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Whitney Houston dead at 48 years old
Aw, I wish there was more info on how she died, but I think that this just happened 40 minutes ago. She was a talented singer and seemed like a beautiful person. RIP Whitney Houston.
http://www.edition.cnn.com/2012/02/11/showbiz/whitney-houston-dead/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
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http://www.edition.cnn.com/2012/02/11/showbiz/whitney-houston-dead/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
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Comments
I hope her passing was at least a peaceful one, and her next rebirth a good one.
These people led rich, privileged luxurious lives, surrounded by an entourage some of which undoubtedly contributed indirectly to their addiction and uiltimate death.
It happened to Michael Jackson, it happened to Amy Whitehouse and it happened now to Whitney.
These people don't need our sympathy once they're gone. They need guidance, protection and rigid discipline while they're alive.
These people subject themselves to the heady influences of weath, fame, and adulation, all of which serve to present an entirely false mode of living. It's artificial, it's tranasitory, it's addictive and ultimately, it can be deadly.
Sad? Yes.
Predictable? On evidence, definitely.
Tragic? No.
Tragic is living in a society that wilfully stands by, while the elderly cannot afford to pay food or heating bills with their meagre pensions, and are subjected to living conditions which fall below what is commonly accepted to be the poverty line, and the Governments of our countries do nothing to distribute assistance to people desperate for help on their own doorsteps, while they live in ways that, were we privvby to their personal lives,m would shock a black cat into being white.
That's tragedy.
Whitney will be remembered for a number of mixed reasons.
The elderly, infirm and frail lady down the street, who was a nurse during WWII and who risked her life behind enemy lines to assist escaped prisoners flee to safety, at great risk to her own life - and who died of the cold and wasn't found for 4 weeks, won't be remembered at all.
Respect where respect is due, but let's put things into perspective.
She was a junkie, alcoholic and subject to physical abuse at the hands of a vicious and sadistic husband.
Plenty of those in all our cities.
The only difference being that she had money, and she sang.
Why would she be more deserving of such posthumous adulation, because of that?
RIP Whitney Huston.
And all those, who follow you, whoever they may be.
Sorry guys, this kind of thing gets my goat, and I bristle at the seriously unbalanced injustice of it all.
But that's just me.
I personally feel for everyone who dies (I don't necessarily feel BAD, unless I know that they were trying to finish something important to them when they died) because I wonder what they are experiencing at that moment. I'll usually think, "I hope you find peace".
I just posted this because I thought that some people may want to know. And like @BonsaiDoug said, everyone deserves compassion; even those who were rich and famous.
The only thing I hate is that the media has to take a break from reporting important news to talk about a celebrity who has died. They don't even stop there, they drag all the horrible bad shit that whitney has gone through and then they add blips of micheal jackson in the mix. . .
They don't talk about the good and bad... just the bad.
The only people I feel bad for is her family who suffered because of her inability to control her addiction. I totally agree with federica above.
We should just move on and let this thread die. I'm sorry ittybittybat. . .but you shouldn't feel bad about someone dying. Feel bad for someone who died without learning how to live while they were alive.
But I'll be honest, that's how I am. I feel bad when people die if they were trying to finish something important to them when they died. I don't feel bad for Whitney's death, I feel for her daughter and family who probably miss her terribly.
And I do agree that the news shouldn't have been talking about it all night (like CNN, MSNBC, and Fox News were), and when they did talk about it, they didn't need to just mention the bad. That's why I changed the channel, because the annoying, shallow-ness of it all kind of got on my nerves.
It's just that tragedy is glorified on tv and this is why i don't watch it.
But I see what you mean, I feel like that too.
One of the phenomenon that both irks and baffles me in our modern society is the spectacle of entertainment stars who made bad personal choice after bad personal choice, then making a spectacle of themselves on television interview shows, begging us for our sympathy and forgiveness...often while they are multimillionaires. Whitney Houston was a rich, spoiled singer who made her own choices...over and over again...while she hung around with other multimillionaires and world leaders. She snorted more dollars worth of cocaine than any one on this forum will earn in their lifetimes.
Is it too bad she died the way she did...not even 50 years of age? Yes, it's too bad. But I'll reserve my sympathy for people who struggle through life and hold themselves responsible for their choices. I'll reserve my sympathy for those who are struggling against cancers, for example, that mostly developed not through bad choices, but simply bad luck or genetics. Or the homeless that have sufficient mental problem that they can't improve their own lives and are spending the cold winter sleeping under bridges. Or the children who are physically and/or sexually abused because they are helpless. Or the millions who are actively trying, but can't find a job. Or those in Syria that are helpless victims of a well-armed military. Or...on and on.
I have seen people say on Buddhist forums, including this one, that Buddhism is about personal responsibility. Okay. I'll save my sympathy and empathy for those who demonstrate personal responsibility. Regrettably, that was not Whitney Houston. It's too bad. What a wasted talent.
And unless I'm sadly mistaken, I'm under the impression that compassion is fundamental to every tradition of Buddhism. I hope I'm not wrong on that account.
Compassion now moves to the living... her friends and family and those who loved her.
"Every tree is known by the fruit that it produces. . . "
We honor her memory and her life and the fact, that it seemed like she was trying to get back on the horse. . . But compassion is not only a feeling but an action. What kind of compassion can she receive now that she is gone and departed from this world?
Compassionate words are kinds and necessary, Compassionate action goes further. . . so that is why I said that Compassion is moved to the family and friends of the dead.
They also excersised little patience for a person who has lived out her drama in the public life. . .
the proverbial "pearls before swine" is an old one, but degrees of compassionate feelings move towards someone who is suffering from addiction without the support that a celebrity would have.
So the posters must be feeling varying degrees of compassion when it comes to the Diva.
..Compared to someone that is struggling with the same addiction but has been able to move above it into a healthier state in their life.
Those, and other such lamentations have, in my personal view, nothing to do with compassion. They are simply empty words and emotions.
For me, compassion is when you actually sacrifice something for an unfortunate person.
Do you spend some hours each week working in a soup kitchen for the homeless? That requires a sacrifice of your time. That shows compassion.
Do you donate funds to various charities that help the homeless, or those who are ill, or those who are living in poverty, etc.? That requires a sacrifice of your money. That shows compassion.
When you are in the supermarket checking out, and you see those little donation slips for the hungry, do you donate $3, $5, or $10? That requires a sacrifice of your money. That shows compassion.
Do you spend time beyond your 40 hours a week to work with child protective services? That requires a sacrifice of your time. That shows compassion.
Do you visit those in prison or jail? That requires a sacrifice of your money. That shows compassion.
There's a huge difference between real compassion and faux compassion.
Anyway, I think you and I are on the same page; just perhaps on different paragraphs.
When we show compassion for those who are struggling with their own demons it helps them feel worthy and capable enough to move beyond their suffering.
But I battled nicotine addiction for nearly a decade and have been clean since 2006...So I remember how hard that was to kick.
I still admire you...for being recovered.
if there is a difference, then that would apply to every single other person afflicted in the same way.....
Taking drugs and drinking alcohol are choices.
these are voluntary actions, pursued by people who initially go looking for a thrill, and are convinced they'll always be able to control it.
how wrong they are.....
From a Buddhist point of view, there is no such thing as an inherently existing choice (I think). Choices, like 'free will', will depend on conditions and causes. A.A. showed me how to create the causes and conditions for me to stop drinking; many of which were counter intuitive. I had to face and deal with the wreckage of my past, I was taught how to live without having to resort to alcohol when things got tough; I was taught how to live comfortably in my own skin without the booze, and lots of other stuff I don't want to bore you with.
But it was a lot more than just making a choice not to drink, because there were times when I had to drink and had no choice in the matter. Or at least that's how it felt like for me.
There is always a choice, and the choice is to either succumb to it or not.
My husband's mother made her choice and died of alcoholism.
His twin sister is doing the same.
he refuses to go down the same route, whatever may befall him...
whatever we do, in response to outside conditions is a choice.
Whatever we do, to what our Mind perceives, is a choice.
all is mind-wrought.
It's up to us to say yes or no. you are incorrect.... Choices are made by judicious study of the 8FP. Right View and Right Intention, with Right Action and Right Effort are what govern our will to make the Right Choice.
Conditions and causes, do not bind us.
Our perceptions, and volitional actions, do.
These were the same options placed before Amy Whitehouse and Whitney Houston.
They chose the alternative.... Then you were either not given the correct options, or you didn't see their availability....
But at one point, you made the right choice....
See, here you are.....
and I'm so glad for it.....
I think it was Shantideva who said that if someone hits you with a stick, it would be silly to blame the stick. Likewise we shouldn't blame the person wielding the stick, but we should blame the ignorance and delusion driving the person who holds the stick.
So in the same vein, blaming an addict/alcoholic for not making the 'choice' to stop drinking isn't right; it's their ignorance and delusion; their mental illness that makes them keep going.
For an alcoholic to stop drinking, causes and conditions have to be put in place. Look at Step 1 in A.A.'s 12 Step program. It begins with, 'We were powerless over alcohol...', this means powerless not only to stop drinking when we started, but powerless to avoid taking that first drink. That was certainly my experience. Yeh, I could stop drinking, but it was like Japanese water torture. I'd just get ground down to a point where I had to drink. I had no choice.
The rest of the Steps create the causes and conditions to enable an alcoholic stay sober.
If it were mere 'choice', I doubt there'd be the millions of alkies in A.A. there is. Do you really think any of us would do what a 12 Step program entails if we could just make the choice and stop drinking? Hell no! Making amends to people I'd harmed wasn't much fun, I promise!! Choices depend on causes and conditions. My experience shows this.
Why don't you choose to be Enlightened, right now? I bet you can't! Why? Because Enlightenment will depend on causes and conditions*. Everything depends on causes and conditions; there is no 'inherently existing' anything, as far as I'm aware, and this will include choices.
Feel free to disagree; everyone is entitled to an opinion; there'll be no hurt feelings here!
*Apologies if you already are, and thank you for reading my post!
the sex & affection you long for is not a choice. it was born into your mind by nature
buddha called these latent pre-dispositions 'anusaya'
only arahants have free will & only arahants have infinite compassion
But isn't the 'judicious study of the 8FP' creating the causes and conditions for better choices? And of course we have to have causes and conditions that allow us to study the 8FP in the first place.
Have I explained this clearly? I'm tired!
My father started drinking when he went in the service during WWII. For the next 30-some years, he drank heavily. I am talking 1 quart of Black Velvet per day at home, and then most evenings he would go out to some of the local hangouts.
But, whenever he would change jobs or assignments, he would stop drinking cold turkey for a month or longer...depending on how soon he felt secure in his new position.
Then, in his mid-50s, he had a massive heart attack and stroke, from which he was told he would not recover. But he did...fully. And the doctor told him that it was very simple: "You drink, you die." He permanently stopped drinking for the remainder of his life. Cold turkey. No help sessions. He just stopped. He still went to the bars to see friends in the evenings, but he just had cokes. At the same time, he stopped smoking -- previously he smoked 3-4 packs per day. Again, cold turkey. No patch. No help sessions. When the doctor eventually told him...at around age 82...that he probably had another year to live (give or take...simple old age), he made a conscious decision to resume smoking, but not drinking, but he smoked less than half a pack per day.
But at some point a real choice was made to use drugs...and a real choice was made to stop.
Who made that choice? Not the "illness."
Thanks for sharing that @vinlyn.
However, she's gone, it was news yesterday, and it's over.
Let's quit bickering about celebrities and addictions and let this thread die, shall we?
Oddly enough, I was thinking about the closing scene from "Judgment At Nuremburg", where Spencer Tracy (the judge) visits Burt Lancaster (the German judge) in prison. Lancaster tries to make Tracy understand why he followed Hitler's orders, and he says that he never believed that it would all come to the millions of dead in the concentration camps, forced sterilizations, etc. But Tracy takes away the German judge's last shred of self-respect: "It came to that the very first time you made the very first sentence in that courtroom."
And so it is with drugs and alcohol. Each CHOICE builds on the last CHOICE.
Namaste
But it would appear that she threw caution to the wind, as ever....allegedly.
Room 434, huh?
The results won't be known for months, but the hotel is going to make a packet out of those wishing to occupy the same room she did... Trust me on this - someone , somewhere is rubbing their hands in glee at the profit they can squeezer out of this.
I have seen where addiction can take people and I would never presume to know what it must be like. Between my father and those I have known with heroin addictions, I can honestly say that it makes people perform in ways that no normal person would. I don't think a non-addict can understand the mind of an addict.
Blame is erroneous and proportioning it useless in my experience.
A relative of mine, who died from alcohol and mixed drug toxicity used to lament ' if only I knew why I was like this".
She was never able to take the first step of admitting that she was powerless over alcohol as no-one could answer her question to her satisfaction.
That doesn't make the problem a disease. What is the definition of disease?
It did not always start as one.
I think substance abuse is a "symptom" of a much rooted problem...not a disease.
@vinlyn his father was an alcoholic, not a drinker.
Perhaps years ago, when he sought help, people had limited resources as we do now to quit. We don't know because we didn't live his life. We also don't now @zombiegirl and her life.
Imo, I see substance abuse as a symptom, or branch to something much, much, deeper. . . While we do have an abundancy of psychologists, self help books, internet forums,meds, and support groups...it was not always so.
...and you would think that with all the help for substance users, the "disease" would be cured...but it seems to me like they just want to "treat " it.
The twelve step program does create an environment of openess and loving kindness.