Hi! I am new to this forum.

almer45

Hi! First of all I would like to greet you for the wonderful forum you have got. I hope to be a good spiritual friend of all of you in the forum. I have some doubts about meditation. Perhaps you can help me.

I have been practicing kriya yoga for about eight years about two or three hours a day. Before this, I also practiced meditation for about four or five years but not so seriously. On february 19th 2008 I was meditating and I became one with infinite. I don't know if I should call it, Spirit, Nature of the mind or another word. The only thing I know is that it really changed my life. A few days afterwards, I had the same experience. But, to have the same experience I have had to wait three years until March 31th, 2011. For me it is very difficult to enter in what it is called the Nature of the Mind. The times I have been this way I was so concentrated that thoughts completely disappeared. I would like to know if at first it takes a long time to be able to be in the nature of the mind in a daily routine when you meditate. I have also doubts if it is Spirit or the Nature of the Mind? How can I know for certain the path I should follow? My first target in life is Self-Realization.

taiyaki

welcome!
what happens when you allow everything to be as it is? being in a state of relaxation but firm and confident.

what do you hope to achieve?

Jeffrey

Your probably mixing up like 25 different systems of teachings.. just observe your experience. If you think its spirit then thats your experience. If you think you are a permanent self then that is your thought.

This provides some stability in trusting experience. In meditation in mindfulness it is not too easy to get experience into the nature of mind. You may just be completely deluded, but there is something valuable in any case. And anyhow there are also wonderful experiences that people have.

Because it is so confused I would recommend reading about something that makes sense. Buddhism makes sense to me and I think it is the best path. But evaluate it critically and receive guidance in your yogi, bare experience practice.

Thats my best stab.

almer45

I have read "The tibetan book of living and dying" by Sogyal Rimpoché a few weeks ago. When I have had these experiences I could feel the whole universe in me or the sensation to be one with infinite. I was like a ball of light.

I perhaps mix up systems of teachings because I think that samadhi, nature of the mind, nirvana and even some christian saints experiences are the same thing. We perhaps call it with different names but they are not different. The only idea is that I would like to know what it is the ultimate truth. Now, I am looking for, seeking for answers for the path that I should follow. I would like that everything agrees or works in the path I follow. The main doubt I have in my life is if God exists.

taiyaki

when i sit zazen i just sit zazen. i watch my mind move and settle.
this isn't a means or a method or a path to truth. sitting and watching is wisdom itself.

Jeffrey

My teacher does long distance courses and connections buddhism connect. I find it quite possible that she would know something about the nature of mind or could help you find a point to look for that.

genkaku

The main doubt I have in my life is if God exists.

@almer45 -- In what way do you imagine that erasing this doubt would make a difference?

almer45

Dear friends

Thank you for your replies. Yes, when one sits in meditation, we should be in meditation and nothing more. We shouldn't look for anything. If we seek something then it is the ordinary mind what we are using, we can't be in the nature of the mind. But after meditation doubts come. One of my main doubts is, if I pray God if he can help me. Then another question comes; if God doesn't exist who can help me when I have a problem? In the practice I have seen many people that prayed God and after that they didn't have good lives, on the contrary they led terrible lives of suffering. This has made me think if I am doing things well. After so many hours of meditation, I would like to know the truth of everything. Are there six bardos or is there an astral world when I die divided in different areas (high astral,low astral)? I don't want to achieve anything, when a person is in the nature of the mind, samadhi or call it as you like, everything is achieved. You only have to sit and be, be one with Infinite or call it Spirit.

Thank you Jeffrey, for your link very much. I will have a look at it.

almer45

I am sorry, four bardos and six kingdoms in the bardos.

Yishai

Doubt is one of the five hindrances, defilements of the mind that weaken wisdom. Stop doubting and just experience everything as if you are discovering something completely new that no one has ever talked about, mentioned, known about before.

Once you start to think "well this must be what so-and-so was talking about" you have already assigned a name to it and began reducing the experience itself. Just experience what you experience in meditation and let the experience bring you wisdom. After you have digested it on your own and received all the wisdom you can get from it by yourself, then you should talk about it with a teacher. A good teacher will not doubt your experience (after all, who's to say what you did or did not experience other than yourself?) but further your understanding of it in a nurturing and informative way.

"I don't want to achieve anything" -> "After so many hours of meditation, I would like to know the truth of everything"

You are walking all over your own words here.

I think most of your doubts can be removed simply by saying and accepting that "I don't know". Saying you don't know gives you a solid place to work from, the present.

Yishai

If I pray to God, can he help me?

Maybe. We cannot know. However, if it brings your mind into a more peaceful state before meditation, then I would say that it is conducive to meditation.

Then another question comes; if God doesn't exist who can help me when I have a problem?

Yourself, of course, and many other compassionate people in the world and your community.

In the practice I have seen many people that prayed to God and after that they didn't have a good life; on the contrary, they led a terrible life of suffering.

Suffering is everywhere, and we can only work at it with diligence and compassion. People who do not pray to God also suffer in the practice. They also lead a life of dukkha.

This has made me think if I am doing things well.

You need only compare to your previous states to see if you have made progress on the path. Unskillfully, it does not help to see that you have less suffering than others. Skillfully, seeing ourselves having less suffering can gives us an opportunity for compassion for helping others who do suffer more than ourselves.

After so many hours of meditation, I would like to know the truth of everything.

We should not expect certain fruits of meditation. Just be mindful and concentrate on the present.

Are there six bardos or is there an astral world when I die divided in different areas (high astral,low astral)?

We do not know. You do not know. Keep meditating, and you may find out for yourself, though. These things are not important to the present. You are trying to cope with the future when all we have is the now. Tibetan monks do not try to cope with their death (they do not fear it nor invite it) ahead of time. But they prepare themselves in the present for it through meditation and cultivating mindfulness and compassion. You do not spend the days before a battle thinking whether or not you will die and what death is like. You spend it preparing to go into battle by training and focusing on disciplined techniques. This isn't to say that death is a struggle. It is just an experience.

I don't want to achieve anything, when a person is in the nature of the mind, samadhi or call it as you like, everything is achieved. You only have to sit and be, be one with Infinite or call it Spirit.

Just sit and be. Leave expectations, doubts, and goals at the door.

genkaku

Doubt is one of the five hindrances, defilements of the mind that weaken wisdom.

@Yishai -- Just another point of view: I see courage, patience and doubt as indispensable in practice. Courage to practice, patience to practice, and doubt to clarify any 'certainties' that may arise.

Color me defiled and unwise.

Yishai

Doubt is one of the five hindrances, defilements of the mind that weaken wisdom.

@Yishai -- Just another point of view: I see courage, patience and doubt as indispensable in practice. Courage to practice, patience to practice, and doubt to clarify any 'certainties' that may arise.

Color me defiled and unwise.

doubt is in direct opposition to acceptance. Can you give an example of good doubt. Obviously we are told not to accept something because someone says to. That's the only thing I can think of. In that case we should not doubt that they believe it, but we should find the answers ourselves. Idk, I was going by the 5 hindrances which I personally don't not know much about.

Yishai

http://www.insightmeditationcenter.org/books-articles/articles/the-five-hindrances-handouts/doubting-doubt-practicing-with-the-final-hindrance/

This article makes the discernment of "Hindering doubt" and "Questioning doubt". Not a bad read.

genkaku

Obviously we are told not to accept something because someone says to.

@Yishai -- Would that include telling ourselves not to accept what we tell ourselves to accept? And if so, should we accept that?

Yishai

@genkaku
Should we not accept that? (whatever 'that' is)

I cannot really give an intelligent answer because we're debating about uncertainties. If that link I described is right, then questioning doubt is good for practice. Questioning yourself into paralysis is not though.

genkaku

@Yishai -- My own feeling is that a strong practice clears away doubt automatically ... which is not to suggest we shouldn't maintain a strong doubt in the first place.

Yishai

@genkaku
I agree. Practice leads to wisdom. Wisdom clears doubt.

I guess that means it is unwise to prematurely clear doubt?

genkaku

@Yishai -- My view is that there is no need to get overly-concerned about doubt. Everyone starts out with belief and hope. Those beliefs and hopes, besides inspiring good action, also imply and on-going sense or series of doubts. So in a sense, doubts take care of themselves and there is no need to fret. A constant and determined practice will clear away doubts like a wet rag on a much-marked blackboard.

almer45

Thank you Yishai and Gentaku for your nice replies. I feel really grateful for your lines Yishai. You are really a person who has compassion for everybody because you have dedicated some time to answer me.

I think you are right. If you have doubts you have a restless mind and then you can't be in the nature of the mind. I have read on the book "the tibetan book of living and dying" that if you die and you don't recognise the clear light then you lose the opportunity to be in the absolute nature. If you don't recognise the clear light and the four steps of dharmata then you go to one of the six kingdoms and it is sure your reincarnation again. Chance lost! This is another reason of thinking about the subject. After the experiences I have had I don't want to repeat course again (reincarnation to more suffering). If I have to come again to help other people I want to do it but if it is for more suffering, I say no.

I would like to ask you a question. One a person begins to be in the nature of the mind, does it take time to be in it when you meditate everyday? (That is to say, at first you are one day in the nature of the mind for a short period of time and then It takes time to be again in the nature of the mind.)You have to consolidate it with a lot of meditation to be able to be everyday in the nature of the mind.

Kwantum_Kev

I can relate with what you are saying, and can say from personal experience that very often, the harder I have tried to "re-achieve" a state of sublime peace as experienced in a good mediation, the harder it has been to actually achieve.

For me, it has increased my awareness that I do not fully comprehend what it is, how to get there, or why it happens sometimes and not others. But the fact that it happened at all, and the possibility that it will again, is enough to keep me practicing.

I remember reading somewhere, in one of my many books on Buddhism, that those times we struggle for even 10 seconds of still mind, those meditations that seem like drudgery, those periods of time over which we just can't seem to "get there" - it is those periods that are true gold, and it is only our lack of clear perception that keeps us from seeing them as such.

If you are too set on achieving the state you speak of, the 'nature of mind,' then that craving becomes a desire itself, and will only add further difficulty to truly achieving peace. Craving is craving, even if it is for those "hallowed states". Chogyam Trungpa has a great book on Spiritual Materialism that talks a bit about this. It might be something you would enjoy reading - might give you some insight.

Good luck and namaste',

Kwan Kev

almer45

Thank you Kwan Kev. I bought the book Spiritual Materialism by Chogyam Trungpa about twenty years ago. It was one of my first buddhist books. I really enjoyed it. Perhaps it is time to read it again.