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Idiot compassion
Jeffrey
Veteran
I would like to learn more about this so I looked it up and here is what pema chodron says (will follow). I am going to think about it and get into the discussion later. Please before you post think in yourself of the wish to end suffering.
As Pema Chodron interview:
IDIOT COMPASSION
three dancers Student: I'm interested in the idea of idiot compassion that was in Ken McLeod's book [Wake Up To Your Life]", and wishing compassion for someone who's doing harm to you or that you need to remove yourself from. How do you differentiate the feeling of compassion and the need to remove yourself from a damaging situation?
Pema: Idiot compassion is a great expression, which was actually coined by Trungpa Rinpoche. It refers to something we all do a lot of and call it compassion. In some ways, it's whats called enabling. It's the general tendency to give people what they want because you can't bear to see them suffering. Basically, you're not giving them what they need. You're trying to get away from your feeling of I can't bear to see them suffering. In other words, you're doing it for yourself. You're not really doing it for them.
When you get clear on this kind of thing, setting good boundaries and so forth, you know that if someone is violent, for instance, and is being violent towards you —to use that as the example— it's not the compassionate thing to keep allowing that to happen, allowing someone to keep being able to feed their violence and their aggression. So of course, they're going to freak out and be extremely upset. And it will be quite difficult for you to go through the process of actually leaving the situation. But that's the compassionate thing to do.
It's the compassionate thing to do for yourself, because you're part of that dynamic, and before you always stayed. So now you're going to do something frightening, groundless, and quite different. But it's the compassionate thing to do for yourself, rather than stay in a demeaning, destructive, abusive relationship.
And it's the most compassionate thing you can do for them too. They will certainly not thank you for it, and they will certainly not be glad. They'll go through a lot. But if there's any chance for them to wake up or start to work on their side of the problem, their abusive behavior or whatever it might be, that's the only chance, is for you to actually draw the line and get out of there.
We all know a lot of stories of people who had to hit that kind of bottom, where the people that they loved stopped giving them the wrong kind of compassion and just walked out. Then sometimes that wakes a person up and they start to do what they need to do.
As Pema Chodron interview:
IDIOT COMPASSION
three dancers Student: I'm interested in the idea of idiot compassion that was in Ken McLeod's book [Wake Up To Your Life]", and wishing compassion for someone who's doing harm to you or that you need to remove yourself from. How do you differentiate the feeling of compassion and the need to remove yourself from a damaging situation?
Pema: Idiot compassion is a great expression, which was actually coined by Trungpa Rinpoche. It refers to something we all do a lot of and call it compassion. In some ways, it's whats called enabling. It's the general tendency to give people what they want because you can't bear to see them suffering. Basically, you're not giving them what they need. You're trying to get away from your feeling of I can't bear to see them suffering. In other words, you're doing it for yourself. You're not really doing it for them.
When you get clear on this kind of thing, setting good boundaries and so forth, you know that if someone is violent, for instance, and is being violent towards you —to use that as the example— it's not the compassionate thing to keep allowing that to happen, allowing someone to keep being able to feed their violence and their aggression. So of course, they're going to freak out and be extremely upset. And it will be quite difficult for you to go through the process of actually leaving the situation. But that's the compassionate thing to do.
It's the compassionate thing to do for yourself, because you're part of that dynamic, and before you always stayed. So now you're going to do something frightening, groundless, and quite different. But it's the compassionate thing to do for yourself, rather than stay in a demeaning, destructive, abusive relationship.
And it's the most compassionate thing you can do for them too. They will certainly not thank you for it, and they will certainly not be glad. They'll go through a lot. But if there's any chance for them to wake up or start to work on their side of the problem, their abusive behavior or whatever it might be, that's the only chance, is for you to actually draw the line and get out of there.
We all know a lot of stories of people who had to hit that kind of bottom, where the people that they loved stopped giving them the wrong kind of compassion and just walked out. Then sometimes that wakes a person up and they start to do what they need to do.
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Grandmother's Compassion.
Grandmother's Compassion soothes the pain.
The pain is still there, but she makes it 'feel' better.
“What causes the pain Gran?'”
“Don't bother about that dear, have another piece of cake.
It will be alright.” said Grandmother.
Grandmother's compassion is to hope, based on fear.
This in turn is based on ignorance.
“Trust in Love and Light.”
If that were true, a lot of people would have been enlightened...
but they are not.
It's not that easy!
But it is that simple.
And there is the dilemma:
what do those words really mean?
Love? Light?
Are they to make you feel good?
Or do they have a truer meaning?
What is this Love?
What is this Light?
Grandmother's compassion, is relative truth -
we seem to feel better, but it does not last.
It's a temporary fix.
So who has ultimate truth?
You have it! You are it!
You are the Light.
Its expression is Love.
How will I know this Light?
How do I express this Love?
Through recognising your true nature.
Through recognising others true nature.
When you realise your true nature,
joy arises...
and then sadness, that others have not recognised their true nature.
That sadness is Love.
Once you realise that unshakeable Light,
the only thing left is to Love the Light in others.
Unshakeable means constant, absolute, unbreakable,
with a diamond quality.
Lucid, humorous, playful, clear, pure...never ending.
This Love manifests as pacifying, enriching, magnetising and destroying -
all in order to counter ego's games, which hide the Light.
Tony
1) It is not impossible for me or anyone else to become a buddha. So my granny can become a buddha and so can a thug.
2) The sins I or anyone else commits are not ME or THEM.. rather the path is to overcome our conditioning.
3) I am not better than anyone else. I am not higher than an idiot or lower than a genius.
This is from traditional teachings but I broke it down for y'all.
In light of 1 and 3 I believe I should not turn my back on any being. But in light of 2 if I am getting my jollies dispensing platitudes or whatever unhelpful then that is neurosis.
Trungpa coined the phrase idiot compassion. Yet at the same time in Trungpa's book Smile at Fear Trungpa reports that those who have escaped hope and fear give mother's milk to those still within the filthy nest.
“We can love a hungry tiger, but we’d better love it from a safe distance. “
I think @Jeffrey that I get what you’re pointing at.
When we hang on in a difficult relationship and it changes for the better –on account of our effort - everyone will say that it was a brilliant example of compassion and of not giving up on a person.
When it turns out wrong however, the same people will say that - of course - this was a clear example of idiot compassion.
The bottom line is we have to make our own decisions. Only in hindsight mistakes are “clearly a mistake”.
I don't like to disagree with the Ven. Chondron, but he's using a dangerous way to teach about using wisdom in our actions. Let me give you something to think about.
Divide your compassion in your mind into good and bad, and immediately your actions become slaves to your own beliefs and expectations. Our minds struggle for an excuse not to act with compassion, because that means we're acting for the benefit of another, not ourselves. Why should I do that? So our mind throws up all sorts of excuses. "Well, he's only going to use the money to get drunk, after all. So I'll just keep my money and spend it on myself." Or, my favorite excuse, "Hey, her karma got her to where she is today. It's her fault. She has to work out her own karma."
In other words, I bet everyone who follows the Ven. Chondron will stop acting with compassion because their minds have found a handy excuse not to. That is why I say it is a dangerous teaching.
Saying only idiots act on compassion unless we know for certain our actions are going to make a positive difference is to set ourselves up as judge and jury over other people. It's to treat other people as less than yourself, as a list of good and bad qualities instead of a fellow flawed human being who deserves to be treated equally. How do you feel, when you ask for help and someone judges you as not worthy?
People don't need advice to do that. Their minds are already stuck in that judgemental attitude. It is the huge problem in the world right now.
Now, let's talk about people who take advantage of other people's generosity. So you meet a stranger who has no place to live and let them sleep in your house. And overnight that person steals everything not nailed down and skips out. Idiot compassion? No, unwise action on the part of both people. On the other hand, there are many times when the person that moved in appreciated the help and nothing wrong happened. But we ignore those cases and focus on the ones that turned out bad. In other words, we reduce compassion to a matter of risk.
Compassion is compassion. It is seeing the suffering of others and being moved to act because of it. But those actions, like anything you do, might be wise or foolish, and all actions carry some sort of risk. So along with compassion, apply a little wisdom, that's all. Feel compassion and do something. But, what you do is guided by a bit of wisdom, of course. When in doubt, err on the side of being an idiot.
First of all this is not black and white thinking. If the worst thing I have done is practice an idiot compassion moment where I could have practiced a 'reality compassion' moment then it is okay, having compassion for self as well. It is not the same as saying 'that jerk has insulted me for the last time,' walking out, holding anger, telling at least a dozen friends what a jerk he is and 6 months later still feeling great about having a boundary.
My fave story of my own on this, and shortly after I read about idiot compassion, was my daughter's boyfriend. He apparently was sleeping in the neighborhood in winter in a sleeping bag. He had turned down a job offer back when the economy was slightly better and now he had no place to live. So I found out and of course the young people were relieved because I would in some form rescue him. They were surprised when I gave the choice to go to a hospital for a 72 hour hold based on the suicidal behavior of sleeping outside in December in Colorado, or I could take him to the homeless shelter where you rent a bed by the week, have access to temp jobs and a locker. He took the shelter and his christmas present was 2 weeks paid. I could see that offering a couch was what everyone else had done and it wasn't working, so I offered what might work and I kepup compassion, like buying a backpack at one point or sample size lotions or whatever. He actually got on his feet for a few years, isn't doing so well again but we tried.
For me, in practice, a good hint you are crossing over is the feeling of resentment. That suggests I am doing more than I am able or feeling that it is not effective overall. So that is my first hint to re evaluate my participation in this situation. The process can take time to learn since many of us buddhist types are extra softie people, but I can tell you that being aware of this means I am not overwhelmed and taking it out on the people closest to me such as my family. That is definitely some form of compassion.