to follow the 8fold path.
But deep deep down I've always thought that nothin in life is *morally right or morally wrong* I believe everything is an oppinion.
So when the 8 fold path describes *the right etc etc......do you think a better word would have been *skillful* so for example:

Skillful view
Skillful thinking
Skillful speech
Skillful action......and so on.

Because I don't think there is a RIGHT way to do things coz everyones different. But there could be a *SKILLFUL Way* to do things.

A friend is reading a book by 'Bhante Henepola Gunaratana' which he talks about *skillful instead of right*

What are your thoughts??









Comments

  • IMO, the 8FP is fundamentally addressing morality, but is also more directed to situational morality rather than absolute dictates.
  • Ok, of course i do believe and *try* to follow the 8fold path.
    But deep deep down I've always thought that nothin in life is *morally right or morally wrong* I believe everything is an oppinion.
    So when the 8 fold path describes *the right etc etc......do you think a better word would have been *skillful* so for example:

    Skillful view
    Skillful thinking
    Skillful speech
    Skillful action......and so on.

    Because I don't think there is a RIGHT way to do things coz everyones different. But there could be a *SKILLFUL Way* to do things.

    A friend is reading a book by 'Bhante Henepola Gunaratana' which he talks about *skillful instead of right*

    What are your thoughts??



    IMO, Right in the sense of Dharma isn't a moral concept, it is a pragmatic concept about suffering reduction.

    So its more like "If you want to reduce Dukka in the world (internal and external) then the Right things to do are....."

    And moreover you shouldn't believe that they are the Right things to do to reduce Dukka because others have told you etc, but because you can see for yourself bu understanding and practising.





  • So its more like "If you want to reduce Dukka in the world (internal and external) then the Right things to do are....."

    ''makes sense thanks''
  • genkakugenkaku Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
    The word "right" is sometimes replaced by the word "complete." Thought, word and deed are in accord. It is a 100% approach instead of holding something back. In a 100% approach, there is no room for bias or opinion or belief ... it is just 100% -- nothing before and nothing after. If you succeed, there is no need to dwell on it. If you fail, there is a 100% effort to correct. A 100% effort or a complete effort is to be in accord with things as they are. It IS the present and there is no escape.
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    I think you could say that the 8 Fold Noble Path is more about skillful. But I think the precepts are more a moral code related to being skillful.
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited June 2011
    hi

    the word "right" means according to the goal of peace/Nirvana (rather than an arbitary judgment)

    Bhante Henepola Gunaratana has skilfully & correctly said it sides with what is 'skilful'

    but the word 'right' comes from the Pali 'sammā', which literally means 'right', 'correct', 'proper', 'thorough'

    however, the essence of the matter is 'right' is what is skilful

    kind regards :)
  • edited June 2011
    I think you probably raise a quite substantial point. While the eightfold path is frequently translated as right view, right intention, right speech, right action, right livelihood, right effort, right mindfulness, and right concentration, there may yet be a more fitting English word to take the place of 'right.'
    One option would be to simply see what other people are translating it as. I have heard 'harmonious' before, and now you are suggesting 'skillful,' which are both satisfactory. Perhaps one might also think about which word satisfies their mind the most. I have come to think of it as a 'conducive' path, because when you look at it they are eight factors that when cultivated sufficiently will 'conduce' to the realization of final Nibbana. :)
    -Tikal
  • Bodha8Bodha8 Veteran
    It matters not, whether the word is Right, Skillful or otherwise. The word does not change the intent of the precept. What difference does the color of the sky make? It is still the sky.
  • It matters not, whether the word is Right, Skillful or otherwise. The word does not change the intent of the precept. What difference does the color of the sky make? It is still the sky.
    Slick!!
  • GuyCGuyC Veteran
    edited June 2011
    Hi Buddhacoe,
    What are your thoughts??
    I have no problem calling the factors of the Noble Eightfold Path "Right" this and "Right" that. They are "Right" in terms of being the right way to wisdom, peace, happiness and freedom from suffering.

    If it were a case of anything and everything ultimately leading to freedom from suffering then the Buddha would not have bothered teaching anything. But, the Buddha taught us the Noble Eightfold Path because it is the Path which he re-discovered as the path which leads to the End of Suffering (Nirvana).

    It is true, everyone is different, everyone is entitled to their own opinion...but...some people appear to create far less problems for themselves than others. Some rare people seemingly are unaffected by events and circumstances that would upset the average person. It is not by chance that we end suffering, it is through the practice of the Noble Eightfold Path.

    Metta,

    Guy
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    Right View is right because it is not deceptive. The others emanate from that view.
  • Anything that promotes harmonious, well beings, compassion, benevolent, smilies, pleasantness, serenity, love of earth and mankind, especially developing the health of earth (http://www.zgqxb.com.cn/kjzg/kejidt/201002/t20100209_5348.htm) to benefit mankind is right. Once the earth is sick, crop farming the basic foods for mankind suffers, the Earth will be on the brink of a sixth mass extinction {http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994797}. Anything that claiming you karma has brought you in such a horrible state and you bear the consequences without giving sufficient aides to liberate such horrible state is unright.
    Hope that earth is always a lovely places for all of us and it is your onus to make it happens through the rights. :thumbsup:
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited June 2011
    The above post is not related to liberation. It sounds like craving & lust. :-/
    Come! Behold this world, which is like a decorated royal chariot. Here fools flounder, but the wise have no attachment to it.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/dhp/dhp.13.budd.html
    There is the case where a monk remains focused on the body in & of itself — ardent, alert & mindful — putting aside greed & distress with reference to the world. He remains focused on feelings... mind... mental qualities in & of themselves — ardent, alert & mindful — putting aside greed & distress with reference to the world.

    http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.010.than.html
  • Obey the law

    google "5 precepts" and "10 wholesome actions"

    The easy option, saves the trouble of further investigation.
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