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Three questions from a newbie!

edited October 2011 in Buddhism Basics
I actually have three questions which sort of relate to the same topic. Sorry if they have been answered already.
1. Can a person be christian/jewish/muslim and Buddhist?
2. Do you have to accept the concept of rebirth and all the concepts to be classified a Buddhist?
3. Does taking refuge in some traditions view Buddha as a God like entity?

Im as new as a newbie gets and would really like some help. I have been studying buddhism for a year now but I am finding it hard to get answers to some of these questions?

Comments

  • CloudCloud Veteran
    edited October 2011
    1. You can believe in things that each religion teaches and call yourself anything you'd like, but in effect the path of liberation taught in Buddhism releases the mind of beliefs (not everyone calls themselves a Buddhist for the same reasons though... not everyone seeks liberation from suffering). If you do choose to walk the Noble Eightfold Path, other beliefs could be a hindrance and you may come to the point where you have to choose what is more important to you... clinging to beliefs or being free.

    2. You don't really have to believe everything at face-value, though it helps to at least understand how they are taught (concepts such as rebirth can be taken metaphorically or literally, or both for instance). There are some concepts that aren't really debatable as far as Buddhism goes, and others that are highly debated.

    3. The founder of Buddhism is never portrayed as anything other than human (definitely not a god), though some explanations may come off this way if not properly understood. The man Siddhartha Gautama who was called the Buddha was only human. We all have the potential to become liberated (this is called "Buddha-Nature") just as he did, but he lived and died the same as any human. The "emptiness" that is our reality, our true nature, is sometimes personified as a form/emanation of the Buddha, but that is not Siddhartha Gautama himself (he's long dead).

    Of course everyone's going to give you different answers, as the forms of Buddhism and the ways in which its teachings may be interpreted are vast. I'd suggest starting with a good website like http://www.buddhanet.net and devouring as much information as you can until you become comfortable and find your own understanding.
  • 1) it is possible technically i guess... but the abrihamic religions are diametrically opposed to Buddhism on many foundationally important areas. such as creator god, karma, self reliance, meditation, etc

    2) Bhante Gunaratana talks about exactly this here: http://bhavana.us/mp3/WhatisKamma.mp3

    imo, you dont necessarily HAVE to believe those things, but it 'makes sense' in the scope of what Buddhists actually practice. eventually, if pursued to fruition, you would have direct knowledge of such things and belief wouldnt be an issue.

    3) i have never heard of any Buddhist traditions referring to the Buddha as a god, but my scope of understanding doesnt go much beyond Theravada traditions. I've never heard him referred to as being inherently superior to all other beings, he was just at the end stage of development.


  • 3) The mahayana has the trikaya, three bodies of buddha. Try wikipedia. Nirmanakaya, Dharmakaya, and Samboghakaya. I don't think its the same thing as a 'god'.
  • CloudCloud Veteran
    edited October 2011
    @Jeffrey
    That's one of those things that confuses people. ;) Hehe. This is what I'm understanding of the Trikaya (and I'm not saying this is "right"):

    Dharmakaya = Emptiness, Suchness, the Nature of Reality
    Sambhogakaya = (the state of) Enlightenment or Nirvana
    Nirmanakaya = the enlightened being that teaches liberation (i.e. Gautama)

    At least... that's what it seems to boil down to in layman's terms. The whole three-body thing makes it more complicated than Emptiness, Enlightenment and the Founder of the Path. Otherwise when someone says Buddha you can't know whether they're referring to Siddhartha Gautama or to Emptiness or what and that's how people completely misunderstand each other.

    (If that's wrong maybe it's new-thread-worthy, we wouldn't want to hi-jack this one to debate the Trikaya! I'd certainly be interested in understanding it better if this isn't an accurate interpretation.) :D
  • Cloud, I really cannot recall what I read, but I have some idea that there is quite a lot to the trikaya. Again I have not thought or studied this too much. I have a simple practice of meditation and reading (very slowly).
  • MindGateMindGate United States Veteran
    Cloud nailed it.
  • Thanks for the reply Cloud and Jeffery - I think for my sake I need to take a step back and think about where I stand.
  • CloudCloud Veteran
    edited October 2011
    That almost makes it too easy. If you take a step back you'll be paying attention and you'll know exactly where you end up standing. Hardly seems to require additional thought on top of that. :D hehehe

    I wouldn't worry too much about where you stand right now, when you figure it out. This whole Buddhism thing... it involves a lot of change. I don't see things at all the way I did back when I was learning, even when I thought I knew what it was about! Just as soon as you start thinking "hmm, I think I get it now"... POW, something happens to make you re-evaluate everything from a different angle that makes it seem entirely new.

    It's fun though, don't be discouraged. We just keep moving closer and closer to the understanding that the Buddha and other enlightened masters had/have. It's an exhilarating journey and well worth the effort it takes to walk upon the path.
  • I know I saw a discussion thread on here about someone having/following four religions I was like hmmm...i better be careful not to fall into that!
  • CinorjerCinorjer Veteran
    edited October 2011
    I actually have three questions which sort of relate to the same topic. Sorry if they have been answered already.
    1. Can a person be christian/jewish/muslim and Buddhist?
    2. Do you have to accept the concept of rebirth and all the concepts to be classified a Buddhist?
    3. Does taking refuge in some traditions view Buddha as a God like entity?

    Im as new as a newbie gets and would really like some help. I have been studying buddhism for a year now but I am finding it hard to get answers to some of these questions?
    1. There's no ban against practicing the Dharma while observing other religious practices. Even officially taking refuge is not "converting" from one thing to another and nowhere do the vows say you must abandon other religions. However, the other religions will probably have something to say about their members also practicing Buddhism.

    2. There's no test for what you have to believe to be considered a good Buddhist. We let the other religions get mired in creeds and tests of belief. I have been a Buddhist since I was a young man, when I came to know an old Zen monk at a local shrine in Korea. I've never been much of a believer in reincarnation or anything mystical.

    3. Buddha is never seen as a god, but he is treated as a savior and someone we can pray to in some parts of the world, the same with the Bodhisattvas you see and hear about. For some Buddhists, Guatama was just a man before and after, and for some Buddhists, he became more than human. Since it's his teaching that's important to us, it's not really relevant. For many people of the world, yes, Buddhism is a practice of devotion. When we feel helpless and scared and alone in the world, sometimes it's the only source of comfort available.

    Hope this helps.
  • genkakugenkaku Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
    @vintagelot -- It may be hard to imagine at the moment, but Buddhism is built for one thing and one thing only. That something is you. This invitation is not an invitation to do anything you want. It is an invitation to reflect with honesty and persistence on your very own life -- its beliefs, its actions, its philosophies and religions. This is not a "right" or "wrong" business ... it is simply your business.

    A meditation practice is one of the best ways of pursuing your investigation -- an actual-factual sit-down-straighten-the-spine-sit-still-shut-up-and-focus-the-mind practice. In this practice, there is a chance to see what actually happens and stop dithering about what you might hope would happen or think should happen. You may pursue this practice regardless of belief. Why? Because experience trumps belief (with or without Buddhism) and the lives we lead are lives full of right-now experience. Your honest experience lies at the core of Buddhism. So ... what is your honest experience? Take a look. You may be both surprised and delighted at what you find.

    Best wishes.
  • re: #3 After Buddha's enlightenment he met a man along the road. The man asked him, "Are you a god?" The Buddha answered "No". The man then asked him if he was a man. The Buddha again answered, "No." The man then asked, "So what are you?" The Buddha answered, "I am awake."
  • @genkaku I have been practising meditation for a while now and I find it totally transformed me in a huge way. My mind was not running at a hundread miles per hour and I am able to think clearly. Yes it took me a while to get into the flow (so to speak) but thats really paid off. Adapting my lifestyle has been a huge benefit to me however I am stuck at the concept of rebirth and reincarnation.

    I have visited a sangha recently in london and found it all very annoying as I felt like I had to be an atheist to be a good Buddhist. Lets say they did nothing but raise more questions for me. ;) I think I'll stop visiting the random sangha's.
  • CloudCloud Veteran
    edited October 2011
    If you're stuck on rebirth, try thinking of it not as rebirth of a person but rebirth of ignorance and the suffering it brings. Until we have right view of reality (clarity) and have let go of our cravings and attachments, we'll always be striving for what we desire and against that which we hate, never finding satisfaction. It's like that suffering keeps coming back again and again, constantly in a state of re-"becoming" because the conditions remain for it to arise, and we keep trying to quench it with happiness but the happiness never lasts! Even when we find it, it's temporary and we have to struggle to hold on. This struggle is always in vain, because suffering is happiness's constant companion as light is to dark.

    The mind must instead find an abiding calm and stillness, an acceptance of each moment that arises without judging it by "likes" or "dislikes", purely experiencing and seeing things clearly for what they are, grasping at nothing.

    The mind finds true peace beyond this terrible cycling between happiness and suffering, finding acceptance in knowing the true nature of all phenomena as impermanent, empty of self or abiding entity, and painful to grasp. Seeing these things clearly, experiencing them in meditation and knowing their causes, the mind lets go of any actions that would lead to suffering. It lets go of its attachments, and craving due to ignorance ceases. Peace becomes well-established, and skillful actions flow naturally with compassionate wisdom to alleviate the suffering of others.
  • Well said cloud, what I ideally want to do and think I need to is stop follow a set tradition and finding something that feels ok.
  • It's actually rare to hear someone say they don't want to follow any tradition. :) I've experimented with different traditional paradigms, but ended up just doing my own thing based around the Four Noble Truths and Noble Eightfold Path. It's worked pretty well so far, as I tend not to confuse myself. I wish you luck!
  • That's exactly what I want to do. This all started after I visited a sangha in London and began talking to a young female monk and it just made me realise that yes I am a Buddhist in training but there is a whole set of values and goals I don't want to miss out on. In a nutshell she is 24 and became a ordained monk I think its called at 21 and see was visiting the sangha as well. She lives in a monastry and has left all her family and worldly possessions to join. I did go with a Christian friend so I had someone who was up for a debate with her anyway - and we debated on the way home! But she is missing so much of her life. She never married, or will have a family or even experience love. It just seemed extreme sacrifice - the thought then crepted into my mind. After all that sacrifice what if she is reincarnated as a bug due to her past lives?

    I don't mean to offend anyone, but its meeting this young monk that has set so many questions in my mind!
  • MindGateMindGate United States Veteran
    Most Buddhists don't believe in Reincarnation. Just saying.
    A lot of Buddhists believe in Rebirth though, but not reincarnation.
    Then again, some Buddhists believe in neither.
  • jlljll Veteran
    Dear mindgate,
    it is totally irresponsible to make this statement.
    Where do you get your statistics from???


    ;
    Most Buddhists don't believe in Reincarnation. Just saying.
    A lot of Buddhists believe in Rebirth though, but not reincarnation.
    Then again, some Buddhists believe in neither.
  • @vintagelot -- It may be hard to imagine at the moment, but Buddhism is built for one thing and one thing only. That something is you. This invitation is not an invitation to do anything you want. It is an invitation to reflect with honesty and persistence on your very own life -- its beliefs, its actions, its philosophies and religions. This is not a "right" or "wrong" business ... it is simply your business.

    A meditation practice is one of the best ways of pursuing your investigation -- an actual-factual sit-down-straighten-the-spine-sit-still-shut-up-and-focus-the-mind practice. In this practice, there is a chance to see what actually happens and stop dithering about what you might hope would happen or think should happen. You may pursue this practice regardless of belief. Why? Because experience trumps belief (with or without Buddhism) and the lives we lead are lives full of right-now experience. Your honest experience lies at the core of Buddhism. So ... what is your honest experience? Take a look. You may be both surprised and delighted at what you find.

    Best wishes.
    Great answer for a newbie. Simple and uncomplicated. Well done.

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